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Rounding up cattle to the killing of the Jews, Gestapo, rather monumental leap since they were following due process and within their rights. Now why do you suppose they needed guns, just some innocent protestors right.
I agree with you that this isn't a valid comparison but still I would have to ask myself......"I signed up to round up some farmers cows"?
Originally Posted by Goodnight Rounding up cattle to the killing of the Jews, Gestapo, rather monumental leap since they were following due process and within their rights. Now why do you suppose they needed guns, just some innocent protestors right.
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Originally Posted by pknopp
I agree with you that this isn't a valid comparison but still I would have to ask myself......"I signed up to round up some farmers cows"?
Why were my paragraphs ignored. They were separate thoughts, not comparisons. Is it really that hard?
200 men from several agencies is much more than enforcing a court order. The Gestapo were enforcing court orders as they rounded up millions of Jews and killed them.
They were enforcing a difficult court order over square miles of territory while facing an armed and potentially violent protagonists. I would tend to suggest the operation was underplanned and undermanned. They should for instance have removed the cattle as rounded up to Nellis or some such place.
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Would you agree that shooting nearly 100 head of cattle was well within their purview as well? Please defend that one.
Cattle casualties reported as seven known including two bulls which were shot. One of the bulls had a Bundy brand. I don't see why shooting the bulls was needed. Bundy should make a claim.
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They behaved like military thugs let loose on citizens, not like local police. In fact it was the local police standing against them, THANK GOD!
The County Sheriff demonstrated more good sense than anyone. But that was after Bundy raised the level to a very dangerous one.
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What don't you get about abuse of power?
If the masses hadn't risen up against them I'm certain Bundy would probably have been murdered. The thing going high profile screwed up their plans. Now they'll use the courts, again, as they should. Make him pay after he dies, freeze his accounts, do anything; but don't come with automatic weapons and an attitude.
If Bundy simply acted lawfully none of this occurs. The masses raised were absolutely not local. He had no support locally...but they were the lunatic fringe from over much of the country.
So you hold that the appropriate government response to a refusal to obey a court order is to wait until they die and take damages from their estate? How about if the Bundy gang seizes an interchange on I15 and starts collecting a toll? Wait until they all die and collect from their estates?
YOu need to get it into your head. Governing and enforcing the law is sometimes hard and rough. But you do it because the alternative is anarchy. You guys are pulling real strong for anarchy.
"The fact that some geniuses were laughed at does not imply that all who are laughed at are geniuses. They laughed at Columbus, they laughed at Fulton, they laughed at the Wright brothers. But they also laughed at Bozo the Clown."
~ Carl Sagan
Surprised Sagan said something to so void in it's essence with value only as a cheap jab.
Status:
"everybody getting reported now.."
(set 19 days ago)
Location: Pine Grove,AL
29,549 posts, read 16,533,663 times
Reputation: 6032
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp
Practically everything Paul has warned about has come about.
No It hasnt. The only things that have "come about" is what you have chosen to highlight and even most of that was so vague that you could apply it to anything.
Maybe you missed that the BLM also had several snipers ready to shoot those men and women.
The government isn't supposed to aggravate and escalate situations as they did. This is how things like Waco, Ruby Ridge, and Kent State happen. I thought they had learned, but there seems to be a resurgence of jack booted thugs with badges.
I'm not sure how a tyrannical abuse of power can get old. How exactly does that work?
The government was there to round up cattle as agreed in a court order, you are ignoring the fact that militants with guns had already threatened them. You could expect the BLM to carry guns as this was not your normal roundup, they were not ready to shoot anyone just to defend themselves.
When you have a group of extremists like Sheriff Mack and Bundy and CSPOA militants with guns protesting you could expect trouble. The BLM did the right thing by withdrawing from these right wing nuts that were at the heart of other situations, the BLM was not going to assist them in creating more martyrs so they could use this for decades to come. There are plenty of good reasons to fight, protecting a deadbeat rancher is not one of them.
No It hasnt. The only things that have "come about" is what you have chosen to highlight and even most of that was so vague that you could apply it to anything.
Status:
"It Can't Rain All The Time"
(set 26 days ago)
Location: North Pacific
15,754 posts, read 7,590,375 times
Reputation: 2576
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight
They have the authority, maybe some don't like it but there needs to be a certain amount of control, rational people understand the need but the far right thinks we should just have chaos and things will some how work themselves out. People on the honor system never seem to work. So what's the alternative if we did away with all these federal agencies that supposedly don't belong.
The states would need to put on their big boy pants and take the lead in the laws governing their citizens and the federal government stays out of it. Oh and lower fed taxes as their salaries would know longer be needed. I see a win, win.
But then those folks would be out of a job and thrown into the private sector to either find a job or start a business. With the U.S. Government being the number one employer in the U.S. they'd be faced with a challenge, just like the rest of the citizens, not on Government payroll. Yeah, wow, that would suck.
Status:
"everybody getting reported now.."
(set 19 days ago)
Location: Pine Grove,AL
29,549 posts, read 16,533,663 times
Reputation: 6032
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp
Nearly everything.
Again not even close.
If Ron Paul predicted the sky will fall and then you saw a meteor shower, you would say it came true, LOL
Ok, im joking there, but you get my point.
He makes alot of vague comments that can be interpreted to mean just about anything.
And to the point, the BLM does have authority over the land, someone not willing to recognize that authority doesnt mean they dont have it.
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With the U.S. Government being the number one employer in the U.S. they'd be faced with a challenge, just like the rest of the citizens, not on Government payroll. Yeah, wow, that would suck.
