Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Burden of proof is on you since you do not want to provide any evidence just spew your opinions without facts. Like I said before min wage has not been risen high enough to pull people out of poverty since prices has substantially grown much bigger then wages. If min wage was $9-10 it would put people above poverty. But you do not want to hear that right you will probably just start complaining how people are not worth that that much or businesses can not afford it. Why would a business owner pay more maybe because they care about their employee not just themsleves or they knew paying more will put more money in the hands of someone who will spend it. The real issue is you and people like you just do not want to help the poor or see the poor get any help
Where did you get the idea that the role of the Minimum Wage is to pull people out of poverty. Minimum wage is NOT for people who are breadwinners for a family, but for summer jobs, and post-retirement gigs. That fact that so many people have failed to do what is necessary to provide for their own needs (including voting for people who know how, and want to, have a strong economy), is irrelevant. A job is worth only what it is worth regardless if it is done by a high schooler as a summer job, or a parent with 4 kids. The job, in the market of supply and demand, determines the wage, NOT the needs of any particular job holder.
If it were, we would base pay on needs, and that's Marxism, and we know that is one huge bust right out of the starting blocks.
That is great that you did I applaud you for that but just because you did does not prove anyone can.
Too bad, they have to, one way or another, or suffer the consequences. It is THEIR life, and society is not here to adopt them. With Freedom comes responsibility.
You mean how has min wage helped the poor I agree with you it has not because it has not been raise to match inflation.
So you admit that minimum wage hasn't helped the poor but you support raising it to help the poor. And you don't see a problem with that chain of logic?
I'm going to post this one more time, because apparently someone hasn't read it:
Raising the minimum wage won't lift minimum wage earners out of poverty because minimum wage is the minimum wage that can be legally paid. The majority of market items are not priced to be affordable to the lowest common denominator, they are priced to be affordable to the people who make the median wage. This is how the market works. Now, let's say we raise the minimum wage to $15 per hour. Within a couple of years, not only the market for goods but also the labor market will correct themselves to the new standard. People who currently make xx% over minimum wage will, as the market corrects itself, be making $15 per hour + xx%. This means that the new median wage is going to be higher than it is now, and minimum wage is still going to be the absolute minimum that you can legally be paid. The prices of goods will adjust upward to once again be affordable to those making the median wage. In other words, people making minimum wage will be unable to afford items that are priced to be affordable to people that make more than they do. This has happened every single time the minimum wage has been raised.
Matching the minimum wage to inflation is not the answer, either. The only thing that you will accomplish by doing so is to set up a vicious cycle that will keep both the market for goods and services and the labor market in a state of perpetual turmoil as the minimum wage goes up so the price of goods goes up so the minimum wage goes up so the price of goods goes up, ad infinitum. Further, we already have a problem with businesses fleeing to off-shore locations because business costs - of which labor is a fairly noticeable chunk - are too high in the United States. Do you really think that doubling labor costs is going to improve that situation? What we should be doing is encouraging manufacturing to come back to the United States before the only jobs we are left with are minimum wage service and fast food jobs.
The only workable solution to the problem of low wage earners is education and improvement of marketable skills. Government interference in the market is not the answer.
Now, since you refuse to educate yourself, I'm going to share a tidbit of information with you.
Have you noticed that even though the minimum wage has been in existence since 1938, those arguing for raising it keep referencing 1968 in their arguments? That's because 1968 gives them the best numbers. True, if minimum wage had been tied to inflation starting in 1968, it would be substantially higher than it is today. However, if minimum wage had been tied to inflation since it started in 1938, it would only be slightly above $4 per hour. Why? Because inflation goes up and down in waves, and had the minimum wage been tied to inflation it would never have gotten the huge increase that it got in 1968. So, the next time someone talks about tying minimum wage to inflation, remember that the working poor would be in much more dire straits now than they are if that had happened from the beginning.
Where did you get the idea that the role of the Minimum Wage is to pull people out of poverty. Minimum wage is NOT for people who are breadwinners for a family, but for summer jobs, and post-retirement gigs. That fact that so many people have failed to do what is necessary to provide for their own needs (including voting for people who know how, and want to, have a strong economy), is irrelevant. A job is worth only what it is worth regardless if it is done by a high schooler as a summer job, or a parent with 4 kids. The job, in the market of supply and demand, determines the wage, NOT the needs of any particular job holder.
If it were, we would base pay on needs, and that's Marxism, and we know that is one huge bust right out of the starting blocks.
When there are more and more who are forced to work minimum wage or barely above it (because of the jobs that were created post-recession/depression vs jobs lost.) The problem is for more and more minimum wage has been forced to become the breadwinners. I don't think minimum wage workers want to be the breadwinners.
When there are more and more who are forced to work minimum wage or barely above it (because of the jobs that were created post-recession/depression vs jobs lost.) The problem is for more and more minimum wage has been forced to become the breadwinners. I don't think minimum wage workers want to be the breadwinners.
Shall we artificially reduce the price of gasoline for them as well?
Don't you mean to say that "Breadwinners don't want to be Minimum Wage Workers?
Are you saying that every person that isn't a millionaire, or works for a salary, is making a poverty wage?
No one is opposed to raising wages. It's the "raising wages BY FORCE" that is being opposed.
Who is raising wages by force? This is what baffles me, you talk about patriotism and the american way and free market, supply and demand etc etc. But *****, moan and complain about it. We are a Republic, we elect our public officials to represent us, in representing us they did pass min wage, in exerciseing our right to vote and freedoms we voted in Obama. So whats the problem? If your tired of being fored to pay min wage (your words) then please use your right to use citzenship ballet measures and repeal it.
No im saying compared to the wealth in this country and who has the wealth (thru wealth distribution) its safe to say that 80% of us when it comes to wages are dipping from that 11% of available wealth. Any argument
Shall we artificially reduce the price of gasoline for them as well?
Don't you mean to say that "Breadwinners don't want to be Minimum Wage Workers?
OMG! stop. Can you be more classist? We already artificially reduce prices. What do you think tax breaks for corporation and corporate incentive are for? Can't control that they take advantage of us and use all that to pay there CEOs 35 million + bonuses or accumulate enough wealth to be worth over 100+ billion dollars. I just don't understand you guys, why is this exceptable to do that for the top 20% but not the rest of us? Can't you see that this is also wealth redistribution?
Last edited by hawaiian by heart; 05-27-2014 at 11:22 AM..
Shall we artificially reduce the price of gasoline for them as well?
Don't you mean to say that "Breadwinners don't want to be Minimum Wage Workers?
Yes because we all know the gas tax is a truly regressive tax that hurts the middle class and lower however that is a supply/demand thing that is brought up on speculation as much as true supply.
As for the red, it's both ways. The minimum wage workers don't want to be the one to bring in the most money into the family. Imagine you work barely 30 hours in a week at $8.00 an hour and that is the most income because your partner (wife/husband) is working $7.50 for 20 hours a week. Can you honestly tell me you want to be the breadwinner like that or by default because your partner can't work?
I don't argue that min wage will help people overcome poverty, it won't! What offends me is why is it alway a double standard or not ok to raise the wealth of middle class or poor workers? We are obviously very generous with the wealthy?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
