Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 07-06-2014, 06:00 PM
 
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
10,202 posts, read 7,919,184 times
Reputation: 4561

Advertisements

The subject comes about as a result of a discussion in another thread.

How realistic is it to have a national, or even regional, rescue plan?

Take the incidence of a deer being hit in a remote area, such as between Valemount and Blue River, BC.

Those two villages have a total of 800 people in them. One can assume 2.3 people/household, meaning roughly 350 households.

Assuming their tax rates are what people pay in big cities, say 4500/year, that is a maximum of $1,575,000 available for roads, other infrastructure, police, fire, ambulance, public works, garbage pickup, water treatment, sewage and ancillary municipal services.

A 4x4 truck, which you need in these areas, and they need to be a 3/4 ton or 1 ton, cost a minimum of $40,000. I priced these out using my postal code as T8N0B9 when asked.
2015 Ford SuperDuty: Build and Price | Ford

They need to be equipped with winches, roll bars and radios. The personal need firearms and your medical supply kit. Now, a moose gets hit, so do you think one person can load it?

Ooopss... now we need to increase our budget because we will call one of the other personal in on overtime. Oh, and we need gas to feed the trucks. And maintenance, because they will be spending a lot of time off road or on poor roads. We are at $250,000 without blinking an eye, because we have not included employee benefits yet, which run about 22% if your a government employee on defined pensions.

So, 50,000 x1.22 = 61000/per employee. We know we need 5 to fullfil that one position. Darn, just that is 305,000 dollars. Our original budget is shot to hell already.

The truck will need to be replaced every 3 years or 100,000 miles.

So, truck cost (at the very, very low end) with equipment, on a fleet deal, is 40,000. Assume a residual value of 15,000 after being beat up for 3 years, is a net cost of 25,000/3= 8333/ year.

Gas to operate assuming 33333 miles per year assuming 15 miles/gallon at 4.00/ gallon (it's actually higher in Canada, but let's go with that) = 8900 for gas. Don't forget when it is -30 those trucks will have to idle a lot to keep them running.

You better factor in maintenance at 15% of cost = 6000 per year.

So far we have:
People = 305,000
Vehicle costs = 23,233
Office costs? = 15,000

Total about 340,000/ year.

That would absorb 21% of an already small municipal budget.

Back to our 800 people paying big city level of taxes. Of the 1.575 million, that is paying for all their current services (not at cadillac levels I can assure you, I have been there), how many do you think can afford a 21% increase in their taxes?

Where is this money suppose to come from? What services should they give up? Policing? Fire? Water?

BTW, Valemont property tax revenue for 2014 budget is 620,000. Blue River will be less (could not find it online). So my 1.575 million is way too high. It would probably be closer to 900,000.

Does anyone really think such a plan is workable, considering those two village would be responsible for 10's of thousands of square miles? Because it was exactly that area that I had to dispatch that deer.

Does anyone really think those two communities can afford over a 1/3 of their property taxes going to fulfill one new service such as a wild animal rescue service?

I see no way how anyone could suggest it is realistic. Just saying, "We need to find a way" is not good enough. The answer of HOW needs to be answered if it should even be contemplated.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 07-06-2014, 07:29 PM
 
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
10,202 posts, read 7,919,184 times
Reputation: 4561
Sorry all, this thread got moved on me.

There is an animal rights advocate on another sub-forum who figures we should have zoos, or fish and wildlife, or vets come out on any road injured animal, and rather than euthanize it, give it shots so its pain goes away, and get it to a treatment center.

She lives in woo-woo land, and I'm just trying to put some figures and sense into her.

She will probably never see this thread. You might recognize her though, she looks something like this:

Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-06-2014, 07:33 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
36,853 posts, read 17,356,148 times
Reputation: 14459
The plot thickens...
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-06-2014, 07:34 PM
 
3,216 posts, read 2,230,516 times
Reputation: 1224
Where I live, if the deer that is hit is too badly hurt, someone shoots it then we all help to move it to the side of the road. Problem solved, no expense.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-06-2014, 07:35 PM
 
45,217 posts, read 26,427,822 times
Reputation: 24970
Health care is a right







For Bambi
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-06-2014, 07:36 PM
 
3,216 posts, read 2,230,516 times
Reputation: 1224
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frank DeForrest View Post
Health care is a right







For Bambi
Bwhahaha!!!
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-06-2014, 11:31 PM
 
Location: In a little house on the prairie - literally
10,202 posts, read 7,919,184 times
Reputation: 4561
Quote:
Originally Posted by toryturner View Post
Where I live, if the deer that is hit is too badly hurt, someone shoots it then we all help to move it to the side of the road. Problem solved, no expense.
Yeah, she got all butt hurt when I told her about a deer I found injured, and I had to dispatch it with a hatchet, as it was all I had.

Then she went into this rampage about we as taxpayers should fund animal obamacare (my words, not hers).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-06-2014, 11:36 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
36,853 posts, read 17,356,148 times
Reputation: 14459
Quote:
Originally Posted by toryturner View Post
Where I live, if the deer that is hit is too badly hurt, someone shoots it then we all help to move it to the side of the road. Problem solved, no expense.
California law prohibits folks from eating roadkill.

Otherwise you'd be set with some deer jerky.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-07-2014, 12:31 AM
 
Location: Wasilla, Alaska
17,823 posts, read 23,447,554 times
Reputation: 6541
In Alaska approximately 350 to 400 moose are killed by vehicle every year around the Anchorage area. The meat is harvested by volunteers and given to homeless shelters.

Anyone who is not licensed and registered with the State of Alaska to rescue wildlife, faces steep fines if they are found to have wildlife in their custody. It is also illegal to feed the wildlife in Alaska.

Whenever there is a problem with the wildlife in Alaska, we relocate the tourist causing the problem.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 07-07-2014, 01:41 AM
 
34,278 posts, read 19,364,321 times
Reputation: 17261
We do in fact have such a plan. It involves police officers using their weapons to dispatch animals humanely. Civilians are generally welcome to help as well.

Maybe someday it will be economical or reasonable to take a more controlled approach to such things, but I suspect thats 100+ years away, and then will be decided by AI systems that will either dispatch the animal on site, or rescue it based upon population levels, and injury estimations. And even that assumes that some of our technologies dont advance further. Any sufficiently advanced technology will appear to be magic.

Til then, we will make judgement calls on quality of life and probability of survival for injured creatures. Why is this even a topic?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top