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Specifically, how do they initiate it? What do you define as "initiating"? Not having dinner ready on time? Initiating a discussion about the relationship? Yelling? What constitutes "initiating a domestic violence exchange"?
Im not understanding what you mean by "Specifically, how do they initiate it? "....what part of initiate domestic violence dont you understand?....domestic violence is just what it sounds like domestic violence (physical assault)...whatever word games or semantics u seem to be intent on getting into doesnt really apply here.
Im not understanding what you mean by "Specifically, how do they initiate it? "....what part of initiate domestic violence dont you understand?....domestic violence is just what it sounds like domestic violence (physical assault)...whatever word games or semantics u seem to be intent on getting into doesnt really apply here.
Not always. I once spoke to a guy at the courthouse that was awaiting his hearing on a DV "assault by fear". According to him, all he did was yanked the phone cord out of the wall. I think its a valid question. Ones idea of initiating DV could be physical assault where anothers something as benign being late or burning dinner.
Slapping and hitting. I've been hit by multiple women. One hit me so hard I had to fight the urge to tag her back.
Are you seriously the type that thinks all women are non aggressive angels? It has been my experience that women KNOW they likely won't face consequences for throwing a drink in a guys face, slapping him, or otherwise letting their anger or aggression out in a physical manner.
Not always. I once spoke to a guy at the courthouse that was awaiting his hearing on a DV "assault by fear". According to him, all he did was yanked the phone cord out of the wall. I think its a valid question. Ones idea of initiating DV could be physical assault where anothers something as benign being late or burning dinner.
Could be...I know the research ive read is pretty clear in specifying that theyre talking about initiating physical violence, which not too many rational people would get confused with burning the grits, or forgetting to put the cap back on the mustard or whatever else...although someone exploding over these types of things is possible, I dont think this is what the statisticians are speaking of when they report their findings.. and in my opinion, to keep implying that this sort of thing is what they are referring to trivializes both their research efforts and the seriousness of domestic violence.
Last edited by soletaire; 07-21-2014 at 02:30 PM..
Could be...I know the research ive read is pretty clear in specifying that theyre talking about initiating physical violence, which not too many rational people would get confused with burning the grits, or forgetting to put the cap back on the mustard or whatever else...although someone exploding over these types of things is possible, I dont think this is what the statisticians are speaking of when they report their findings.. and in my opinion, to keep implying that this sort of thing is what they are referring to trivializes both their research efforts and the seriousness of domestic violence.
I'm aware, but it was a ligit question.
My question is what is MRA doing about it. Most of what I have seen on the web about MRA is negative. Their tactics seem to be bashing women instead of actually doing anything positive to raise awareness, or change attitudes about the double standards. Legally men are covered under the law. The same domestic violence/assault laws that protect women also apply to men. It seems to me that it is men who holding each other down.
My question is what is MRA doing about it. Most of what I have seen on the web about MRA is negative. Their tactics seem to be bashing women instead of actually doing anything positive to raise awareness, or change attitudes about the double standards. Legally men are covered under the law. The same domestic violence/assault laws that protect women also apply to men. It seems to me that it is men who holding each other down.
Idk...i think it was a bit of a diversionary strawman question from the outset...at best i would consider it a legit question that had already been answered by the researchers themselves before the question was asked...i think it was mostly supposed to represent a symbolic challenge of an idea that he already didnt want to believe despite research showing otherwise. I think there was a hefty dose of willfull ignorance going on there employed under the guise of challenging research methodology/implying flawed methodology etcetera....it happens alot across the soft sciences..
However I cant tell u whether these MRAs are onto something or not...but i started noticing that this has become the kneejerk response to everything men express concern about nowdays...a man could say he wishes it wasnt raining today, and the response is typically "well the only one he has to blame is himself/other men"
this, to me is a way for society to remain passive in any effort to give serious consideration some of their concerns...thats how ive always seen it at least.
Idk...i think it was a bit of a diversionary strawman question from the outset...at best i would consider it a legit question that had already been answered by the researchers themselves before the question was asked...i think it was mostly supposed to represent a symbolic challenge of an idea that he already didnt want to believe despite research showing otherwise. I think there was a hefty dose of willfull ignorance going on there employed under the guise of challenging research methodology/implying flawed methodology etcetera....it happens alot across the soft sciences..
However I cant tell u whether these MRAs are onto something or not...but i started noticing that this has become the kneejerk response to everything men express concern about nowdays...a man could say he wishes it wasnt raining today, and the response is typically "well the only one he has to blame is himself/other men"
this, to me is a way for society to remain passive in any effort to give serious consideration some of their concerns...thats how ive always seen it at least.
I think that is a cop out.
He does have himself to blame in that "he" is not doing anything constructive to change the situation.
Of course society is passive when the issue at hand does not directly or indirectly affect them. If those not directly affected do not take an active role why would you expect others to? No group in the past has been able to take a totally passive stance on their grievances and just expect society to make everything alright.
I think that is a cop out.
He does have himself to blame in that "he" is not doing anything constructive to change the situation.
Of course society is passive when the issue at hand does not directly or indirectly affect them. If those not directly affected do not take an active role why would you expect others to? No group in the past has been able to take a totally passive stance on their grievances and just expect society to make everything alright.
Yeah...that was kinda my whole point really...the questioning of the research methodology itself (despite the fact that enough data has been compiled to give a concise picture of how they were measuring the data) was in this instance a cop out. Its usually a strawman stance people take when they cant debate or disprove statistical data...anyway this thread isnt about who does what about whatever copout people accuse me or men of using in order to deflect any responsibility they may have to seriously consider their grievances....it seemed to just be a thread questioning whether MRAs have a point or not ...if people think they do, then great...im sure MRAs wouldnt mind if they pitched in...
if people dont think they (MRAs) have any salient points, i think thats fine too, and they should say so and politely move along...unless one has their own agenda to actively supress the rights of others to voice their concerns, in my opinion, this doesnt seem like the website to sit around baiting people to convince us that their causes have merit...those sites exist, but this doesnt seem like one..so my point was that the misnomer that men commit more domestic violence than women, by statistical measures is a farce, that is, if we take it at face value as we do nearly all other statistical data, incuding the data that finds that men commit more violence than women in general. Because in mt opinion, once we get into trying to pick apart the research methodology, just to disprove its findings, then it begins to set in motion the equally pointless chicken vs. Egg see sawing that these discussions get so muddled in. All it takes in for one similarly inane person to ask: "duh, well how do we know that they werent referring to noogies given when they compile statistics used to research incidents of rape or assault " and so on..
Last edited by soletaire; 07-22-2014 at 12:24 PM..
While I have never had much use for Femi-Nazis, I have always supported womens rights. I think men in many instances do get the short end of the stick, but there are certain advantages in our society of being a man as well.. I think everyone needs to accept what they are and stop whining and crying about things that are trivial at best. A lot of what both groups advocate are childish.
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