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Old 08-24-2014, 07:32 AM
 
1,152 posts, read 1,273,952 times
Reputation: 923

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Quote:
Originally Posted by bUU View Post
You're not reading what you're replying to. I already said the argument is over and so all that's left is seeing how long you're going to sit there trying to rationalize the indefensible - how long you're going to make up childish retorts and try to squirm out of being accountable for the self-centered perspective you support. What abortion of "logic" gave you the idea that that has anything to do with abandoning anything. It's a matter of not allowing the vacuous self-centeredness to be promoted with impunity.

You advocate for self-centeredness.

It's immoral.

What part of that didn't you understand?

What makes you think that spewing back-handed insults about where you claim I live and what you claim the state of my marriage is does anything other than reinforce the condemnation of your ridiculously egoistic claptrap? The willingness to spew such childish insinuations to try to distract attention away from the righteous condemnation of what they advocate for is a clear indication that corruption is supported only with corruption - juvenile, self-centered corruption.
Yes, you'll find people often just skim screeds like yours. You say the same thing over and over, in largely the same words, and become tiresome. I debate, you do not.

Since I see a trifle of something new here I will address that.

"You advocate for self-centeredness.

It's immoral.

What part of that didn't you understand?"


I advocate for efficiency and practicality in government.

You call this self-centered and immoral but provide no rationale to back it up.

Here I will provide a quick rationale of my thinking:

I have observed that there are inevitable limits on the capabilities of human endeavors - we might want to feed everyone, but we cannot afford to do so indefinitely, and so must make practical decisions on who to help for how long. Making that help as efficient as possible allows us to do the most within the limits of our resources.

What part of that did you not understand?

As for the backhanded insults, you will find that people often return the attitude you present to them. When you make no effort at plain good manners they reply in kind. I believe I've said that to you before, along with many of these other points and all those examples you ignore that could lead to an interesting and substantive debate.
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Old 08-24-2014, 08:48 AM
 
30,024 posts, read 18,600,956 times
Reputation: 20808
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo45 View Post
Is it finally time that we ask the increasingly obvious question, namely…
Has the G.O.P. Gone Off the Deep End?

Or as Mike Lofgren, a staff member for 16 years on the Republican side of both the House and Senate Budget Committees, writes…
"The Republican Party is becoming less and less like a traditional political party in a representative democracy and becoming more like an apocalyptic cult, or one of the intensely ideological authoritarian parties of 20th century Europe."

And is this really such a preposterous question, when over 40% of Republicans are still "Birthers", and over a third actually believe the POTUS is a muslim? And that's not even counting all the ones who think Obama is an alien lizard, the anti-christ, hell-bent on "turning the U.S. into a 3rd world country", etc.! And if all that doesn't qualify as "insane", then what does?

BTW, here's "Exhibit B", seriously, from none other than former GOP Prez. candidate, Newt Gingrich…
"What if [Obama] is so outside our comprehension, that only if you understand Kenyan, anti-colonial behavior, can you begin to piece together [his actions]?" Gingrich asked. "That is the most accurate, predictive model for his behavior."

Obama's Citizenship - July 2014 Rasmussen Poll
If insanity is embracing common sense and trying to restore our borders, fiscal sanity, and US manufacturing, then the conservatives have gone insane.
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Old 08-24-2014, 09:21 AM
 
Location: Florida
23,795 posts, read 13,215,255 times
Reputation: 19952
Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye2009 View Post
If insanity is embracing common sense and trying to restore our borders, fiscal sanity, and US manufacturing, then the conservatives have gone insane.
So why didn't they do that during the years 2000-08 when they had the WH instead of spending trillions invading countries and destabilizing the mideast? Guess they only have common sense in their armchairs when a Dem is in office.
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Old 08-24-2014, 06:34 PM
 
Location: Laurentia
5,580 posts, read 7,980,431 times
Reputation: 2442
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
Guess they only have common sense in their armchairs when a Dem is in office.
The least we can do is encourage them when they are sane. That can only be positive.
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Old 08-25-2014, 03:38 AM
bUU
 
Location: Florida
12,077 posts, read 10,679,221 times
Reputation: 8798
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosopis View Post
Yes, you'll find people often just skim screeds like yours.
And yours. They'll see the inherently myopically self-centered aspect of what you support and pass right by. The danger is that a few individuals might actually give the petulantly callous and uncaring claptrap you post some consideration. It is useful to have a means by which they can recognize the smell as immorality even if it doesn't dissuade them from entering the echo chamber.
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Old 08-25-2014, 06:37 AM
 
1,152 posts, read 1,273,952 times
Reputation: 923
Quote:
Originally Posted by bUU View Post
And yours. They'll see the inherently myopically self-centered aspect of what you support and pass right by. The danger is that a few individuals might actually give the petulantly callous and uncaring claptrap you post some consideration. It is useful to have a means by which they can recognize the smell as immorality even if it doesn't dissuade them from entering the echo chamber.
There was plenty of material to which you could respond with an argument of substance in my last post, and yet again you fail to do so. You're not here for intelligent discussion, you are just here to vent your bile.

I still find you amusing, however You provide a clear example of the worst aspects of the liberal mindset which allows me to provide a clear example of a GOP supporter who is anything but insane, responding with reasonable arguments that you ignore. The really funny part is that you just keep doing it, apparently oblivious of the damage you do to your own stated position
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Old 08-25-2014, 09:59 AM
 
Location: On the "Left Coast", somewhere in "the Land of Fruits & Nuts"
8,854 posts, read 10,431,904 times
Reputation: 6670
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosopis View Post
You are quite correct that the media is anything but unified in voice, and still has many reporters and columnists who make an effort to be fair and impartial. I find that number to have shrunk in my lifetime, but that may just be cynicism.

I don't really follow you on the creationists. Try explaining yourself clearly without the snark.

My point was that for all the genuine nuts we have - Broun being an example - we also have a lot of normal, evidence based, clear thinkers. I will be happy to provide you with examples should you not know any of them, but given your proclivity for quoting Republicans saying things with which you agree, I can only assume your blindness to common sense in the GOP is a choice you've made.

Why focus on some of the nuttier members of your political foes? Because it provides you with a nice excuse to never, ever compromise. The right does the same thing for the very same reason - they draw attention to corrupt guys like Blagojevich, idiots like Hank Johnson, and gun controlers who clearly do not understand the simple mechanics of what they attempt to regulate.

The point to have taken away was not that I'm willing to overlook some of the nuttier behavior in the GOP - I do that with the Dem's too, trying to criticize the substantial stuff, not the nutty stuff. The point to take away was that there is plenty of foolishness to be found in both parties and that anyone fixating on it in just one party is indulging in a skewed view of our political reality.
If you wanna have a serious discussion, then quit 'tap-dancing' around the issue. No one's suggesting that all conservatives or Republicans are nutters, only that the "number" has escalated to the point that it's arguably become a "problem" (at least if polling is to be believed that it's also now the perception of the general public, including about a third of Republicans)!

And casually dismissing every example of "wackos" as simply an "outlier", doesn't answer the question… namely how many of these types do you have, and how many other conservatives have to say something about it, before it's a recognized "problem"? Like for example, when over 40% of the GOP still believe the POTUS isn't a citizen (and roughly a third still think he's a muslim)?!! BTW, which does not make for a "credible" opposition party, an essential tool in any democracy.

Of course if you believe those kinda 'wacko' things too, then I suppose the issue of what's "normal" is a moot point.
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Old 08-25-2014, 10:49 AM
 
1,152 posts, read 1,273,952 times
Reputation: 923
Quote:
Originally Posted by mateo45 View Post
If you wanna have a serious discussion, then quit 'tap-dancing' around the issue. No one's suggesting that all conservatives or Republicans are nutters, only that the "number" has escalated to the point that it's arguably become a "problem" (at least if polling is to be believed that it's also now the perception of the general public, including about a third of Republicans)!

And casually dismissing every example of "wackos" as simply an "outlier", doesn't answer the question… namely how many of these types do you have, and how many other conservatives have to say something about it, before it's a recognized "problem"? Like for example, when over 40% of the GOP still believe the POTUS isn't a citizen (and roughly a third still think he's a muslim)?!! BTW, which does not make for a "credible" opposition party, an essential tool in any democracy.

Of course if you believe those kinda 'wacko' things too, then I suppose the issue of what's "normal" is a moot point.
That is the irony of this thread - if there are indeed now so many nutters in the GOP that it is a "problem" then what are the Democrats so worried about? Let me put it another way - for whom would this even be a problem? The GOP.

The manner in which you started this thread in the first place indicates to me that you don't really think the bulk of the GOP is made up of nutters - I think you wish to reinforce that impression by talking about what nutters they are, and having people like bUU chime in and build on it. That is why the obvious reply is to point out that there remain huge numbers of sane people involved in GOP politics and voting, and that the Dems have plenty of idiots of their own.

That same survey from which you got those statistics also found that 24% of Democrats and 29% of non-affiliated voters felt that the government knew about 9/11. I believe that was mentioned earlier in this thread, and one of your faithful brethren chimed in with "yeah, but that one is true!". Maybe that was you, I can't remember. Either way, its a perfect example of how nuttiness spans the parties when it comes to voters.

I will take you at your word though, that this problem is a problem for all because the opposition party is not viable as a result of it, and observe the following:

Many people dismiss the influence of the press on the credibility of the GOP, saying that this is a tired old myth (yes, we did just discuss this a few posts back). I tend to believe it because I am a very contrary voter - I tend not to agree with whoever is in power. When Bush was in office I tended to seek out opposition news sources, and once Obama was elected I found them to be overly "ra-ra, pull for the home team" and had to switch to Fox. The opposition press is vastly more interesting than the sympathetic one, because they are free to tell the truth - the sympathetic press has to tone it down out of worry over the fallout. Next time we get a Republican Prez, I'll quickly switch back to opposition news sources as Fox will be pulling for their guy again.

Its also much of the reason that the liberal media loves covering those creationist whackos and Fox loves running stories about the latest offense against christians (I ignore both kinds of stories, but usually do see the headlines). People love to read this kind of crap, especially when if reinforces what they want to think anyway - either that all GOP'ers are creationist whackos or all Dems are atheists stomping on devout christians. Neither is true, but both sure get the hits and sell ad space.

So if you really want to worry about the "problem" of credibility in the opposition, you should look at the press, not the parties.

Personally, I still think you and a lot of others here just want to revel in comparing just how whacko all the GOP'ers are. That is just an inference drawn from your tone and choice of words, nothing more. It may not be correct, but it is the impression you give.
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Old 08-25-2014, 10:55 AM
 
4,571 posts, read 3,513,301 times
Reputation: 3261
Quote:
Originally Posted by prosopis View Post
There was plenty of material to which you could respond with an argument of substance in my last post, and yet again you fail to do so. You're not here for intelligent discussion, you are just here to vent your bile.

I still find you amusing, however You provide a clear example of the worst aspects of the liberal mindset which allows me to provide a clear example of a GOP supporter who is anything but insane, responding with reasonable arguments that you ignore. The really funny part is that you just keep doing it, apparently oblivious of the damage you do to your own stated position
Yup. The real "insanity" is demonstrated in forums like this one by the leftwing nutcases that populate them. Honestly, they're not worth engaging; just laughing at.
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Old 08-25-2014, 10:59 AM
 
69,368 posts, read 64,001,245 times
Reputation: 9383
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
So why didn't they do that during the years 2000-08 when they had the WH instead of spending trillions invading countries
I'm sorry you didnt hear the people moaning over Bush's $200B deficits. Maybe you were too busy trying to figure out how you were going to blame Republicans for Obamas/Democrats, $1T ones..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
and destabilizing the mideast?
I cant believe anyone would even post that, and then expect to be taken seriously
Quote:
Originally Posted by Enigma777 View Post
Guess they only have common sense in their armchairs when a Dem is in office.
Guess you only listen to the other side when they are attacking yourside for doing things 5x as dumb
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