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Old 12-29-2007, 05:46 PM
 
19,198 posts, read 31,411,057 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boiseguy View Post
change happens.. its just a matter of time... its painful for some.. and a blessing for others.. but in the end.. life goes on... as it will when marriage and rights are equal for all citizens...
Exactly...eventually the upstream-swimmers tire, and the day is siezed by those who go with the inexorable flow...
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Old 12-29-2007, 07:19 PM
 
17,290 posts, read 29,333,101 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silas777 View Post
My beliefs are probably as solid if not more so as yours are, so it is not likely that I am out seeking opinion or information, It has always been clear to me from a non religious viewpoint and that much more so from a christian viewpoint.
With all due respect, if you have no first hand knowledge AS a homosexual or bisexual, your "beliefs" are just that - beliefs.

First hand knowledge of whether or not an individual "chose" their homosexual orientation is beyond a belief. It's a fact.

You are telling someone that what they have PERSONALLY experienced MUST be false because of something you merely believe. That doesn't make any sense at all. It would be like me saying I don't believe Jews who say they went through the holocaust because I BELIEVE something like that would never happen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by silas777
I would say that the homosexual community likes to paint a picture of hate , bigotry and discrimination from conservatives in general and christians specifically but I dont feel or see a big offensive taking place it is more a defensive stance on the part of the right.
Religious conservatives are at the forefront of EVERYTHING anti-homosexual. Even people who are "grossed out" by homosexuality and wouldn't agree with things like gay marriage for non-religious reasons tend to not be motivated enough to say, start a petition drive against it, or set up numerous "watchdog" websites to track and "report on all things homo" (ya know, SOMEBODY has to watch all that gay porn, gay street fair sex and gay pride parades for the rest of the straight world so that the "straight" world can know what's apparently being "shoved in their faces!")


Quote:
Originally Posted by silas777
I think most christians might feel as I do that there always has been homosexuality and there always will, and do not crusade against it, but when you start pushing for it to be accepted and promoted. People will stand against it. That doesnt = hate!
In Florida, Baptists worked to get a ballot initiative on the 2008 ballot. This initiative would outlaw gay marriage AND gay civil unions through the state constitution, despite the fact that it's already outlawed by statute.

"Accept" the fact that not everyone shares the religious, social communist point of view of the "proper" and "only" ways to live as a human being and citizen.

Nobody is "promoting" homosexuality, again, because every homosexual knows you can't CHOOSE to be homosexual. It's why it's such a big joke amongst gays about the idea that you can "recruit" more gays.
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Old 12-29-2007, 08:15 PM
 
9,878 posts, read 10,791,117 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
With all due respect, if you have no first hand knowledge AS a homosexual or bisexual, your "beliefs" are just that - beliefs.

First hand knowledge of whether or not an individual "chose" their homosexual orientation is beyond a belief. It's a fact.

You are telling someone that what they have PERSONALLY experienced MUST be false because of something you merely believe. That doesn't make any sense at all. It would be like me saying I don't believe Jews who say they went through the holocaust because I BELIEVE something like that would never happen.


.
Yeah, I see what your saying, It would be like if some one told a Christian they didnt believe that they could be born again, even though they have no first hand knowledge, but for the christian it is "beyond a belief it is a fact." I guess your right! You convinced me, thank you for helping me understand!
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Old 12-29-2007, 08:21 PM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 17,324,960 times
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To chime in here. It is NOT a fact that people are born into homosexuality. it is a THEORY, just as it is a THEORY that some psychologist believe it is because of social factors that people become homosexual.
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Old 12-29-2007, 08:25 PM
 
17,290 posts, read 29,333,101 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
To chime in here. It is NOT a fact that people are born into homosexuality. it is a THEORY, just as it is a THEORY that some psychologist believe it is because of social factors that people become homosexual.
Regardless, it's not a "choice!"
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Old 12-29-2007, 08:30 PM
 
Location: Boise
4,426 posts, read 5,906,960 times
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exactly... its not a choice... gay children are a product of a straight society.... whether it be born that way, or socially fostered, or whatever. all I know is I knew I was gay from a very young age... so loath me and others like me all you want for making a "choice" but realize even by your justifications, that we are a product of your society....
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Old 12-29-2007, 09:25 PM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 17,324,960 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
Regardless, it's not a "choice!"
that too, is a theory.
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:07 AM
 
17,290 posts, read 29,333,101 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wild Style View Post
that too, is a theory.
According to whom?

Have you been paying attention at ALL to this thread?

The only ones who seem to argue that it's a "theory" and "a choice" are those that aren't living it.
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:18 AM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 17,324,960 times
Reputation: 2093
According to psychologist, some think its a choice and that people are not born with it and some say think it isn't a choice and that they are born with it. There is no definitive prof one way or the other, hence it is all theory. Personaly, I really don't care one way or other which theory is right or wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
According to whom?

Have you been paying attention at ALL to this thread?

The only ones who seem to argue that it's a "theory" and "a choice" are those that aren't living it.
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Old 12-30-2007, 08:25 AM
 
Location: Journey's End
10,203 posts, read 27,074,244 times
Reputation: 3946
Perhaps another example for people to mull over as a comparison, although admittedly far from the topic of gay:

I am in pain. I can feel the pain. I can isolate it. I know its severity.

I tell you about my pain, and you scoff, and tell me my pain is going to go away if I take a walk, take a shower, put on some salve, or just forget about it.

For a short while, the pain subsides because I took a shower, put on some salve, or strolled down the road. I was temporarily distracted.

But soon the pain returns. I feel it; I know it is there.

I think people are gay if they feel as if they are gay. I think only they know when this knowledge occurred and that we who are not feeling gay, or bi-sexual, should respect this self-knowledge. We are not in their skin, or in their heads, and it is our theory that they may be either choosing to be, or are pre-disposed to homosexuality.



Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7 View Post
According to whom?

Have you been paying attention at ALL to this thread?

The only ones who seem to argue that it's a "theory" and "a choice" are those that aren't living it.
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