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Oh, please. Spare me from this tired rhetoric and ridiculous straw man argument.
As part of an overall strategy in the "War on Terror," I think we had many good reasons to target Iraq, as Hussein supported terrorists, providing weapons and training camps.
The "no place to hide" strategy was a valid strategy.
Obviously, Iraq had nothing to do with the USS Cole attack, and I don't think I said or even implied that it did.
We had one..get Iraq back on the petrodollar.
Same with Libya.
Neither Iran nor Syria trade in petrodollars and they are our mortal enemies as well.
Oh please. You don't know anybody who are Muslims in your neighborhood?
No, I don't. I have never known any Muslim. Except for about 30 years living in San Diego, I have always lived in the country (and live in the country now). This is a small town. We have 12 acres.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981
I don't have any personal relationship with any Muslims. But we certainly have several Muslim families living in my neighborhood. I don't think they are the problem. I don't believe these peace loving folks should be constantly apologizing for the terrorists. It is not their fault.
Why do you keep emphasizing that they are "peace loving?" That's rhetoric. I am "peace loving" too. But I recognize that there are people who want to kill me, partly because I am American, and partly because I am Christian.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981
Muslim leaders however, should regularly speak out against acts of terrorism. Leave the regular Muslim folks alone.
The Mosque's that the Boston bombers attended taught Jihad. They aren't going to speak out. They are believers in Jihad, which the Quran teaches.
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981
You seem to believe that even the Muslims living in your neighborhood are all ready to kill you, that is ridiculous.
There are no Muslims in my neighborhood.
Why would I trust any Muslim? How do I know which ones would kill me, when their Quran teaches that Christians and Jews should be killed? I have Jewish friends. I don't consider them, "pigs," as Muslims do.
The 9-11 hijackers lived among others in the neighborhood "peacefully" right up until they hijacked the planes and flew them into the WTC towers. How did anybody know? I'll bet they appeared "peaceful" to all who knew them.
Those who knew the Boston bombers thought they were nice boys, and "peaceful" too, right up until the time they killed and maimed all those people at the Boston Marathon.
No, I don't. I have never known any Muslim. Except for about 30 years living in San Diego, I have always lived in the country (and live in the country now). This is a small town. We have 12 acres..
I don't know any Muslims PERSONALLY either, but that doesn't mean Muslims don't exist in your neighborhood. Especially if you are living in San Diego. The lie is obvious here.
There are many Muslims living in San Diego.
I am from Newport Beach, California. (a very good neighborhood) We have at least two Muslims families here. And they are nice people.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy
Why do you keep emphasizing that they are "peace loving?" That's rhetoric. I am "peace loving" too. But I recognize that there are people who want to kill me, partly because I am American, and partly because I am Christian..
If majority of them are not peace loving in THIS COUNTRY, you wouldn't be here. That is why. That doesn't mean we don't have radical islam problem here. Like I said many times before, we need a new definition of "moderate" Muslim.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy
The Mosque's that the Boston bombers attended taught Jihad. They aren't going to speak out. They are believers in Jihad, which the Quran teaches..
Well, then they are radical Muslims. They should be condemned.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy
Why would I trust any Muslim? How do I know which ones would kill me, when their Quran teaches that Christians and Jews should be killed? I have Jewish friends. I don't consider them, "pigs," as Muslims do.
I am a Christian, my friend is a Jew. Nobody has called us pigs. You are a Veteran, aren't you? what if somebody say "I cannot trust you because you must have PTSD." What would you feel?
If the Muslims here are peace loving folks who just want to fulfill their American dreams just like everybody else does here, Why do you must demonize the whole group of them? What is your purpose?
So from someone who numbers many Muslims among my friends, coworkers, neighbors, teachers and former lovers, let me educate you a bit. I have NEVER, not ONCE, not a SINGLE TIME had a negative interaction with a Muslim. Even living in the East End of London. Even my Palestinian best friend growing up and her family. Not once has a Muslim ever tried to convert me. Not once has a Muslim told me I was going to Hell. Not once has a non-extremist Muslim who I knew personally used violence and vandalism toward me.
I can't say that about Christians. Most Christians I have known have not showed me half the courtesy and respect that Muslims have. That's because Christianity does not hold Judaism in the same regard in the New Testament as Islam does in Qur'an - Judaism and Christianity are "people of the book" and are to be treated well. Nononesenseguy - you exemplify your chosen faith. That's not a compliment.
Extremist Islam comes from a distinct place: poverty, lack of education, and othering. The later is why you see seemingly Western Muslims radicalizing, often to the complete surprise and horror of their families. The former are why Muslim societies in the Middle East don't look too different than Christian societies in the Congo, Uganda, and Rwanda. Did you know that the church played a role in the Rwandan Genocide? Did you take to the streets about that?
I lost people in 9/11. I was only 12 years old then and was well aware that the actions of a few did not condemn the lives of the many. I watched my Muslim friends' families homes get vandalized and receive death threats simply because of their faith. Our community was 99% Southern Baptist and very conservative (80% voted for Bush, 10% voted for the Constitutionalist party if that's any indication). I don't have to tell you who was making the threats and vandalizing the home.
Why did I learn by 12 years old what you have not learned at 71? Have you ever so much as picked up a Qu'ran? Based on your statements, it doesn't sound like it. What about join a Christian-Muslim dialogue group? Visit a mosque? Speak with an imam? How can you wage war against something you don't understand?
So from someone who numbers many Muslims among my friends, coworkers, neighbors, teachers and former lovers, let me educate you a bit. I have NEVER, not ONCE, not a SINGLE TIME had a negative interaction with a Muslim. Even living in the East End of London. Even my Palestinian best friend growing up and her family. Not once has a Muslim ever tried to convert me. Not once has a Muslim told me I was going to Hell. Not once has a non-extremist Muslim who I knew personally used violence and vandalism toward me.
I can't say that about Christians. Most Christians I have known have not showed me half the courtesy and respect that Muslims have. That's because Christianity does not hold Judaism in the same regard in the New Testament as Islam does in Qur'an - Judaism and Christianity are "people of the book" and are to be treated well. Nononesenseguy - you exemplify your chosen faith. That's not a compliment.
Extremist Islam comes from a distinct place: poverty, lack of education, and othering. The later is why you see seemingly Western Muslims radicalizing, often to the complete surprise and horror of their families. The former are why Muslim societies in the Middle East don't look too different than Christian societies in the Congo, Uganda, and Rwanda. Did you know that the church played a role in the Rwandan Genocide? Did you take to the streets about that?
I lost people in 9/11. I was only 12 years old then and was well aware that the actions of a few did not condemn the lives of the many. I watched my Muslim friends' families homes get vandalized and receive death threats simply because of their faith. Our community was 99% Southern Baptist and very conservative (80% voted for Bush, 10% voted for the Constitutionalist party if that's any indication). I don't have to tell you who was making the threats and vandalizing the home.
Why did I learn by 12 years old what you have not learned at 71? Have you ever so much as picked up a Qu'ran? Based on your statements, it doesn't sound like it. What about join a Christian-Muslim dialogue group? Visit a mosque? Speak with an imam? How can you wage war against something you don't understand?
I want to start by saying, no innocent person should have their homes vandalized or have to live in fear.
But let me show you another perspective. On 9/11 I was a resident on rotation in a hospital in Paterson, NJ, an area with a very high muslim population. When I left the hospital in the evening, I had to drive through what seemed like a celebratory parade, with people chanting and women making high pitched screams. Everyone laughing, smiling and cheering. I was horrified. So there IS a large population of muslims, that will never become terrorists themselves, but will still celebrate when others carry out "successful" terrorist missions. Those people don't know it, but they are just as bad as the terrorists.
I want to start by saying, no innocent person should have their homes vandalized or have to live in fear.
But let me show you another perspective. On 9/11 I was a resident on rotation in a hospital in Paterson, NJ, an area with a very high muslim population. When I left the hospital in the evening, I had to drive through what seemed like a celebratory parade, with people chanting and women making high pitched screams. Everyone laughing, smiling and cheering. I was horrified. So there IS a large population of muslims, that will never become terrorists themselves, but will still celebrate when others carry out "successful" terrorist missions. Those people don't know it, but they are just as bad as the terrorists.
Yes, I agree.
That is why we need a new definition of moderate Muslim. I've never believed all of them are moderate, and I've never believed all of them support terrorism.
Those who "smile and cheer, laugh and make high pitched screams" should be carefully watched by homeland security agency.
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,329 posts, read 54,389,283 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy
Oh, please. Spare me from this tired rhetoric and ridiculous straw man argument.
As part of an overall strategy in the "War on Terror," I think we had many good reasons to target Iraq, as Hussein supported terrorists, providing weapons and training camps.
The "no place to hide" strategy was a valid strategy.
Obviously, Iraq had nothing to do with the USS Cole attack, and I don't think I said or even implied that it did.
The tired rhetoric here is the lame attempts at justifying the invasion/occupation of Iraq in the wake of the 9/11 attacks. Are you really going to try and tell us the ouster of Saddam should have remained a priority when he had nothing to do with the attacks and presented no imminent threat to the US? Are you really silly enough to believe the "overall strategy in the "War on Terror" " should not have changed post 9/11?
Too many people choose ignorance to the Islamic agenda and hope that americanization proves to dilute their character but this has not been the case in other countries they occupy .
It is SOP Mohammed taught them.
They can and will lie to gain confidence just exactly like Obama has always done .
Liberals think the shura law will never be implemented here, but the way things are going that's not true.
When enough Muslims out vote you, and those in congress misrepresent you, then what are you going to do ?
The demotion of the constitution is been under way a long time due to Muslim and the atheists ,I find it interesting they take the same side against christians .
This also sides with the UN agenda 21, if any of you bother to read it . its no secret.
I consider myself a Christian and side with brownsfan, burdell and others on this. Some here are trying to spew "the boogieman is coming" and one has to wonder why and what their agenda is.
So from someone who numbers many Muslims among my friends, coworkers, neighbors, teachers and former lovers, let me educate you a bit. I have NEVER, not ONCE, not a SINGLE TIME had a negative interaction with a Muslim. Even living in the East End of London. Even my Palestinian best friend growing up and her family. Not once has a Muslim ever tried to convert me. Not once has a Muslim told me I was going to Hell. Not once has a non-extremist Muslim who I knew personally used violence and vandalism toward me.
I can't say that about Christians. Most Christians I have known have not showed me half the courtesy and respect that Muslims have. That's because Christianity does not hold Judaism in the same regard in the New Testament as Islam does in Qur'an - Judaism and Christianity are "people of the book" and are to be treated well. Nononesenseguy - you exemplify your chosen faith. That's not a compliment.
Muslims believe Jews are "pigs." That's in the Quran. And, Muslims are not to associate with either Jews or Christians. So how does that fit with the claim that they are "people of the book?" And, they certainly do not treat them well. They kill them, they kidnap young Christian girls and rape them, then enslave them. So much for "people of the book."
The New Testament tells us that we (Christians) are "Jews by adoption." However, the apostles preached against the Judaizers who were trying to conform Christians to Jewish traditions (circumcision, for example) and make them adhere to dietary restrictions, and observe other laws and traditions which Christ had freed us from (because salvation comes by faith alone, not works).
Some of the Jews of the day did persecute the Christians (Paul, for one, before his conversion).
"I want you to know, brothers, that the gospel I preached is not something that man made up. I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.
For you have heard of my previous way of life in Judaism, how intensely I persecuted the church of God and tried to destroy it. I was advancing in Judaism beyond many Jews my own age, and was extremely zealous for the traditions of my fathers. But when God, who set me apart from birth and called me by his grace, was pleased to reveal his Son in me so that I might preach him among the gentiles, I did not consult any man, nor did I go up to Jerusalem to see those who were apostles before I was, but went immediately into Arabia, and later returned to Damascus.
My faith is not "chosen." As Paul writes above, it is I who was chosen by Jesus Christ, set apart from birth, and I can tell you that when He revealed himself to me roughly 34 or 35 years ago, my life changed in an instant. I still remember the moment, and how it felt, and he took a lot of bad habits away from me in an instant (including foul language and swearing which I had learned from unsaved friends). The moment of conversion is real.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charolastra00
Extremist Islam comes from a distinct place: poverty, lack of education, and othering.
Bull crap! It comes from the Quran. It's known as Jihad, and it is taught in the Quran.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charolastra00
The later is why you see seemingly Western Muslims radicalizing, often to the complete surprise and horror of their families. The former are why Muslim societies in the Middle East don't look too different than Christian societies in the Congo, Uganda, and Rwanda. Did you know that the church played a role in the Rwandan Genocide?
Proof? Got any links?
Quote:
Originally Posted by charolastra00
Did you take to the streets about that?
I don't "take to the streets."
Quote:
Originally Posted by charolastra00
I lost people in 9/11. I was only 12 years old then and was well aware that the actions of a few did not condemn the lives of the many. I watched my Muslim friends' families homes get vandalized and receive death threats simply because of their faith. Our community was 99% Southern Baptist and very conservative (80% voted for Bush, 10% voted for the Constitutionalist party if that's any indication). I don't have to tell you who was making the threats and vandalizing the home.
Oh, of course. It was conservative Christians. Right? Got any proof? No, I didn't think so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by charolastra00
Why did I learn by 12 years old what you have not learned at 71? Have you ever so much as picked up a Qu'ran? Based on your statements, it doesn't sound like it. What about join a Christian-Muslim dialogue group? Visit a mosque? Speak with an imam? How can you wage war against something you don't understand?
What makes you think I don't understand Islam? You've been brainwashed, which is not surprising, as the schools today whitewash Islam, and hold it up as the "Religion of Peace" (which it is not).
Are you not aware of how Islam came into being? It's founder, Mohammed, with his dreams? Are you not aware that from the beginning, Muslims persecuted the Christians and Jews?
Islam is a false religion, and it is a very violent and hateful religion. I don't call referring to Jew's as "pigs" and calling for their annihilation a "religion of peace." They are no better than the Nazis.
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