Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Global markets along with business owners made a choice. Pay 20 dollars a hour or 1 dollar a hour.
Once unions started their demands, LONG AGO business owners went else where in the global market labor force.
This happened LONG ago and continues to happen for the simple fact that cheap labor is in another country PERIOD.
Less taxes and less regulation will not change that. Will it help with some jobs MAYBE.
Less Taxes and less regulation can be have benefits but I am pretty sure they are not going to bring back UNION jobs at some hourly rate with the risk of strike every other week.
Corporations have been for some time now GLOBAL companies they will tell you that often and believe they are a GLOBAL force. US policy has been always a GLOBAL one since the UN and other trade agreements made to support this line of thinking.
BTW you find this in IT right now with jobs in India and other places when American IT workers arent even in a union and STILL the business outsources the jobs. They are CURRENT up to date jobs with current up to date skills of which these IT workers who have SKILLS are still outsourced. You want to know why because its all ABOUT THE MONEY.
So remember that when you have a career and or a JOB in the united states YOU WILL BE outsourced and or let go because they found a way to do it cheaper.
Have a skill that can not be outsourced in MASS and you will have a job.
If a company will not employ you be your own BOSS and start a company do it yourself, find investors, and make your way in life. Screw them.
If a manufacting job is what you want and that is ALL your heart desires in your life for a CAREER you can find work. You will likely have to MOVE. If you believe you have some other value in a FREE society you will find another layer and or line to work in. But no union and or government is interested in PROTECTING your job without political and or donations to the cause of more government intervention.
Joe has a job. What's he complaining about.
Why doesn't he snap out of it and start his own business with his trade.
He'd be surprised what he can do on "his own".
Meet Joe Schmo. Joe is 53 years old. Joe was a laborer in the factory all his life, like his father before him. Joe has been a loyal Republican voter since he could vote.
Joe's factory closed up, as millions of manufacturing jobs were outsourced. Joe was fortunate enough to find a job in the labor union. Unfortunately, Joe's politicians thought it was best if corporations had more rights, so Joe's state became a right to work state. Over the next few years, Joe's union had trouble retaining membership and eventually ceased to exist completely.
Joe is a hard worker, but he hasn't received a raise since the union closed up. The company he found work with was facing some financial problems, so Joe was laid off. It appears Joe's skills aren't as diverse as the market requires, because he has no higher education or additional training. Joe goes down to the unemployment office and files for unemployment and food stamps. Unfortunatley, the governor in Joe's state signed a bill cutting unemployment and food stamps, because the state can't support leeches. Joe decides to sell his house and car, as he is no longer able to make the payments.
Joe moves into an apartment of modest means, and is forced to take public transportation as he looks for a job. The public transportation has reduced hours of service, due to cuts from the state and local government. It appears they are cutting funding for transit so they can divert the funds for highway expansion. A local initiative to build a light rail in Joe's city was defeated by local and state officials, as it was deemed unnecessary spending.
Joe finally lands a few minimum wage jobs at walmart and McDonalds. Between jobs, he is studying to take up a new career. However, minimum wage hasn't raised in a few years. Local politicans are resisting a hike in the minimum wage, fearing inflation. Joe takes the bus to vote on the new ballot initiative regarding minimum wage. Unfortunately, polling hours have been reduced so Joe has to miss work to vote. Joe is a responsible, once-Republican voter, so he takes the steps to get a new ID just to vote. Joe has been following all the things his former party did to make his life more difficult, so he finally musters up the courage to vote for a different party. Unfortunately, Joe's move to a low-income neighborhood put him in a gerrymandered district. Unfortunately, Joe's state politicians captured another supermajority from the other 9 districts in the state...
Joe needs to go where the high paying jobs are. Like N. Dakota. Then Joe would have a good life. But now he is being turned into a good liberal by whining, wringing his hands and waiting for the next handout that made him subservient to the liberal party. Joe should recognize that dead end, nowhere jobs tend to dry up and that maybe he needs to get a little education to make himself more marketable.
Regardless of US minimum wage, there is no reasonable way to compete with emerging markets when there is an unlimited number of people willing to work for $1 a day to keep from starving.
This is true. It is also a major reason why we need to encourage corporations to remain in the US.
We live in a world economy where the majority of consumers most often opt for the lowest cost product which will, in many cases, be the one made in the third world with these $1 a day wages. By raising the cost of doing business for these US corporations, we give their overseas competitors advantage. If it is enough to influence the consumer, they will buy from the foreign competitor and we'll lose the non-factory jobs and money here in the US.
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom
If the US were to eliminate minimum wage, all labor and environmental laws as well as welfare, US people would likely work for $1 day, too, in order to avoid starvation. It would be necessary to once again put young children into the workforce, too.
If this were actually the case, all jobs in the US would be minimum wage. What makes some jobs pay more is the limit of people who can perform them to a certain standard. I'm sorry, but practically anyone can perform to high enough standard the tasks involved in making fries or running a cash register at Burger King with a couple of days training. The possible candidates for such jobs is unlimited. The same can't be said of an accountant, IT technician, nurse, vet, car mechanic, etc. etc. The reason these jobs pay more isn't because of minimum wage, it's due to the limited resource of people who can perform the jobs.
Why did Houston Texan's defensive player JJ Watt get a $100 million contract, because there are only a few people in the world who can perform his job at that level.
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom
If the US were to cease funding public education, only the wealthy could afford to educate their children as once was common.
That would depend upon the level of education, and I don't think anybody (at least not here) is advocating that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom
Those who oppose the concept of minimum wage seem to either think their own wage and thus standard of living would somehow be preserved or enhanced or are living off their parents.
As covered above, it would be preserved if they had skills that require a specific knowledge and/or skill set.
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom
Wage is a bottoms-up market. With no floor, all wages and thus standards of living, would substantially decline, over time.
No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom
Having said all this, I am not an advocate for increasing the minimum wage. Those who, in theory, would benefit most from the increase ( low wage earners with children) , don't pay taxes on their incomes and are eligible for a bevy of low income benefits that higher wage earners are not. The value of low income benefits needs to be taken into full consideration.
The real problem is that there are a large number of jobs out there that are not meant to be a primary job for a person with a family.
Why in these discussions do we continue to have the phony discussion about unions?
I'm in a union, but I recognize that unions in the private sector are like 6-7%. Clearly there are higher and lower levels of unionization based on different industries.
But the vast majority of workers are non union.
So discussing unions is a distraction or dishonesty.
Our labor market right now is close to the conservative's dream, minimal unionization, low wages for most jobs, terrible benefits for most jobs, heck and in some industries workers regularly get screwed out of pay, it is called wage theft.
What are the conservative solutions to these problems?
Crapping on low wage workers as lazy losers who don't deserve anything. And exalting the rich and wealthy and giving them tax cuts.
You do know your union dues pay the salaries of union reps and their offices, be they centralized or in the field correct? Those union reps and their underlings make more than you will ever want to know of and their free bennies would incense you. Why do government employees need a union?
I worked at the Grand Lodge of one of the largest labor unions out of HS and what I saw should make dues paying member mad as hell. Did you know you pay for the American Express cards they toss around for lunch/dinner every day whether it be business or not? You pay for their cars and their 6 figure salaries as well as their 1st class airline tickets.
The average union member is a dues paying dope with little to no clue as to how it all works. He is going by the propaganda every union tells it's members. Union officials are but politicians. The president of the union is voted into office and he appoints his minions. Some of them aren't worthy of carrying the average member's tools for him though he gets triple his salary.
The president of the union I worked for was a self avowed socialist.
Joe has a job. What's he complaining about.
Why doesn't he snap out of it and start his own business with his trade.
He'd be surprised what he can do on "his own".
Sometimes Joe feels he's entitled to a job and it should be up to someone else to provide it to him without him having to do any additional training or relocate.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
