Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
It's an amazing thing, these days. Back when I was a kid, people learned the basics. Today, far too many think that "economics" is some kind of theory about currency and interest rates and directing money flows.
But it's not.
There have been societies in which everyone was comparatively wealthy. And societies that had immense poverty. The difference between them wasn't how money was "distributed", nor was it was a lack of forcible transfer of currency from one group or groups to another group or groups of people.
No, it was the production of wealth - which could also be defined as the "production and exchange of needed goods and services".
Imagine with me, for a minute, a small, isolated valley. The Industrial age has few, if any signs of existence, and subsistence lifestyle rules. But over the years, mechanization of food production occurs. Grains, vegetables, fruits, meat production increases to the point where those who produce them have more than they can use, and they trade with each other, meaning everyone can get their hands on everything. And, as production increases, they each have excess. This excess leads to a blacksmith setting up shop and he provides services in exchange for his needs. The blacksmith's innovations lead to even more production, and eventually a storekeeper sets up his trade and he provides a central trading point where everyone's excess results in even more trading and variety available to anyone who produces things of value.
As production increases, each producer's excess is traded away for those things they need - and that excess is even traded among those who provide services. The blacksmith has more than he can consume, so he trades with the cobbler and the candle-maker. And even then has left over excess, so he adds an assistant, who obtains his needs in exchange for labor for the blacksmith.
The first people to thrive after the producers, are those who enable increasing their productivity. The next in line are those who prosper because the producers produce even more and then trade that for lesser value goods and services. Even those who just trade labor get more in return for their labor, enough so, that THEY can trade with yet others.
Eventually, people who provide art, entertainment, etc, can thrive because there's simply so much excess that it can be traded to them for the WANT of said art, etc.
What's the foundation for this prosperity? Productivity of wealth.
Now, let's introduce government into this.
So, the people elect a mayor and town council. They are paid by confiscating the productivity of those who produce.. .and those who don't - taking what they have traded labor for, to be consumed by themselves. Eventually, the mayor, town council, sheriff, street sweepers, park gardeners, and a large army of inspectors consume so much of the food and goods produced that things are getting a bit scarce. The storekeeper, the blacksmith, the cobbler, the candlemaker, all have to give away part of the ironworks, shoes, candles, and food that their employees produce to the government, who gives it to people who can't find any way to trade labor for their needs.
Then, the government starts demanding that if you own a home, you must provide to the government a certain amount of grains, produce, etc, that you traded for each year, just keep your home.
Mind you, the people who produce it all are doing fine, but those who aren't producing are finding their lives seriously impacted. The generous wages paid have decreased. Those who own stuff find their ownership increasingly harder to maintain. Now, the producers, who see the government confiscate 1/3 of their crops, don't trade as much. They have less left over, and the blacksmith and candlemaker want even larger amounts of what they produce for their goods and services.
As the wheat farmer tires of the grind, he starts to calculate in his head "Just how tough would it be..." and eventually, he cuts the acres planted by more than half. He still has plenty and he still can trade with the rancher and the mechanic for his machinery, and he just reverts to growing his own.
And the government confiscates half of his crop now, to feed all the government people, since they hired more people ot ensure he's not cheating on paying in his share of his annual grain crops.
But everyone's poor. The government has confiscated 1 of every 5 homes and farms because they could not pay the taxes demanded.
And that's why big government fails.
Notice, that it matters not one iota how "greedy" the producers are, they cannot improve their lives without trade. And that trade improves everyone else's lives. But only so far as there is sufficient excess production of needs so it can be shared freely in trade for everyone else. They ENTIRE key is the productivity - productivity of what enables our lives and enables productivity of NEEDS.
But when more and more of the population stops producing needs and just consumes them, impoverishment occurs. When ownership gets taxed, ownership decreases and when ownership decreases... Productivity decreases - and the only ones left in a comfortable life.. .are the few producers and those the government favors.
Which is precisely the shift that accelerated about a century ago, and seriously warped upwards with FDR and the "new deal". We are seeing the final collapse, as the government frantically searches for new sources of needs to confiscate and redistribute for votes to remain in power. But we lived past our productivity quite some time ago and have been killing productivity for long past a half century now.
We have been living off IOU's greater than our production for decades.
It WILL collapse, and the more government leeches there are, the worse the collapse will be.
Those advocating redistribution as the solution are the problem. Because they don't comprehend a single thing about economics. And sadly, that includes a lot of people who call themselves "economists".
Those advocating redistribution as the solution are the problem. Because they don't comprehend a single thing about economics. And sadly, that includes a lot of people who call themselves "economists".
And that's the scary part....tried to rep you, but....
America is now the society of the lowest common denominator. Guess who represents, and even encourages this low-information, low-output, behavior? That would be Democrats.
It's time to purge liberals and Democrats from the seat of power for the next generation. America depends on it.
Very simplistic, but it is fundamentally flawed. Humans naturally want to keep and hold more than they need. The only market correction for human greed and envy is violence or government and sometimes both.
It's time to purge liberals and Democrats from the seat of power for the next generation. America depends on it.
Of course. If you don't like their opinion, violently and abruptly get rid of them. Screw democracy or the ideals of the US. Great authoritarian attitude.
It's an amazing thing, these days. Back when I was a kid, people learned the basics. Today, far too many think that "economics" is some kind of theory about currency and interest rates and directing money flows.
But it's not.
There have been societies in which everyone was comparatively wealthy. And societies that had immense poverty. The difference between them wasn't how money was "distributed", nor was it was a lack of forcible transfer of currency from one group or groups to another group or groups of people.
No, it was the production of wealth - which could also be defined as the "production and exchange of needed goods and services".
Imagine with me, for a minute, a small, isolated valley. The Industrial age has few, if any signs of existence, and subsistence lifestyle rules. But over the years, mechanization of food production occurs. Grains, vegetables, fruits, meat production increases to the point where those who produce them have more than they can use, and they trade with each other, meaning everyone can get their hands on everything. And, as production increases, they each have excess. This excess leads to a blacksmith setting up shop and he provides services in exchange for his needs. The blacksmith's innovations lead to even more production, and eventually a storekeeper sets up his trade and he provides a central trading point where everyone's excess results in even more trading and variety available to anyone who produces things of value.
As production increases, each producer's excess is traded away for those things they need - and that excess is even traded among those who provide services. The blacksmith has more than he can consume, so he trades with the cobbler and the candle-maker. And even then has left over excess, so he adds an assistant, who obtains his needs in exchange for labor for the blacksmith.
The first people to thrive after the producers, are those who enable increasing their productivity. The next in line are those who prosper because the producers produce even more and then trade that for lesser value goods and services. Even those who just trade labor get more in return for their labor, enough so, that THEY can trade with yet others.
Eventually, people who provide art, entertainment, etc, can thrive because there's simply so much excess that it can be traded to them for the WANT of said art, etc.
What's the foundation for this prosperity? Productivity of wealth.
Now, let's introduce government into this.
So, the people elect a mayor and town council. They are paid by confiscating the productivity of those who produce.. .and those who don't - taking what they have traded labor for, to be consumed by themselves. Eventually, the mayor, town council, sheriff, street sweepers, park gardeners, and a large army of inspectors consume so much of the food and goods produced that things are getting a bit scarce. The storekeeper, the blacksmith, the cobbler, the candlemaker, all have to give away part of the ironworks, shoes, candles, and food that their employees produce to the government, who gives it to people who can't find any way to trade labor for their needs.
Then, the government starts demanding that if you own a home, you must provide to the government a certain amount of grains, produce, etc, that you traded for each year, just keep your home.
Mind you, the people who produce it all are doing fine, but those who aren't producing are finding their lives seriously impacted. The generous wages paid have decreased. Those who own stuff find their ownership increasingly harder to maintain. Now, the producers, who see the government confiscate 1/3 of their crops, don't trade as much. They have less left over, and the blacksmith and candlemaker want even larger amounts of what they produce for their goods and services.
As the wheat farmer tires of the grind, he starts to calculate in his head "Just how tough would it be..." and eventually, he cuts the acres planted by more than half. He still has plenty and he still can trade with the rancher and the mechanic for his machinery, and he just reverts to growing his own.
And the government confiscates half of his crop now, to feed all the government people, since they hired more people ot ensure he's not cheating on paying in his share of his annual grain crops.
But everyone's poor. The government has confiscated 1 of every 5 homes and farms because they could not pay the taxes demanded.
And that's why big government fails.
Notice, that it matters not one iota how "greedy" the producers are, they cannot improve their lives without trade. And that trade improves everyone else's lives. But only so far as there is sufficient excess production of needs so it can be shared freely in trade for everyone else. They ENTIRE key is the productivity - productivity of what enables our lives and enables productivity of NEEDS.
But when more and more of the population stops producing needs and just consumes them, impoverishment occurs. When ownership gets taxed, ownership decreases and when ownership decreases... Productivity decreases - and the only ones left in a comfortable life.. .are the few producers and those the government favors.
Which is precisely the shift that accelerated about a century ago, and seriously warped upwards with FDR and the "new deal". We are seeing the final collapse, as the government frantically searches for new sources of needs to confiscate and redistribute for votes to remain in power. But we lived past our productivity quite some time ago and have been killing productivity for long past a half century now.
We have been living off IOU's greater than our production for decades.
It WILL collapse, and the more government leeches there are, the worse the collapse will be.
Those advocating redistribution as the solution are the problem. Because they don't comprehend a single thing about economics. And sadly, that includes a lot of people who call themselves "economists".
When you speak of Leeches I assume you are also including the many Nations around the world that benefit from the Billions we send them every year and I assume you are also including the many Big Businesses that get huge tax breaks and incentives that take away revenue so that they can make even more profits. I also assume you have some ideas on reforming the Social programs we have in place to help those in need. I can also assume that you believe taxes to be a form of confiscation and believe it is done without Representation? Yes I see a lot of complaining in your post, I seem to be having a very difficult time locating where you made suggestions or posted ideas on how to resolve the issues.
I am sure you realize economics is not stressed at all in schools; even the basic understanding of it has been all but phased out. In most schools it is an elective. One has to wonder if this is by design.
Very simplistic, but it is fundamentally flawed. Humans naturally want to keep and hold more than they need. The only market correction for human greed and envy is violence or government and sometimes both.
Exactly. Real economists understand that the natural end state of free enterprise is violent redistribution.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
