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What does any of that have to do with actually possessing a gun? Making it illegal to own a gun or insisting they be registered does not mean people comply with the laws.
Just about anyone can buy a hand gun in the US. It's almost impossible here, unless you're a cop, armoured guard, or work in the wilderness.
People who want guns find ways to aquire them in spite of what their government thinks.
Well, the Goodfellas have guns. Over half the homicides in 2012 in Montreal were Mafia-related. 16 out of 31.
Yes, that's right. We average 30 murders per year in a city of many millions. It would probably be a lot more if everyone was running around with a hand gun.
The British are some of the hypocritical folks I ever encountered. They love to look down on us and think themselves a smarter and safer society for not having weapons but when something horrific shakes England like Muslims raping innocent women, beating up random folks, and bombing stores, they are up in arms and can't do or say anything about it in public for fear of being arrested or being targeted by more Muslims. They will go on the internet screaming at the top of their lungs how wrong it is and how their government has to do something not realizing their government will never do anything for them. I really have a hard time comprehending the British mindset. I simply cannot grasp the concept of not being armed. It's like they didn't learn anything from the Holocaust. Most of Europe has that same ignorant mindset with the exception of Switzerland. Well you know what they say, those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.
Well, I believe people should at least be tested for their mental status. Before they start going around killing people in a School. Not in that, as someone else said, perhaps a handgun could be the legal right to own (like a car), but to actually shoot a handgun - then you will need a test (like driving a car on the road)... Anyway I'm more thinking about this being a law in the UK. The Americans can do whatever they want, obviously!
That legally presumes that people are incompetent until proven competent, do you want to head down that road? Can't have kids unless you prove you're competent, can get a loan without a competency check, you want me to go on...?
Still doesn't address your dichotomy of being fundamental right that needs some form of test to exercise. If it needs some form of prerequisite by definition it cannot be a fundamental right.
Well, the Goodfellas have guns. Over half the homicides in 2012 in Montreal were Mafia-related. 16 out of 31.
Yes, that's right. We average 30 murders per year in a city of many millions. It would probably be a lot more if everyone was running around with a hand gun.
And that is commendable. But the average Joe who has a hand gun in the United States will NEVER commit a crime with that gun. Btw, I doubt the officials in Montreal would tolerate the situation with the gun toting gangs in Chicago. Perhaps our coddling of known criminals has something to do with our crime rate?
The British are some of the hypocritical folks I ever encountered. They love to look down on us and think themselves a smarter and safer society for not having weapons but when something horrific shakes England like Muslims raping innocent women, beating up random folks, and bombing stores, they are up in arms and can't do or say anything about it in public for fear of being arrested or being targeted by more Muslims. They will go on the internet screaming at the top of their lungs how wrong it is and how their government has to do something not realizing their government will never do anything for them. I really have a hard time comprehending the British mindset. I simply cannot grasp the concept of not being armed. It's like they didn't learn anything from the Holocaust. Most of Europe has that same ignorant mindset with the exception of Switzerland. Well you know what they say. Those who forget history are doomed to repeat it.
[quote=Gungnir;36740101]I can only provide proof of the three homicides that have been tied to legally owned fully automatic weapons that are noted. I cannot prove a negative. However I do know that there are only three homicide events that have been tied to NFA weapons since 1986.
You can't prove a negative, but you specifically said ONLY 3 occurred. I am requesting a source of any kind that validates exactly 3 and only three occurred. The source you provided you for did not helpy you, and in fact hurt you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
Why do people need Porsches, or 4000 square foot homes overlooking the Pacific Ocean, why do people need an iPhone 6 when they have an iPhone 5?
Those all have practical applications and don't kill people, other than the porsches. Of course, cars are regulated.
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Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
There are...? A ban means that they cannot legally be owned, they can,
Then I used the wrong terminology.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
they're not especially much more heavily regulated than non-NFA you just need pre-authorization and a set of fingerprints, and then there's the special deputy exemption too, if you happen to be a good friend of the local Police or Sheriffs department (which includes post '86 items too). Of course there's the trust route, where you don't need a background check at all just fill in the forms and indicate the owner is only a legal entity, not a person. The barrier isn't the regulation, its the pricing, limited supply drives up the pricing to silly money.
And what do you think limits the supply? What do you think makes it insufficient for demand? Automatic weapons, barring military-grade hardware, is not THAT much more expensive to produce, at least in comparison to other weaponry. The ammunition and repair might be, but the firearms themselves, while certainly more expensive, are not to the point people would opt for them if it did not involve regulation.
I
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
f someone used a select fire Uzi in the commission of a crime, how will you know? Mass of fire? Only if there are witnesses and the user actually uses the happy button. It fires a 9mm Parabellum round, so do many, many, many handguns. How can you identify that legally owned Uzi without having it?
Pretty easily, the same way they do for most other guns.
Let's see:
- Witnesses heard rapid fire of bullets
- Caliber goes along with weapon
- Large degree of bullets in victim
I mean, we have entire ballistics teams of police departments specifically to figure this kind of stuff out.
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Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
Sure if you have it it's pretty easy to identify the owner, but the owner may not have been the shooter and you're still SOL.
Yes, but considering few people have such guns, he or she's a good suspect. If they have an alibi, have no motive etc. they can be eliminated.
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Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
With a regular sale trace you can identify the original owner pretty quickly too, subsequent owners might be harder to locate, but it's been done.
The problem is not that, the problem is ease of access. I already said firearms can be tracked, my main problem with de-regulation is removing oversight and cost. Proliferation of weapons is not a good thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
Cheaper yes, easier no. Seriously you want easy, check out the requirements for NFA transfers to trusts, directors of trusts (or corporations) can possess that NFA item and are not required to have undergone a background check to possess it.
Are you seriously implying automatic weapons are less regulated than handguns and rifles? You still need all these background checks to buy any firearm in the first place.
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Originally Posted by zinctwentyone
You cannot buy a non-NFA handgun from a legal dealer in the same way. The only issue is that there is a delay in processing because of BATFE.
Do you mind citing these? I'm not saying I don't believe you, but I want to read them.
And that is commendable. But the average Joe who has a hand gun in the United States will NEVER commit a crime with that gun. Btw, I doubt the officials in Montreal would tolerate the situation with the gun toting gangs in Chicago. Perhaps our coddling of known criminals has something to do with our crime rate?
Actually the opposite - our overzealous imprisonment of the smallest of crimes turns petty crooks into hardened felons.
The main difference between Chicago and Montreal is the proliferation of guns, and he poverty.
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