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Old 12-30-2007, 06:49 AM
 
Location: Minnysoda
10,659 posts, read 10,691,044 times
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I think NewtoCa and silas777 are right theres just not the "engine" to drive a huge social upheaval....Most people in this country are just to complacent to do anything. many people complain (includeing me) but the vast majority aren't going to take to the streets. I think that most of the folks that protested in the 60's have turned that angst into making money and have passed that down to thier kids. So most of us relativly happy. IMHO it would take something huge to push us over the edge, like we get nuked or the lights go out in the whole country for 5 or 6 months something really heinous..........
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Old 12-30-2007, 07:57 AM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 17,322,782 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roseba View Post
I think it depends on where you live.

In NY this happened in the midst of the tech bubble bust and the Wordcom scandals

So you had a massive loss in the jobs in:

The financial sector, the tech sector and tourism all at once. And all of these factors fed off of each other and contributed to each others demise.

Other than the real estate bubble, I don't think NY has really gained the momentum it had. The employment market has not returned to it's prior robustness. While the percentages of unemployment are down, many people just never went back to work in their prior fields, and when they did, they got lower paying jobs. (I know many people in that boat.)

It was definitely a regional phenomenon though.
I am from NYC as well, I graduated that year and tried to move back a month before 9/11. It was tight in NYC back then, had friends who had to become substitute teachers (the ones that could get jobs). Cousins had no work etc. But this was minor compared to what I am talking about. I am talking about a depression like situation, where NO ONE can find work, people suffer greatly etc. When you see serious suffering then you will see people rise up.
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Old 12-30-2007, 10:08 AM
 
1,573 posts, read 4,054,776 times
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Two forces in America tend to make people complacent: our trust in the corporate machine's propaganda (television being a prime source) and our high degree of religious participation.

Americans are largely sheep. The economy might be bad but they'll rationalize it away. Situations that cause huge riots in other countries will just produce a shrug here. Our standard of living is going down but people again, rationalize it away. They'll say ridiculous things like "America is richer than those godless socialist Europeans", which is only half true- some European countries have a lower GDP, but in the US most of the wealth is owned by a small percentage of the population. The average American is actually losing wealth every year to inflation.

Back to the religion thing, there's actually a whole "gospel of wealth" movement among evangelical/fundamentalist protestants. It's assosciated with mega-churches. "Give to the church and God will pay you back" and "God likes wealth", etc. Alot of people buy into this. And the people believe this crap even though people like my aunt in rural Oklahoma just get poorer and poorer, they continue to send their money and their lives off to mega-churches, even when they should be saving money for themselves. Since my aunt accepted an early retirement from the telephone company a few years ago, her and my uncle have been on a slow, downward spiral.
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Old 12-30-2007, 12:24 PM
 
435 posts, read 1,518,688 times
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I just love watching rich spoiled kids posting questions like "When does the revolution start?". I guarentee you, all these Liberals and "Free Thinkers" who think such an event would be fun will be the first sheep eaten in the carange. As far as being "Coprorate drones" goes, what would you prefer? During the Industrial Age, we were "Factory Slaves". During the Agracultural Age, we were "Serfs". No matter what human endeavor we decide to pursue, the lazy and ignorant always scream some sort of "slavery" element to the equation.

Maybe America doesn't revolt becuase unlike the Berkeley/Ivy League Morons, were smart enough to know that most revolutions are destructive and deadly events that shatter many lives and uproot/destroy socieities. If it really came to violence in the streets, I can most certainly guarentee the "Opporessors" (Read: Rich/Powerful) will be more than ready to hop the next flight to whatever island/continent they have lined up next. I can think of more than a few countries who would love nothing more than to take in our successful. Combine that with most of our maufacturing and intellectual know-how already departed, all that would be left is the ruins of a once-great society (Detroit anyone?). And all the RageAgainstTheMachine-listening freaks can sit in their burned-down subdivisons and dream about what once was.


But I degress, If it comes down to it, I'll leave to. I'll be sure to tell my children about America and ungratful people of my generation that burned it all down.
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Old 12-30-2007, 12:44 PM
 
11,135 posts, read 14,159,747 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by my54ford View Post
I think NewtoCa and silas777 are right theres just not the "engine" to drive a huge social upheaval....Most people in this country are just to complacent to do anything. many people complain (includeing me) but the vast majority aren't going to take to the streets. I think that most of the folks that protested in the 60's have turned that angst into making money and have passed that down to thier kids. So most of us relativly happy. IMHO it would take something huge to push us over the edge, like we get nuked or the lights go out in the whole country for 5 or 6 months something really heinous..........
Well you said it, the people are complacent. In order for there to be social upheaval, the people must first become non-complacent. The only thing I can think of that would do this is for a great number of the masses to fall into economic crisis and or become hungry.

Look at what took place in the former Soviet Union, as most of the world thought things were hunky dory, but after many years of militarism, poor centralized governing, and a pilfering of the people, there was little left to eat other than bullets, missiles, and tanks. Something to consider when so many people today, including contemporary Republicans, to further increase the size, power and scope of the federal government.
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Old 12-30-2007, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Sitting on a bar stool. Guinness in hand.
4,428 posts, read 6,490,376 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
There is a social upheaval going on. Its called the gay rights movement. If you combine that with the massive spread of atheism among those under 30 today, I think you have something pretty big.

Look if the Gay folk and the Atheists want to win in this issue they are going to have to do with quiet but firm resolve. Acceptance of either group is going to come slowly but eventually they will be accepted for the most part by society. Look I'm a atheist myself and I will not force the issue. Now if someone happens to bring up a discussion about the issue. I,ll join in the debate but I'll never say "your wrong!" to anyone or try to change minds. I just state my point of view and why I believe what I believe. And that is that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by UB50 View Post
If the dollar collapses, we could get social unrest. I also think the immigration situation may lead to unrest somewhere, not necessarily across the USA.
Yep if some type of economic disaster was to happen. The you'd see some people taking to the street. Especially if there is mass unemployment.
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:16 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,536,313 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
There is a social upheaval going on. Its called the gay rights movement. If you combine that with the massive spread of atheism among those under 30 today, I think you have something pretty big.
But I've read that gay bars and newspapers have been shutting down around the country. It's believed that it means that gays are being more acceped by society. As a reflection of this, two gay political candidates got elected in Oklahoma City in recent years. Something like that had never happened before. Also recently one of Oklahoma City's two all gay hotels shut down. So if anything the gay rights movement is actually winding down.
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:16 PM
 
1,763 posts, read 5,985,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marc melchiori View Post
Following the crash in '29 nearly 25% of America was without work and things did not improve until December 7, 1941 when the nation went back to work making guns and tanks. If ever there was a time for massive social upheavel it would have been in the 1930s, but as other post have said things kind of re-balanced themselves.
You have omitted one very glaring and important fact: The New Deal.

It started in the early 30's, and without it, we well may have had the kind of societal breakdown that has occurred in Russia, or France.

FDR realized that we were in dire straits, and his foresight and quick action probably saved our bacon. A lot of very desperate Americans were given jobs, or hope, or both.

A lot of folks like to second-guess FDR's New Deal, and criticize it as the beginning of the American welfare state. But they weren't there at the time, and without the New Deal, it's really hard to know where we would have ended up. It is even possible that it saved our free market system.

http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1E1-NewDeal.html (broken link)
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:18 PM
 
3,570 posts, read 3,741,930 times
Reputation: 1344
Quote:
Originally Posted by TnHilltopper View Post
Well you said it, the people are complacent. In order for there to be social upheaval, the people must first become non-complacent. The only thing I can think of that would do this is for a great number of the masses to fall into economic crisis and or become hungry.
It's easy to be complacent when one is not armed with data. They think they are the unusual ones that are not getting ahead, and everyone else is doing just fine. They buy into the rhetoric (that is untrue) because they haven't done their homework to realize that the wool has been pulled over the eyes, and that every day, the standard of living decreases for the class of people who work 40+ hours a week at a mid-level job.

Or they buy into the myth, that one day, they too will be Donald Trump, not realizing how much closer to fantasy than reality that really is, and so they sympathize with those who are the one's screwing them over in the first place and place their anger at those who have less than them. (And you see it right and left on this forum.)
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Old 12-30-2007, 03:26 PM
 
Location: Near Manito
20,170 posts, read 24,264,523 times
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I think "complacency" and "contentment" are a lot closer than many would like to admit. To a significant degree, the debate is a question of connotation rather than situation.
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