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Many people feel there's a one size fits all solution to college. For some it may be scholarships, others it may be grants, others it may be loans, or a mixture. For some an apartment and eating ramen is a better deal than on campus room and board... for others going to CC for 2 years is the best route.
But what I heard more often than not when I was working at minimum wage jobs was that one could not afford to go to college... but the same people never bothered to look into it. My sister couildn't afford college and my parents wouldn't pay, but she wound up getting money to go to college because she went to a historically black college as a white girl... and she spent the time to research all of her options.
Actually my point was that if my sister had another sibling in school at the same time...it wouldn't be possible. Because even with her scholarships, expenses come up after the financial aid is distributed and my mother is always looking for a quick loan from the credit union or seeing what credit card has anything left on it.
I went to college...and it was very difficult. I will very quickly say that I couldn't afford it. Not then...and not now. I have over 50K worth of debt...which is ridiculous. Of course I went to a private school and at the time brought into the whole "go after your dreams". Well I worked two jobs at times and still had problems paying my phone bill and paying my car insurance. Now there's the student loan payments...which are too bad now because I consolidated them into a 45-year term (or something crazy like that). And I wasn't a slouch in high school either...I graduated with a 98.2 percent average (my high school had percentages not grades). I just went to a very pricey school...and although they gave me two scholarships, that did not cover any living expenses. Calling my family for money was NOT an option (they were even worse off back then than they are now) so there you have it.
The federal limit on the Pell Grant (our nations provision to ensure the poor of this country can go to college) is a measly $4,500. And hardly no school awards that maximum amount. And that is a shame.
College Application deadlines are the beginning of Senior Year of HighSchool. Change Senior year to trade school for all...at the end of the year those that do not get into
College will have begun a trade and have options.
Actually my point was that if my sister had another sibling in school at the same time...it wouldn't be possible. Because even with her scholarships, expenses come up after the financial aid is distributed and my mother is always looking for a quick loan from the credit union or seeing what credit card has anything left on it.
I went to college...and it was very difficult. I will very quickly say that I couldn't afford it. Not then...and not now. I have over 50K worth of debt...which is ridiculous. Of course I went to a private school and at the time brought into the whole "go after your dreams". Well I worked two jobs at times and still had problems paying my phone bill and paying my car insurance. Now there's the student loan payments...which are too bad now because I consolidated them into a 45-year term (or something crazy like that). And I wasn't a slouch in high school either...I graduated with a 98.2 percent average (my high school had percentages not grades). I just went to a very pricey school...and although they gave me two scholarships, that did not cover any living expenses. Calling my family for money was NOT an option (they were even worse off back then than they are now) so there you have it. You want to pay less, then go to cheaper school.. or go to one near to your home...
The federal limit on the Pell Grant (our nations provision to ensure the poor of this country can go to college) is a measly $4,500. And hardly no school awards that maximum amount. And that is a shame.
You went to an expensive PRIVATE school and you think America would be better off by paying for you to go to a PRIVATE school within insane tuition?...omg... NOBODY paid for my tuition, I paid it... I worked and went to school and tuition was only $8k per year and I stayed at home... could I go to another university away from home? Yeah. Could I go to a much more expensive private school... Yeah... should the government (i.e. the PEOPLE) pay for my education because I choose to go the more expensive route??? Obviously I did okay with tuition and costs with financial aid... how someone cannot is almost impossible to imagine... Who said it was your parents financial responsibility for your college education...
Who said it was your parents financial responsibility for your college education...
Unfortunately financial aid programs calculate a required funding portion from your parents, even if you live on your own... you have to be over 24 (I think) or married to be exempt.
I know this because my parents couldn't afford to pay for my college education. They took out loans for their expected portion, and I had to pay for those as well as mine.
You went to an expensive PRIVATE school and you think America would be better off by paying for you to go to a PRIVATE school within insane tuition?...omg... NOBODY paid for my tuition, I paid it... I worked and went to school and tuition was only $8k per year and I stayed at home... could I go to another university away from home? Yeah. Could I go to a much more expensive private school... Yeah... should the government (i.e. the PEOPLE) pay for my education because I choose to go the more expensive route??? Obviously I did okay with tuition and costs with financial aid... how someone cannot is almost impossible to imagine... Who said it was your parents financial responsibility for your college education...
Countries that have universal free public universities (no one necessarily said private schools would be funded) have better universal educational attainments. Most European countries do this.
I would agree with the premise of a college education for the children of American citizens, but not the children of illegal aliens who are only citizens based on the misinterpretation of the Fourteenth Amendment which has long minimized the struggle for citizenship of African American freed slaves and their progeny in the U.S.
I would agree with the premise of a college education for the children of American citizens, but not the children of illegal aliens who are only citizens based on the misinterpretation of the Fourteenth Amendment which has long minimized the struggle for citizenship of African American freed slaves and their progeny in the U.S.
Assuming that all kids born in the US are citizens, then you support their getting a free education too? This isn't the Immigration Forum, so we don't debate the 14th amendment on this Forum, so we assume them to be citizens as much as any other citizen.
Or are you proposing discriminating against current citizens?
In my opinion, and in the opinion of one of the Fourteenth Amendment's key authors, Michigan Senator Jacob Howard who explained in 1866 that the citizenship clause, intended to ensure the rights of former slaves and their children, "would not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are the children of foreigners, aliens, or who belong to families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States..."
the children of illegal aliens are not citizens.
Simply because this is not the immigration forum doesn't make my point any less valid. The question asked was "Should every child receive an education at the expense of the U.S. government." My answer is that I have no problem with my tax dollars supporting the education of the children of American citizens. I absolutely have a BIG problem if those children's parents flaunted and defied sovereign U.S. law in order to give birth to that child in this country. Also, don't forget, if these children are born to Mexican parents, they have dual citizenship. Let Mexico's taxpayers foot the bill for their education.
In my opinion, and in the opinion of one of the Fourteenth Amendment's key authors, Michigan Senator Jacob Howard who explained in 1866 that the citizenship clause, intended to ensure the rights of former slaves and their children, "would not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are the children of foreigners, aliens, or who belong to families of ambassadors or foreign ministers accredited to the Government of the United States..."
the children of illegal aliens are not citizens.
Simply because this is not the immigration forum doesn't make my point any less valid. The question asked was "Should every child receive an education at the expense of the U.S. government." My answer is that I have no problem with my tax dollars supporting the education of the children of American citizens. I absolutely have a BIG problem if those children's parents flaunted and defied sovereign U.S. law in order to give birth to that child in this country. Also, don't forget, if these children are born to Mexican parents, they have dual citizenship. Let Mexico's taxpayers foot the bill for their education.
So, your position is that we should fund the college tuition for all US citizens except those whose parents were undocumented aliens.
This means you would segment them out as second class citizens, despite their not being segmented out as separate today (we are only discussing those born in the US).
So, your position is that we should fund the college tuition for all US citizens except those whose parents were undocumented aliens.
This means you would segment them out as second class citizens, despite their not being segmented out as separate today (we are only discussing those born in the US).
I believe the intent of the Fourteenth Amendment to be clear and concise. It is simply the apologist attitude of those who have misinterpreted the Fourteenth Amendment to include birthright citizenship which allows the children of people in this country illegally to be declared U.S. citizens. In my opinion, and in the opinion of many who interpret Constitutional law, they are not.
So yes I would fund college tuition only for the children of U.S. citizens. This does not render the children of illegal aliens second class citizens. They have, from birth, Mexican citizenship. I'm sure that the Mexican government would be more than happy to lay the financial burden of these first class Mexican citizen's education on Mexico's taxpayers.
Last edited by Kele; 01-06-2008 at 07:01 PM..
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