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Old 12-13-2014, 09:32 AM
 
Location: Riding the light...
1,635 posts, read 1,578,967 times
Reputation: 1159

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericthebean View Post
If they met Obama, Nancy Pelosi, and Harry Reid,

Would they be saying "these are exactly the American patriots we envisioned for America's future when we founded this country! Hallelelujah!!!

Or no?
I can only imagine the founders would be severely depressed regarding the complete failure of modern man to understand the intent of the Constitution. And beg their various Gawdz to return them to their graves.
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Old 12-13-2014, 09:32 AM
 
Location: Here.
14,814 posts, read 13,684,568 times
Reputation: 17390
Quote:
Originally Posted by hammertime33 View Post
Jefferson should have been thrown in prison for his King-like usurpation of power.
The purchase was made by treaty with France. By the U.S. Constitution Article II Section 2:

Quote:
The President ... shall have Power, by and with the Advice and Consent of the Senate, to make Treaties, provided two thirds of the Senators present concur
The Senate approved the treaty on Oct 20, 1803

Nothing illegal.
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Old 12-13-2014, 09:34 AM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,038 posts, read 31,261,417 times
Reputation: 7848
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheDusty View Post
I love that the OP only listed Democrats. It's cute. Especially given we have a Republican majority congress. But what's more, it's as if he's implying that the founding fathers would love how the Republicans do things, when in reality, both parties are WAY to authoritarian to be given praise by any of the men who founded this country.
There weren't Republicans and Democrats back in the same fashion as today.
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Old 12-13-2014, 09:37 AM
 
Location: Billings, MT
9,842 posts, read 8,779,550 times
Reputation: 13933
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss View Post
Once they were brought up to speed on the current nature of the USA, they would say yes. Jefferson and Washington both had slave children and were both enlightened when it came to govt. They lived in a largely different era then the USA and world of today.

It takes a lot today to stand up to be a politician.
that's interesting, about Washington's "slave children"
Seems to me I read somewhere that he suffered from a lot of medical conditions, and was quite likely sterile, and had no direct descendents.
He and Martha had no children, although she had two from a previous marriage.
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Old 12-13-2014, 01:38 PM
 
9,470 posts, read 6,247,981 times
Reputation: 2169
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss View Post
Once they were brought up to speed on the current nature of the USA, they would say yes. Jefferson and Washington both had slave children and were both enlightened when it came to govt. They lived in a largely different era then the USA and world of today.

It takes a lot today to stand up to be a politician.
Not a chance.

All of them would be horrified at the corruption of and abuse of power by the federal government, as well as the complete nullification of the Constitution.
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Old 12-13-2014, 01:46 PM
 
48,508 posts, read 87,658,767 times
Reputation: 18132
Your the chief law enforcement officer in country; support the rule of law or country is going to keep going down the drain with those laws. You don't like some; then work towards having them changed by Democratic process.
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Old 12-13-2014, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Midwest City, Oklahoma
8,935 posts, read 5,224,486 times
Reputation: 3063
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wendell Phillips View Post
Did Thomas Jefferson have the constitutional authority to make the "Louisiana Purchase"? Should he have been impeached?
Quote:
Originally Posted by hammertime33 View Post
Jefferson should have been thrown in prison for his King-like usurpation of power.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retroit View Post
The purchase was made by treaty with France. By the U.S. Constitution Article II Section 2:

The Senate approved the treaty on Oct 20, 1803

Nothing illegal.
Look, I think we are discussing a constitutional question, not so much a legality question.


Regardless. A Constitutional amendment requires 3/4ths of the states to agree to it(IE 75%). The senate vote on the treaty was 24 to 7. Which means 24 of 31 senators voted for it, that is 77.4%.

Louisiana Purchase - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Furthermore, Thomas Jefferson had proposed an amendment to the constitution. But amendments take time. Most amendments were debated for years before finally being ratified by a sufficient number of states.


Thomas Jefferson was trying to do the right thing. But Napoleon wasn't going to wait for years for a decision(he was in the middle of a war and needed money). So Jefferson saw that more than 3/4ths of the senators had supported the treaty and assumed that meant that 3/4ths of the states would have ratified the amendment if there had been time.


There was such overwhelming support for the Louisiana Purchase, that it seems completely idiotic for anyone to think he would have or should have been impeached. It was not an executive order. And the amendment would have been ratified if there had been enough time. Jefferson wasn't playing partisan politics, or running some kind of underhanded game to increase his party's voting block. Nor was it even a matter of Congress failing to act on something that the people supported.


Here is the truth, Congress overwhelmingly approved the treaty with numbers greater than what was necessary for a Constitutional amendment, and Jefferson signed it.

To paint Jefferson out to be acting as some kind of monarch is just plain ignorant.
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Old 12-13-2014, 02:31 PM
 
Location: Florida
72,127 posts, read 38,473,029 times
Reputation: 13005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ericthebean View Post
If they met Obama, Nancy Pelosi, and Harry Reid,

Would they be saying "these are exactly the American patriots we envisioned for America's future when we founded this country! Hallelelujah!!!

Or no?
I think they would be pleased to see the United States is the best country on the planet.
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Old 12-13-2014, 03:32 PM
 
20,950 posts, read 17,119,154 times
Reputation: 10270
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova View Post
The Founders would say, Obama is not the leader of America. Obama is more like a world leader and cares more for other countries than the American people or this country.
After speaking with him for 5 minutes, they would realize that he's neither a statesman, a leader nor is he very intelligent. They would feel as if someone were pranking them.
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