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OP, the article that West refers to (and includes in his post) was published in American Renaissance, which is basically a white-supremacist magazine (just google for some other excerpts from it) ... so consider the source.
I grew up with a black stepfather (I am white) but am really tired of all these threads vilifying black people as if they are all the same. Saying you want to have a frank discussion about race while referencing an article that appeared in an unabashedly racist magazine is disingenuous. (OP, I am giving you the benefit of the doubt in assuming you had no idea what kind of magazine AR was/is.)
Sociologist William Julius Wilson wrote a book a couple of decades ago called The Declining Significance of Race. He later said it could just as well have been called The Increasing Significance of Class, but that didn't sound as good. His basic argument was that a split was developing in the "black community" in which those who had the resources to take advantage of educational and work opportunities would likely do very well (as he himself has), while those who were living in poverty (with all that goes along with that, including attending incredibly crappy schools) would likely continue to do poorly. I think this is even more true today. The problem is, whenever something happens that has significant racial overtones, and SOME black people behave badly, they are seen as somehow "representative" of ALL black people. It's absurd and unfair.
Why would you consider the source? What he said is either true, mostly true, partly true or none of it is true and all the spoken words are either true or not on their own merit. What's the difference who said it?
And? Forest Grove, OR? Livonia, MI? Syracuse, NY? Majority white all of them. Average crime. Not NO crime! Plenty of crime in fact, just less reported than Baltimore, MD or Detroit, MI or Brooklyn, NY. Given the incredible advantages of white privilege, and the smug superiority of posters like yourself, I assert that there should actually be NO crime at all in places like Owsley, KY. There should be no unemployment, no teen pregnancies, no out of wedlock pregnancies, there should be no taint of the kind of ghetto scenarios that are common in... the ghetto. I'm just saying. What exactly is your point anyway?
There's no white privilege, its all a myth. Nobody gets anything for free in this world, you have to work hard to get where you want to go in life, the rest of it is just a bunch of excuses, heresay and innuendo.
My point is that it's not socioeconomics. I don't think under reporting works in the case of homicide and arson...those are still listed as crimes. Some just may not be solved.
All races have their criminal element. All. By the numbers, whites have the largest population of criminals in all categories. Period! There are more than 3x as many white drug traffickers, users, dealers, etc. than black ones yet blacks are by far the largest numbers of incarcerated drug criminals. I know personally huge numbers of men and women (white) in RC sentence programs where they go in to prison overnight and on weekends to serve time for felonies! Blacks are never given these alternative sentencing options. I know a black guy who did 3 months in prison for urinating behind a dumpster because his bail was so high that his entire family couldn't come up with it. I don't know personally but I see on the street Asian prostitutes and also Asian gang-bangers. See, this is the kind of naivete that boils my blood because it is so entrenched. Those Asian skanks are sashaying right past you and you don't even notice them but you zero in on the black woman in tight jeans who is in fact NOT a prostitute. I go in a store with my (white) ex and she tells the store detective following us that while they are watching me $500 just walked out the store in the purses of three white women. The alarms go off and the Merchandise Retention people don't even flinch. Let one go off with a black person near it and its shoot-out at the OK Corral. I seriously hope this thread is locked by the time I wake up tomorrow. I'm on West Coast time so it should be possible. I'm all for debate and constructive argument but not the pointless rehash of tired talking points. Biased talking points.
This is pure BS.
I am Jewish and the first to admit that if I hear about a Ponzi scheme or other financial swindle I expect to see Jewish names involved. If a plane flies into a building or there's another senseless, random massacre I'll suspect, usually rightly, radical Islamists. Even the Oklahoma City bombers were trained in the Philippines. If there's a small grocery-store robbery, you can count on it not being Islamists or Jews. Let's be real rather than politically correct.
It is truly a culture thing. Over the Christmas holiday, a young black man from the Arlington, TX area came home from college up north. He and a friend decided to go up to a north Dallas suburb, and stage an invasion robbery in an apartment complex. Now the story smells like drugs were involved, because the apartment occupants moved immediately afterwards. But the upshot was that this young football player with his whole life ahead of him is now dead. He was shot and killed doing something he knew was wrong. He was shot and killed breaking the law, while armed and threatening to kill the occupants of that apartment.
He was, to all outside people, a 'good' kid. But he was raised in a culture where violence is celebrated. Where education is considered secondary. The only reason he got into that northern college was that he was a good football player. Not for grades, etc.
If you don't believe culture is a big thing, listen to the rantings of Al Sharpton, of Jeremiah Wright, of Louis Farrakahn. Listen to the words in the Rap songs you hear blasting out of the cars driven by young black teenagers. Then consider that in the 60's, most black families were nuclear, had both parents in the home. Now most black kids are raised by single mothers, with dad nowhere to be found.
It is cultural. And until successful black people stand up and tell the kids that there are alternatives, that they can succeed, that the man is not standing in their way, that you don't have to rob someone or deal drugs to have a nice car, no change will take place.
Because they won't listen otherwise, and nothing will change.
I like the response of, oh, it's the systems fault as well. Everyone knows white people get a stern warning and sent home when they commit armed robbery
Wow, how convenient for you to show your naivete. From today's New York Times:
It is truly a culture thing. Over the Christmas holiday, a young black man from the Arlington, TX area came home from college up north. He and a friend decided to go up to a north Dallas suburb, and stage an invasion robbery in an apartment complex.
***********
He was, to all outside people, a 'good' kid. But he was raised in a culture where violence is celebrated. Where education is considered secondary. The only reason he got into that northern college was that he was a good football player. Not for grades, etc
If you don't believe culture is a big thing, listen to the rantings of Al Sharpton, of Jeremiah Wright, of Louis Farrakahn.
************
It is cultural. And until successful black people stand up and tell the kids that there are alternatives, that they can succeed, that the man is not standing in their way, that you don't have to rob someone or deal drugs to have a nice car, no change will take place.
Because they won't listen otherwise, and nothing will change.
I don't think the average black teen criminal is inspired by Al Sharpton, Jeremiah Wright, Louis Farrakahn or Jesse Jackson. The black culture denigrates successful black students who do their homework for "acting white." It's the anti-assimilation culture that is the problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Restrain
Listen to the words in the Rap songs you hear blasting out of the cars driven by young black teenagers. Then consider that in the 60's, most black families were nuclear, had both parents in the home. Now most black kids are raised by single mothers, with dad nowhere to be found.
It's more than that. It's the fact that none of their peers have nuclear families. There are plenty of divorces in white, affluent, significantly Jewish Rye Brook but the children of those families have peers with intact families. So they model after people with real discipline.
This ties several current events together, and I have been giving the issue of race in america a lot of thought as a result. As a middle age white male with multiple college degrees and a solid career track, I recognize I have had opportunities everyone hasn't. But is the lack of opportunity enough to explain the disproportionate number of blacks and Hispanics in jail? in fact, minorities are disproportionately represented in all phases of the judicial process (i.e more crimes, more sentences, more recidivism). I have posted many times here on CD that I feel racism is alive and well in America, despite what anyone claims. The difference is that it isn't your fathers racism. It is subtle and less overt. White women still clutch their bag just a little tighter when a black man approaches. A white man will change his walk speed or path if a group of young black men is approaching. I think that we will always perceive those that are not like us as different, not equal. As long as all groups have the same opportunities and the same respect and are not treated differently, I maintain it should be possible to find a common place where we can exist together, but maybe not. Anyway, I recently read this article and it made so much sense to me. But I wondered if others, especially black minorities, would agree or claim that the article is simply racist. I'm not a lawyer and have no idea if the author of the article is right or wrong. But if his observations are right, it goes a long way in identifying the base problem with racism in america.
BTW, the article was written by Allen West, a black activist that I don't usually agree with.
Please tread lightly and respectfully so that a discussion can be had and the thread doesn't get locked.
And...why is it so "wrong" to clutch your handbag more closely, or walk on the other-side of the street? Isn't this part of being "streetsmart"? Will someone guarantee me that those black kids are not going to play "knock-out" game with me or anyone else? Have any Jewish or Asian young men participated in these knock-out games?
My point is, sure racism does exist. But it has always existed. What's really the problem is that many of our young black and hispanic men do not help themselves or their "people" when they continue to commit crime that is way out of proportion to their numbers. Why do I worry less when I see an Asian man walking toward me? Am I racist toward Asians, or are the Asians mostly law abiding? Just look at the statistics. Why not have the black and hispanic young men look at themselves in the mirror before they blame others for their plight.
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