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Old 01-12-2015, 04:44 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
12,287 posts, read 9,827,388 times
Reputation: 6509

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Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
I didn't say gun owners, I said gun lovers. There are plenty of normal, sane people who also own guns. I am not grouping them all into the same group.
I didn't say you, I said anti gun groups.
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Old 01-12-2015, 05:29 PM
 
Location: North America
14,204 posts, read 12,288,761 times
Reputation: 5565
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spot View Post
Yes. That is true. However, if a few people at that Paris Magazine had been armed and trained, at least they would have had a chance of stopping their attackers. Instead they died like sheep.

Guns are like parachutes, if you ever need one and don't have it you won't need it again.
Most people are not prepared to shoot a gun in a high stress atmosphere like that. You should also know from your firefights that an AK47 is going to put down a lot more firepower than a glock. The chances of the random hero jumping up and shooting all 3 assailants with military grade assault rifles is about as likely as me winning the powerball. Me thinks that you have watched Arnold S in Commando too many times :-P.
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Old 01-12-2015, 05:35 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
12,287 posts, read 9,827,388 times
Reputation: 6509
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucidkitty View Post
Most people are not prepared to shoot a gun in a high stress atmosphere like that. You should also know from your firefights that an AK47 is going to put down a lot more firepower than a glock. The chances of the random hero jumping up and shooting all 3 assailants with military grade assault rifles is about as likely as me winning the powerball. Me thinks that you have watched Arnold S in Commando too many times :-P.
Many times you don't even have to even kill them, once a threat presents itself bad guys will run, especially when they are not really trained.
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Old 01-12-2015, 05:40 PM
 
986 posts, read 2,509,574 times
Reputation: 1449
Default You have a very short attention span!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spot View Post
A friend of mines asked me why this kind of thing hasn't happened in the U.S. yet, since guns are so easy to come by in this country. I don't know the answer to his question, but I do know that if more people trained with and carried guns we could prevent/stop these kinds of attacks quickly.

The U.S. should expand concealed carry laws to all 50 states. Of course having a firearm to protect yourself when you need it should be allowed.

I go to the range several times a month to practice and I know the people that I shoot alongside of also carry. I feel much safer knowing that responsible, trained, licensed people are carrying guns in my community. I wouldn't live in a state that didn't allow it.

It's just naive to think that law enforcement is always going to be there to save you. And the anti-gun crowd needs to wake up to the realities of our World and take a little more responsibility for their own safety and the safety of their communities.

Oh, and I'm a Democrat.
Are you kidding about massacres not happening in America yet? The 2009 Fort Hood shooting was done by a Muslim and 13 people died (similar to the initial Charlie Hebdo shootings). America has seen a number of semi-Jihadist incidents and many have been thwarted, mostly because of government intelligence work, not redneck CCW packers. FYI, that's the same government that gun nuts are continually whining about (see cartoon below).

Also, look at the constant barrages of school shootings, theater shootings, mall shootings, fast food joint shootings, family massacres, accidental shootings, etc. In those public incidents, guns wouldn't have stopped most of the initial casualties because things just happen too fast. You almost have to be walking around like an old west lawman to get a draw on people. CCW folk were around in Arizona when Gabrielle Giffords was shot and one guy came close to shooting the wrong man but got wise in time. In a crowded scenario it would probably raise casualties if a bunch of weekend cowboys started firing. In a chaos scene, instantly ID-ing the actual shooters can be tricky unless they're in full Islamic garb or whatever.

Regarding the 2nd Amendment, there is no "well regulated militia" these days. It's mostly government-hating Gordon Kahl types aka "sovereign citizens" and other semi-traitorous louts who's main interest is weakening our own government in showdowns created from thin air by defying laws. "The guv'mint came after me cuz I had 50,000 rounds of ammo and a bunker!" That was never the purpose of the true militias when the Constitution was written. That segment of the 2nd Amendment is routinely ignored for context, almost as if the words are invisible!

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Old 01-12-2015, 05:43 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
46,001 posts, read 35,198,674 times
Reputation: 7875
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Many times you don't even have to even kill them, once a threat presents itself bad guys will run, especially when they are not really trained.
Or the person just escalates the situation as they reach for the gun causing the attacker to shoot. That happens too, and probably more than your scenario.
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Old 01-12-2015, 05:45 PM
 
Location: North America
14,204 posts, read 12,288,761 times
Reputation: 5565
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Many times you don't even have to even kill them, once a threat presents itself bad guys will run, especially when they are not really trained.
If they are shooting a bb gun maybe :-P.
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Old 01-12-2015, 05:49 PM
 
986 posts, read 2,509,574 times
Reputation: 1449
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
I bet the people in boko haram wish they had guns to defend themselves.
Nine days later, bodies still litter bushes from Boko Haram's 'deadliest' massacre - CNN.com

History is littered with governments who have killed millions of their own citizens, who were defenseless.
Yes, but the U.S. government is one of the fairest around, despite all its flaws, which these days are largely driven by right-wing obstructionism, science-denial and general backward thinking. G.O.P. has come to stand for Greed Over Progress.

The idiocy of gun-obsessives is that they can't tell the difference between seriously corrupt governments (Africa, Middle East) and ones that are trying to be good but are thwarted by the limits of human nature and greed. If you people would stay on the side of America (regardless of who's President) you'd be the patriots you claim to be.

I don't have a big problem with guns per se, though assault rifles send a bad psychological message and should be limited in civilian hands. The biggest problem with guns is the people who wrap themselves up emotionally in pieces of metal. I've come to see guns as a tool for cowards and degenerate ranters more than anything. I'll name-drop draft dodger and wildlife thrill killer Ted Nugent as a good celebrity example. Uncle Ted is about as patriotic as Tim McVeigh, though not as dangerous; it's the people he riles up that I worry about.
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Old 01-12-2015, 06:18 PM
 
32,027 posts, read 36,808,281 times
Reputation: 13311
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mouser View Post
26 Step FIREARMS REFRESHER COURSE

1. An armed man is a citizen. An unarmed man is a subject.
2. A gun in the hand is better than a cop on the phone.
3. Colt: The original point and click interface.
4. Gun control is not about guns; it's about control.
5. If guns are outlawed, can we use swords?
6. If guns cause crime, then pencils cause misspelled words.
7. "Free" men do not ask permission to bear arms.
8. If you don't know your rights you don't have any.
9. Those who trade liberty for security have neither.
10. The United States Constitution (c) 1791. All Rights reserved.
11. What part of "shall not be infringed" do you not understand?
12. The Second Amendment is in place in case the politicians ignore the others.
13. 64,999,987 firearms owners killed no one yesterday.
14. Guns only have two enemies: rust and politicians.
15. Know guns, know peace, know safety. No guns, no peace, no safety.
16. You don't shoot to kill; you shoot to stay alive.
17. 911 - government sponsored Dial-a-Prayer.
18. Assault is a behavior, not a device.
19. Criminals love gun control -- it makes their jobs safer.
20. If guns cause crime, then matches cause arson.
21. Only a government that is afraid of its citizens tries to control them.
22. You only have the rights you are willing to fight for.
23. Enforce the "gun control laws" we ALREADY have, don't make more.
24. When you remove the people's right to bear arms, you create slaves.
25. The American Revolution would never have happened with gun control.
26. "A government of the people, by the people, for the people..."

Better to be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
Well said.
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Old 01-12-2015, 06:35 PM
 
Location: Phoenix
30,385 posts, read 19,184,321 times
Reputation: 26294
The2nd Amendment wouldn't have stopped that type of attack...they had Ak's. It would have given some of those guys a chance to save their lives though.
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Old 01-12-2015, 07:14 PM
 
Location: SF Bay Area
12,287 posts, read 9,827,388 times
Reputation: 6509
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Or the person just escalates the situation as they reach for the gun causing the attacker to shoot. That happens too, and probably more than your scenario.
You should watch the videos of bad guys confronted by good guys with guns. They almost always run away. People tend to not want to get shot.
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