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Old 01-27-2015, 08:15 AM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,737,754 times
Reputation: 9325

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Program after program fails after spending billions of our tax payer funds. Here is a good analysis of why government money cannot solve the poverty problem. Indeed, Big Government is not the solution, it's the problem.
------------------

The recent history of Camden, New Jersey, which is the poorest small city in America, provides a case study of the tragic ineffectiveness of government programs at ameliorating poverty. State and federal taxpayers have spent hundreds of millions of dollars on various redevelopment programs in Camden over the years, but the money never ended up where it was supposed to and the promised revival of this fallen manufacturing town never happened.

By far, the largest initiative to combat poverty with government largess has been directed at Camden's public schools. New Jersey spends about 60% more on education per pupil than the national average according to 2012 census figures, or about $19,000 in 2013. In Camden, per pupil spending was more than $25,000 in 2013, making it one of the highest spending districts in the nation.

But all that extra money hasn’t changed the fact that Camden’s public schools are among in the worst in the nation, notorious for their abysmal test scores, the frequent occurrence of in-school violence, dilapidated buildings, and an on-time graduation rate of just 61 percent.

This Impoverished City Hiked Spending to $25,000 per Student to Fix Its Schools. And Nothing Changed. - Reason.com
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Old 01-27-2015, 08:39 AM
 
4,873 posts, read 3,601,591 times
Reputation: 3881
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Indeed, Big Government is not the solution, it's the problem.
So you're saying... if only we spent less money on schools, Camden would be booming?
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Old 01-27-2015, 08:41 AM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,737,754 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankMiller View Post
So you're saying... if only we spent less money on schools, Camden would be booming?
No, you said that.

Try reading the OP again. Or maybe even watch the video. You might learn something.
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Old 01-27-2015, 08:52 AM
 
Location: Kent, Ohio
3,429 posts, read 2,733,024 times
Reputation: 1667
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Indeed, Big Government is not the solution, it's the problem.
The central theme of the video is that corruption and mismanagement were the key problems. If government necessarily implies corruption and mismanagement, then I would agree that government itself is the problem. I am inclined to think, however, that government, per se, is not the problem. Bad government is the problem. As I see it, the main question is to figure out how to ensure that government funding is used the way that it was intended to be used.

I suspect that real solutions will cost money, so simply reducing funding or cutting government won't necessarily be solutions. Better government seems like the more desirable goal. Tighter audits to track money might help? Point-pointing accountability for government officials might help? If the money could be used more wisely, then, it seems, the level of funding perhaps could go down, thanks to higher efficiency in the spending.

Bottom line: The best way to cut government spending is to increase the efficiency of government spending. The big question is: How do we do that? I've pointed to a couple of obvious general ideas, but there must be better ideas out there. The video recommends charter schools. Any other suggestions?

Last edited by Gaylenwoof; 01-27-2015 at 09:12 AM..
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:44 AM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,617,602 times
Reputation: 18521
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
Program after program fails after spending billions of our tax payer funds. Here is a good analysis of why government money cannot solve the poverty problem. Indeed, Big Government is not the solution, it's the problem.
------------------

The recent history of Camden, New Jersey, which is the poorest small city in America, provides a case study of the tragic ineffectiveness of government programs at ameliorating poverty. State and federal taxpayers have spent hundreds of millions of dollars on various redevelopment programs in Camden over the years, but the money never ended up where it was supposed to and the promised revival of this fallen manufacturing town never happened.

By far, the largest initiative to combat poverty with government largess has been directed at Camden's public schools. New Jersey spends about 60% more on education per pupil than the national average according to 2012 census figures, or about $19,000 in 2013. In Camden, per pupil spending was more than $25,000 in 2013, making it one of the highest spending districts in the nation.

But all that extra money hasn’t changed the fact that Camden’s public schools are among in the worst in the nation, notorious for their abysmal test scores, the frequent occurrence of in-school violence, dilapidated buildings, and an on-time graduation rate of just 61 percent.

This Impoverished City Hiked Spending to $25,000 per Student to Fix Its Schools. And Nothing Changed. - Reason.com


Putting a band-aid on the symptoms, never cures the problem.

Parenting... Or more specifically, the lack of.
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Old 01-27-2015, 10:48 AM
 
11,086 posts, read 8,543,209 times
Reputation: 6392
The money gets stolen by the poverty mafia.
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Old 01-27-2015, 11:22 AM
 
4,873 posts, read 3,601,591 times
Reputation: 3881
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadking2003 View Post
No, you said that.

Try reading the OP again. Or maybe even watch the video. You might learn something.
This isn't Reddit. If you want me to understand your point, make it in your post.
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Old 01-27-2015, 11:32 AM
Status: "Apparently the worst poster on CD" (set 27 days ago)
 
27,647 posts, read 16,129,622 times
Reputation: 19064
you can count on them to do a great job at flushing$
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Old 01-27-2015, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,737,754 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gaylenwoof View Post
The central theme of the video is that corruption and mismanagement were the key problems. If government necessarily implies corruption and mismanagement, then I would agree that government itself is the problem. I am inclined to think, however, that government, per se, is not the problem. Bad government is the problem. As I see it, the main question is to figure out how to ensure that government funding is used the way that it was intended to be used.
Almost every government program that doles out other people's money is a total failure. Billions and trillions of dollars being doled out attracts crooks by the thousands and incompetent management that has no stake in the game. So we should not be surprised by these failures.

Quote:
I suspect that real solutions will cost money, so simply reducing funding or cutting government won't necessarily be solutions. Better government seems like the more desirable goal. Tighter audits to track money might help? Point-pointing accountability for government officials might help? If the money could be used more wisely, then, it seems, the level of funding perhaps could go down, thanks to higher efficiency in the spending.
You are assuming that dumping money into a school system is the correct solution. There is no evidence of that.

Quote:
Bottom line: The best way to cut government spending is to increase the efficiency of government spending. The big question is: How do we do that? I've pointed to a couple of obvious general ideas, but there must be better ideas out there. The video recommends charter schools. Any other suggestions?
No, the best way to cut government spending and waste is to get the Feds out of education.
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Old 01-27-2015, 03:35 PM
 
Location: Dallas
31,290 posts, read 20,737,754 times
Reputation: 9325
Quote:
Originally Posted by FrankMiller View Post
So you're saying... if only we spent less money on schools, Camden would be booming?
No. I didn't say that or anything like it. That's the point. But you know that.
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