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Yes, of course, but simply because Jenner's actions would have been more courageous in the 70's than today doesn't mean that Jenner's actions today are less courageous than Hill's actions today.
I think Jenner's actions are courageous, and I do hope that people feel free to pursue whatever makes them happy (within certain limits). I am posting on this thread, however, because I think people are fundamentally mis-comparing Jenner's actions to Hill's. They are comparing the plight of cancer victims with Jenner's "plight," and concluding that Hill should have won. That is bad reasoning given the purpose of the award.
Sure, Ms. Courageous spent the weekend with galpals poolside looking into the mountains [for the fashionistas, she wore a blouse with denim jeans and pink wedges], travelled to San Francisco. She'll have the agonizing decision over whether to accept an offer to judge the Miss USA pageant. The dreadful prospect of conflicts between her tv mini-series and her reality show[s]. Suffering through the hours of makeup and wardrobe decisions before public appearances, knowing she's a role model and inspiration.
I grasp why a business like ESPN took advantage of the controversy and publicity. How a regular person can equate Jenner's decision to how Hill faced her adversity is bizarre.
The fact that many people do face disease with courage, grace, and even good humor as Hill did, doesn't detract from her, nor add an iota to the so-called courage of Jenner.
It matters because if this is a thing some people experience, and that's behavior exhibited by them, it helps to know that you aren't just trying to make a statement on my lawn, you're doing something you cannot help. I may not like what you're doing to my lawn, but I'll be more understanding of it.
Could be you're just having a mental breakdown. And I'd be more understanding of that.
Or you could be an aggressive moron with no filter and no boundaries trying to make a statement of disrespect, in which case my feelings will shift and I'll take your behavior personally.
But I would leave it up to experts who know far more than I and defer to them about what's behind your behavior. I'm an expert in my field, not theirs.
Sure, Ms. Courageous spent the weekend with galpals poolside looking into the mountains [for the fashionistas, she wore a blouse with denim jeans and pink wedges], travelled to San Francisco. She'll have the agonizing decision over whether to accept an offer to judge the Miss USA pageant. The dreadful prospect of conflicts between her tv mini-series and her reality show[s]. Suffering through the hours of makeup and wardrobe decisions before public appearances, knowing she's a role model and inspiration.
To some. To many many others (the majority, I'd say) she's a freak and a disgrace. I don't begrudge her any satisfaction she can get out of it after living with it suppressed for so long.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzarama
I grasp why a business like ESPN took advantage of the controversy and publicity. How a regular person can equate Jenner's decision to how Hill faced her adversity is bizarre.
The fact that many people do face disease with courage, grace, and even good humor as Hill did, doesn't detract from her, nor add an iota to the so-called courage of Jenner.
By the same token, Jenner is facing an entirely different battle, which is not equivalent and I don't know why anyone is equating it in either a positive or negative way.
IMHO, it is indeed brave to decide to come out in the face of public digust and ridicule. Many have either lived a lie or offed themselves rather than face that daunting prospect.
There's enough of us to bestow us much kudos on as many as we feel worthy. I don't see why we have to ration it.
Sure, Ms. Courageous spent the weekend with galpals poolside looking into the mountains [for the fashionistas, she wore a blouse with denim jeans and pink wedges], travelled to San Francisco. She'll have the agonizing decision over whether to accept an offer to judge the Miss USA pageant. The dreadful prospect of conflicts between her tv mini-series and her reality show[s]. Suffering through the hours of makeup and wardrobe decisions before public appearances, knowing she's a role model and inspiration.
I grasp why a business like ESPN took advantage of the controversy and publicity. How a regular person can equate Jenner's decision to how Hill faced her adversity is bizarre.
The fact that many people do face disease with courage, grace, and even good humor as Hill did, doesn't detract from her, nor add an iota to the so-called courage of Jenner.
Typically a person going through a gender transforming process would like to keep it private. I don't see the case here, as it seems to be a commercialized process.
To some. To many many others (the majority, I'd say) she's a freak and a disgrace. I don't begrudge her any satisfaction she can get out of it after living with it suppressed for so long.
By the same token, Jenner is facing an entirely different battle, which is not equivalent and I don't know why anyone is equating it in either a positive or negative way.
IMHO, it is indeed brave to decide to come out in the face of public digust and ridicule. Many have either lived a lie or offed themselves rather than face that daunting prospect.
There's enough of us to bestow us much kudos on as many as we feel worthy. I don't see why we have to ration it.
Oh please. It's not like Jenner's some poor unknown oddball who's options are zero or who's friends, family, business associates would consider a transformation sickening or shameful, who'd be ostracized and rejected. Jenner lived a lie for most of his life. At this point, do you think he gives a rat's patootie about some ridicule on message boards while getting kudos from the prez, courage awards, tv shows, etc..
The thread about Jenner receiving the Arthur Ashe Courage Award was merged with this one. I don't particularly care if Jenner is or was a man or woman. I don't think his decision took much courage.
Oh please. It's not like Jenner's some poor unknown oddball who's options are zero or who's friends, family, business associates would consider a transformation sickening or shameful, who'd be ostracized and rejected. Jenner lived a lie for most of his life. At this point, do you think he gives a rat's patootie about some ridicule on message boards while getting kudos from the prez, courage awards, tv shows, etc..
I hope he doesn't. I sincerely do. But if you think the thought of ridicule has only crossed his mind now, when according to him he's been doing this in private since he's eight, then I think you'd be wrong.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jazzarama
The thread about Jenner receiving the Arthur Ashe Courage Award was merged with this one. I don't particularly care if Jenner is or was a man or woman. I don't think his decision took much courage.
Of course it did. He has a whole family to deal with. I can't believe it's easy even now, unless he's a complete sociopath. Plus, it's one thing to dream about doing something radical, and another to actually do it.
Did you see the women who asked her son each day if he felt like a girl that day or a boy? Makes me wonder if this was Bruce's upbringing. What some can do to their kids, HUH?
Let me ask you a question, do you want medical researchers to try to figure out cures for homosexuality and transsexualism?
Since I'm cisgendered and heterosexual I have no interest in the matter. I'll defer to what actual transgender and homosexual people want.
But I would hazard a guess that a lot of them would want to be changed. Imagine what the (inevitably) gay Duggar child(ren) is/are going through right now. I bet they'd do anything to be straight. I'll bet there are also a lot who are happy the way they are. At least there is a lot we can do already to fix trans people, with hormones, surgery and pre-puberty treatment.
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