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Old 02-17-2015, 05:48 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
5,294 posts, read 10,209,468 times
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Yes, I read that as well in the Atlantic, and it makes a lot of sense. But it is still a religious terrorism organization--which is why they're so concerned with the doomsday thing.

 
Old 02-17-2015, 05:57 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
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I agree that they're a doomsday cult. I also think that most of the Middle East, and most of Islam, is stuck in a medieval mindset. They've never had an enlightenment, a renaissance, a Thomas Paine or Voltaire or any concept of healthy secular humanism or human rights for that matter.
 
Old 02-17-2015, 06:00 PM
 
Location: Flawduh
17,203 posts, read 15,390,629 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaii4evr View Post
Yes, I read that as well in the Atlantic, and it makes a lot of sense. But it is still a religious terrorism organization--which is why they're so concerned with the doomsday thing.
Most of these lunatics are people who were easy targets to recruit: depressed youth, suicidal, lost causes to society. The leaders of this radical group know that these idiots can easily be brainwashed. Had they not joined ISIL, they would have still committed crime. The difference is that, when all assembled in one rather large army, and claiming all of their actions in the name of religion, they are able to do much more damage than they would had they all acted individually.
 
Old 02-17-2015, 06:00 PM
 
Location: Philadelphia
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Sadly, I doubt they ever will reform. Many, MANY of these so-called "moderates" secretly agree (at least partially) with terrorist organizations, even if they won't go out and murder themselves. In addition, there's a major difference between Christianity and Islam in terms of violence. Christianity DID spread through violent, horrific acts, but Jesus never preached this--corrupt Church officials and monarchs used violent verses and passages to support their views, but Jesus only preached love. The perfect Christian would emulate Jesus and his message.

On the other hand, Mohammed not only preached violence and hatred, but he acted on it by going around and slaughtering people in the name of Islam and Allah. The "true Muslims" or "perfect Muslims" seek to emulate Mohammed, the final prophet and founder of their "religion".
 
Old 02-17-2015, 06:19 PM
 
296 posts, read 260,121 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arcenal352 View Post
All of this rests in the hands of Congress, right now. The cool thing to do is just to blame Obama for everything. He's already proposed a war against ISIL. Congress needs to approve of it.
Actually that is not what he proposed. What he has proposed is more US support of terrorist organisations. ( FSA ) Similar to the action he took against Libya when he supported the terrorist National Congress. When ISIS first started to behead prisoners, Obama was dead against the US taking military action.
He made some statement like "playing wack a mole on the world stage". It was the Republicans in congress ( + the US public outcry ) that forced him into bombing ISIS targets.
What Obama wants is control of Syria, this can only be achieved with US backed terrorists, so he wants congress to agree to send arms to the "friendly" terrorists. Congress so far have seen through this, thus the impass.
 
Old 02-17-2015, 06:21 PM
 
Location: Southern MN
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Now I just heard a news report that the President was blaming the internet for the (his words) "escalation of violence" in the Middle East. For crying out loud.

Although I have to admit taking that tack would fit in nicely with government oversee of the 'net.

I can't disagree with Arcenal about the condition of the young men being attracted to the carnage but I hardly think the solution at this stage of things is focusing on securing employment for them. And we need to remember that the people calling the shots aren't at a loss for education. Seems many of them speak perfect English. I suspect their motivation is a larger one than securing a martyr's death.

To allow this to continue without severe repercussions so far has served to embolden them. Where will the line be drawn? It's become a cliché but it's hard not to notice the similarity to conditions prior to WWII. Makes me wonder who is making money.
 
Old 02-17-2015, 06:24 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,650 posts, read 60,925,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodestar View Post
Now I just heard a news report that the President was blaming the internet for the (his words) "escalation of violence" in the Middle East. For crying out loud.

Although I have to admit taking that tack would fit in nicely with government oversee of the 'net.

I can't disagree with Arcenal about the condition of the young men being attracted to the carnage but I hardly think the solution at this stage of things is focusing on securing employment for them. And we need to remember that the people calling the shots aren't at a loss for education. Seems many of them speak perfect English. I suspect their motivation is a larger one than securing a martyr's death.

To allow this to continue without severe repercussions so far has served to embolden them. Where will the line be drawn? It's become a cliché but it's hard not to notice the similarity to conditions prior to WWII. Makes me wonder who is making money.
Right. Follow the money. That's going to be a challenge though.

It really does remind me of the 1930s throughout Europe. I'm reading an excellent book on that time period right now and over and over again I catch myself thinking, "These journalists/politicians/diplomats sound exactly like the ones today!" In other words, inept and clueless.
 
Old 02-17-2015, 10:37 PM
 
Location: Southern MN
12,042 posts, read 8,421,785 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KathrynAragon View Post
Right. Follow the money. That's going to be a challenge though.

It really does remind me of the 1930s throughout Europe. I'm reading an excellent book on that time period right now and over and over again I catch myself thinking, "These journalists/politicians/diplomats sound exactly like the ones today!" In other words, inept and clueless.
I'd like to know what you're reading. It's getting increasingly difficult to keep up with all the versions of what passes for news these days.

Maybe they aren't as clueless as they appear to be? It's hard to know.

Certainly common sense still exists in this world and when decisions are made which appear beyond reason you have to wonder what exactly is going on.

Sounds like the "NY Times" knew what was going on in Europe leading up to and during WWII and had reason to keep it low-key.

Here's a book that has recently caught my attention:

Buried by the Times - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
Old 02-17-2015, 11:37 PM
 
Location: Wonderland
67,650 posts, read 60,925,505 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lodestar View Post
I'd like to know what you're reading. It's getting increasingly difficult to keep up with all the versions of what passes for news these days.

Maybe they aren't as clueless as they appear to be? It's hard to know.

Certainly common sense still exists in this world and when decisions are made which appear beyond reason you have to wonder what exactly is going on.

Sounds like the "NY Times" knew what was going on in Europe leading up to and during WWII and had reason to keep it low-key.

Here's a book that has recently caught my attention:

Buried by the Times - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
I'm reading "In the Garden of Beasts" by Erik Larson. So far, it's excellent. It's the true story of the American ambassador to Germany in the 1930s - Dodd was his name - and his family's time there. For awhile, he and his family were lulled or charmed into Nazi circles - but realized with growing horror what they had been lured into. It's a fascinating read and a look inside the minds of people, especially politicians, who are more concerned with diplomacy and keeping things on a "steady keel" than they are concerned with principles and moral absolutes.

I am definitely going to check out your book recommendation!

Another excellent book, that I need to reread, was written by Dietrich Bonhoeffer - a minister who was imprisoned by the SS in Dachau for refusing to placate and ***** foot around the Nazi movement. That book is "The Cost of Discipleship" and is more Christian in nature but it's message is basically that no matter the cost, we must stand firm to our values and what we know to be right, even in the face of death. It's a short book but a powerful one, especially since he was hung at Dachau a few months after finishing this book.
 
Old 02-18-2015, 03:10 AM
 
Location: Sydney, Australia
11,655 posts, read 12,956,707 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawaii4evr View Post
The issue is that President Obama doesn't really have a solid plan on how to deal with ISIS. Furthermore, his idiotic comments about the Crusades, ISIS being "un-Islamic", and "random attacks" against Jews in Europe, mostly by Muslims, further discredit him in the eyes of Congress. For goodness sake, the President can't even bring himself to admit that ISIS is a part of a larger Islamist scheme. He refuses to even say they are "radical Muslims", and instead say "death cult".
I couldn't agree more. So sad, because I actually support the man and thought he was one of the better presidents (although I'm not from the US).

Political correctness has gone way out of control.
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