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We, the USA, created Israel in 1948.
We put them right in the middle of hell, with the assurance of our protection.
Now you want satan to kill them, because we have no time for them today, according to you.
WE created Israel? Really?
We gave them the assurance of our protection when they were created? Really?
Give me the evidence of this obligation that you've encumbered me with.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ellis Bell
Allegiance to America?
Better to keep a friend, than to make that friend an enemy, because one may never know when the 'help' of a friend may be needed.
EDIT PS: That is what the 3,500 year old book is tell us, yet, it is a apparently something that can be said, 1,000 time over and still, we don't get it. ~sad ~
The 'help' of that friend isn't enough help to save this country should we be in peril. So i'm not so sure that the friendship is worth the trouble.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMoreJuice
Quote:
What does the creation of Israel have to do with the Democrats boycotting PM Netanyahu's speech about Iran?
Nothing.
But there's nothing wrong with them boycotting his speech. They have no obligation to listen to him.
Quote:
Since you openly stated you do not support the existence of Israel, I will consider you an enemy to the existence of my people
.
I don't "support" it either. What does that even mean? What's all this "existence" stuff all about?
Do i think Israel has a RIGHT to the land they inhabit? Yes. But only so long as they can hold and defend it. If some other group can take, hold and defend it, then THEY have a right to it. That's how it works no matter what nation it is.
So i 'support' Israel's right to exist in the same way that i 'support' Fiji's right to exist. No more and no less.
The 'help' of that friend isn't enough help to save this country should we be in peril. So i'm not so sure that the friendship is worth the trouble.
So how much help is enough, so as to continue to call them a friend?
Quote:
I don't "support" it either. What does that even mean? What's all this "existence" stuff all about?
Do i think Israel has a RIGHT to the land they inhabit? Yes. But only so long as they can hold and defend it. If some other group can take, hold and defend it, then THEY have a right to it. That's how it works no matter what nation it is.
So i 'support' Israel's right to exist in the same way that i 'support' Fiji's right to exist. No more and no less.
Okay---If the U.S. (right to exist) came under fire and we were not able to hold our own (shifting that shoe to the other foot) then by your analysis, the U.S. wouldn't have the right to exist either? Yes? Correct?
What language would you like to learn and speak, Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese or perhaps you'd like to pay taxes to Islam. btw, there is no support of a friend that is good enough to help out with that as the bridges of friendship(s) were all burned.
The rest of the world will stand by and watch; go well that's a shame, then go on about their business as usual, just as we may have done them.
Be ever so careful as today's freedoms could be tomorrow's servitude. The U.S. is not above a take over and if people don't know that's right then, people haven't been paying attention.
So proud I don't live next door to a lot of people whom I've seen what the say, cause if I ever needed a cup of sugar, I'd be hard pressed to be able to 'borrow' one. If I ever really needed help with an emergency, omg...they probably wouldn't even dial 911.
So how much help is enough, so as to continue to call them a friend?
Okay---If the U.S. (right to exist) came under fire and we were not able to hold our own (shifting that shoe to the other foot) then by your analysis, the U.S. wouldn't have the right to exist either? Yes? Correct?
What language would you like to learn and speak, Chinese, Korean, Vietnamese or perhaps you'd like to pay taxes to Islam. btw, there is no support of a friend that is good enough to help out with that as the bridges of friendship(s) were all burned.
The rest of the world will stand by and watch; go well that's a shame, then go on about their business as usual, just as we may have done them.
Be ever so careful as today's freedoms could be tomorrow's servitude. The U.S. is not above a take over and if people don't know that's right then, people haven't been paying attention.
So proud I don't live next door to a lot of people whom I've seen what the say, cause if I ever needed a cup of sugar, I'd be hard pressed to be able to 'borrow' one. If I ever really needed help with an emergency, omg...they probably wouldn't even dial 911.
~sad~
How much help is enough?
When it comes to Israel, whatever help we're giving them now is TOO MUCH. Israel is supposedly the most powerful nation in their region, and they don't need our help. They can more than stand themselves up on their own without American interference or American money. We can and should be friends because we share certain values, but we shouldn't be military allies or have any kind of mutual defense treaty.
I don't believe in permanent allies.
Moreover, our unqualified support of them has cost us our standing in the Arab world and frankly, a good relationship with the Arabs is just as if not more important than our relationship with Israel. We had excellent standing in the Middle East before Israel's creation, and that standing should be (if we were fair arbiters) just as good now as it was then. The fact that it isn't is not the fault of the Arabs...it's our fault.
And yeah...the same principle applies to the United States relative to our existence. We took the land piece by piece from others, and should someone more powerful find a way to take it from us, then our right to exist is over...until we can find a way to take it back somehow IF that's even possible.
That's the story of human existence. No nation has an inherent right to exist. Not one.
So folks can miss me with that "right to exist" stuff. I don't believe in that either.
When it comes to Israel, whatever help we're giving them now is TOO MUCH. Israel is supposedly the most powerful nation in their region, and they don't need our help. They can more than stand themselves up on their own without American interference or American money. We can and should be friends because we share certain values, but we shouldn't be military allies or have any kind of mutual defense treaty.
I don't believe in permanent allies.
Moreover, our unqualified support of them has cost us our standing in the Arab world and frankly, a good relationship with the Arabs is just as if not more important than our relationship with Israel. We had excellent standing in the Middle East before Israel's creation, and that standing should be (if we were fair arbiters) just as good now as it was then. The fact that it isn't is not the fault of the Arabs...it's our fault.
And yeah...the same principle applies to the United States relative to our existence. We took the land piece by piece from others, and should someone more powerful find a way to take it from us, then our right to exist is over...until we can find a way to take it back somehow IF that's even possible.
That's the story of human existence. No nation has an inherent right to exist. Not one.
So folks can miss me with that "right to exist" stuff. I don't believe in that either.
Bibi's been on the float in the parade selling Iranian wolf tickets for 20 years, attempting to suck others into his personal windmill tilt. We've been hearing Iran is "months away from nukes " for years now. Enough is enough.
Bibi should read the tale of the boy who cried wolf and take heed.
What are we missing here?
Hasn't the sanctions we have put upon them, kept them from nuking Israel?
Why would President Obama ask Iran to help destroy ISIS?
Last edited by wildflower82; 03-10-2015 at 06:13 PM..
I hope Netanyahu is defeated and Herzog takes his place. The whole trip to Washington and speech was nothing more than an attempt to bolster Bibi's waning support in Israel.
I hope Netanyahu is defeated and Herzog takes his place. The whole trip to Washington and speech was nothing more than an attempt to bolster Bibi's waning support in Israel.
Add to that the idiot 47 who sent that letter to the Iranians, and I hope the Israeli people realize that Netanyahu + the Republicans = War, and throw that warmonger out of office.
I don't "support" it either. What does that even mean? What's all this "existence" stuff all about?
Do i think Israel has a RIGHT to the land they inhabit? Yes. But only so long as they can hold and defend it. If some other group can take, hold and defend it, then THEY have a right to it. That's how it works no matter what nation it is.
So i 'support' Israel's right to exist in the same way that i 'support' Fiji's right to exist. No more and no less.
The original topic is about the Republican Congress sending a letter to Iran. I view this action within the context that Obama has refused to consult Congress for a compromised deal. Why does he not consult with Congress? Why is his deal ambiguous? His lack of transparency about his deal tells me that his deal is disadvantageous.
Israel has done much in defending itself. Israel has also done much work for U.S security. Your personal opinion about Israel's right to exist does not change the strategic importance of Israel to the United States.
I hope Netanyahu is defeated and Herzog takes his place. The whole trip to Washington and speech was nothing more than an attempt to bolster Bibi's waning support in Israel.
I disagree. While politics is always involved, Netanyahu put his career on the line to make this speech. Netanyahu is sincerely trying to warn the Obama Administration that it may make a mistake it can never fix.
When it comes to Israel, whatever help we're giving them now is TOO MUCH. Israel is supposedly the most powerful nation in their region, and they don't need our help. They can more than stand themselves up on their own without American interference or American money. We can and should be friends because we share certain values, but we shouldn't be military allies or have any kind of mutual defense treaty.
I don't believe in permanent allies.
Moreover, our unqualified support of them has cost us our standing in the Arab world and frankly, a good relationship with the Arabs is just as if not more important than our relationship with Israel. We had excellent standing in the Middle East before Israel's creation, and that standing should be (if we were fair arbiters) just as good now as it was then. The fact that it isn't is not the fault of the Arabs...it's our fault.
And yeah...the same principle applies to the United States relative to our existence. We took the land piece by piece from others, and should someone more powerful find a way to take it from us, then our right to exist is over...until we can find a way to take it back somehow IF that's even possible.
That's the story of human existence. No nation has an inherent right to exist. Not one.
So folks can miss me with that "right to exist" stuff. I don't believe in that either.
I am baffled on the amount of inaccurate fallacies in this post.
This Ron Paul vision of the world is not feasible, as globalization has complicated it.
The United States never had "good standing" with the Arab countries in the first place. European Post-Imperialism left a sour taste in the Arab World. United States secular lifestyle was frowned upon by Salafist and those in power. While there are examples of allied ship over self interest, most of the partnerships today are based on economics. While Israel can never be accepted in the Middle East by Arab culture, Arab countries has aligned with Israel today over self interests. Egypt, Jordan, KSA, Gulf States have made some temporary alliances with Israel over self interests against terrorism and Iran.
So contrary to your opinion, Military allies and defense treaties are actually creating pacts of stability in a tinderbox region.
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