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Excuse me, but Christian Europeans in the most developed European nation at the time (Germany/Austria) less than 70 years ago murdered 6 million Jews for nothing more than the fact that they were Jewish.
I understand that the MODERN DAY Christian and Jewish world is more peaceful than the Muslim world at large is. The question is why the Islamic world has perpetual upheaval. And although religion plays a part, it's only a minor part of the equation.
Well, I used the term hundreds of years ago in reference to the OP, but I guess in that case, I should have said thousands.
I am not even going to get into the Holocaust, and whether Hitler used Christian beliefs as his justification for murder, just dont have the time for that one right now.
Bottom line for me, looking to the past to justify crimes done today is ridiculous, and the left consistently does just that in regards to radical islam.
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Originally Posted by RubyTwo
Bottom line for me, looking to the past to justify crimes done today is ridiculous, and the left consistently does just that in regards to radical islam.
And conveniently closing one's eyes to atrocities that have been committed in the name of other Gods in history as the right consistently does is a better plan? I believe George Santayana would disagree with that idea.
Personally, given the volume of atrocities committed in the more than 5,000 names for God in recorded history I'm quite happy to remain away from all the religions invented by men and subject to all the weaknesses of men that entails.
Age mystically makes bad things good? How old's it need to be? Is drowning someone to prove they're not a witch considered to have been acceptable behavior now?
No, but things done by people who've been dead for 2,000 YEARS ago isn't exactly a valid comparison compared to what someone did YESTERDAY, except in the mind of a liberal attempting some bizarre mental connection. I hope you warmed up before that kind of stretch or you'll hurt yourself.
Not really, beyond the acts of the apostles there is very little support for Jewish violence against early followers of Christ. Likely any such violence was restricted to Judea and related to the charge of sedition that Jesus likely faced. The numbers of the early Church are also blown out of proportion.
The persecution of the early church increased when the high priest said to Peter
‘Did we not strictly command you not to teach in this name?’, and Peter replied
‘We ought to obey God rather than men. The God of our fathers raised up Jesus whom you murdered. Him God has exalted to His right hand to be Prince and Savior, to give repentance to Israel and forgiveness of sins.’
Acts 4:4 ‘many of those who heard the word believed, and the number of the men came to be about five thousand’.
Acts 6:1 ‘Now in those days, when the number of the disciples was multiplying’.
At this time, by conservative estimates, there were between 20,000 and 25,000 disciples in Jerusalem.
I would reckon that the Catholic and Protestant Churches still rack up the greatest death toll of any religion. The Islamic stuff happening now is sick, but it isn't on the level of people killed as there was in previous times. Although Muslims did kill quite a few back in the day too in India and other places.
Why did they do it? Because persecution absolutely squashes any sort of religious view besides those that are allowed. The Catholic (and Orthodox, same difference) and the few later Protestant denominations dictated the religious views of a lot of the world for more than 1500 years. A lot of Christians say persecution further fueled church expansion. That's a lie. Persecution always squashes church expansion.
Look at the amount of denominations/religions at the time of Christ. They exploded and were everywhere under a period of religious freedom during Roman times. Look at the amount of denominations/religions founded since the 1800s, literally thousands. Look at the amount in the time between, relatively few.
No, but things done by people who've been dead for 2,000 YEARS ago isn't exactly a valid comparison compared to what someone did YESTERDAY, except in the mind of a liberal attempting some bizarre mental connection. I hope you warmed up before that kind of stretch or you'll hurt yourself.
Speaking of 'stretch', this is what I was attempting to accomplish with my post. I am not anti-semetic. The greatist men who ever walked this earth were the first Jewish Christians. Remember that 'Jewishness' is a bloodline, namely that of Abraham, Issac and Jacob.
Violence perpetrated in the name of religion is almost always political in nature - a grab for power. Are the Sunni Muslims in Saudi Arabia fighting the Shiite Muslims in Iran because of a disagreement in who should be carrying the mantle of Islam? Don't think so. Likewise, the Jewish leaders saw the Christians as a threat to their power. The things the Euripeans did oin the name of Christianity had nothing to do with the teachings of Jesus Christ, but were done for the age-old reasons of greed and power.
I am not defending what the Muslims are doing. I am looking at the root cause of what they are doing in the name of religion.
Ok well if you want to argue over semantics then, Jewish and Christian PEOPLE have evolved to the point to not take everything written in the bible as an absolute truth and basis for committing bad deeds.
Is that sufficient?
maybe we Christians are a bit better today than we were say a thousand years ago?
follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see God....
maybe we arent there yet but at least we dont wear crosses on our shirts and run around killing everyone in the name of God?
Speaking of 'stretch', this is what I was attempting to accomplish with my post. I am not anti-semetic. The greatist men who ever walked this earth were the first Jewish Christians. Remember that 'Jewishness' is a bloodline, namely that of Abraham, Issac and Jacob.
Violence perpetrated in the name of religion is almost always political in nature - a grab for power. Are the Sunni Muslims in Saudi Arabia fighting the Shiite Muslims in Iran because of a disagreement in who should be carrying the mantle of Islam? Don't think so. Likewise, the Jewish leaders saw the Christians as a threat to their power. The things the Euripeans did oin the name of Christianity had nothing to do with the teachings of Jesus Christ, but were done for the age-old reasons of greed and power.
I am not defending what the Muslims are doing. I am looking at the root cause of what they are doing in the name of religion.
Politics were most definitely a part of the Violence and power grabs, but I think just doctrinal disagreements and "heretical" teachings resulted in a lot of bloodshed too. Look what happened to the Arian Christian doctrine. Some of its purging was political in nature and some was religious feuds. I don't think you can say it was politics alone. Saudi Arabia's current issues are theological and not political in nature.
It's a shocker that Jews murdered their fellow faith adherents and non-Jews?
LMAO...maybe some of you should read your Old Testaments again. The Pentateuch is a compendium of some of the most shocking violence you can imagine. Name the crime...it's in there. Murder, rape, kidnapping, pillaging, genocide, pedophilia, slavery, etc...
And let's be clear; the Jewish record is no worse than the record of any other religion. But it's no better either.
Wow, this is amazing people were even evil then! Goes to show some people change while others remain the same.
Some even blame others for 2000 yr old history......these people drive cars, use computers and have cell phones, their excuses are just that, it's Sharia believing Muslims wanting to stay in the stone age. When the world stops making excuses of 2000 yr old history we might be able to win. Until then the evil will grow......
maybe we Christians are a bit better today than we were say a thousand years ago?
follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see God....
maybe we arent there yet but at least we dont wear crosses on our shirts and run around killing everyone in the name of God?
Christians aren't better. People are better.
They're better because of science, philosophy, literacy, etc...
They aren't better because of religion. The religion never got any better. The same texts are in the Bible today that were in the Bible when Christians were far more barbaric.
People evolved...not Christianity.
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