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Old 04-02-2015, 01:02 PM
 
13,853 posts, read 5,564,410 times
Reputation: 8533

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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
Hilarious. Hitler imprisoned gays. You are a very confused man.
I'm really not. I see no use for forcing people to associate with me against their will. I see no use for forcing anyone to associate with anyone else against their will. Forced associations, opinions, expression, etc are hallmarks of totalitarianism, and I see no use for totalitarianism generally. It's not confusing at all really.

 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:03 PM
 
19,573 posts, read 8,489,347 times
Reputation: 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
The law apparently does allow people to say, "No gays in my shop."
The law does not specifically address that, but there would certainly not be any legitimate religious or Biblical reason for taking that position. So, whatever the justification for that policy, it would not be on religious grounds.

And I am not aware of any religious store owners who take that position. On the contrary, they are happy to serve people in their stores regardless of sexual orientation.

That goes for churches too, by the way. Homosexuals are welcome and encouraged to attend every evangelical Christian church that I have ever encountered or heard about.
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:04 PM
 
2,083 posts, read 1,617,598 times
Reputation: 1406
Quote:
Originally Posted by roundtine View Post
You didn't answer my question:

Was Maurice Bessinger a racist? By the logic underlying your quote above, don't you have to answer "no"? He didn't blanket discriminate against black people - he only did so when it conflicted with this religious beliefs.
I can't say if he was racist or not. He might have been a frothing, hate-filled racist or he might have legitimate religious objections while holding no bigotry towards Black people. The same goes here -- an individual can have zero hatred or bigotry towards gay person, but still refuse to be a part of a ceremony that violates their religious freedom.

That distinction is never made -- if they refuse, that means they hate gay people. But it just not that simple, and trying to brand everyone as bigots if they have that stance is just causing both sides to butt heads and no middle ground will ever be agreed on.

This is not a black-and-white issue, but its certainly being framed that way.
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:04 PM
 
13,853 posts, read 5,564,410 times
Reputation: 8533
Quote:
Originally Posted by nvxplorer View Post
The true idiot in all of this is Mike Pence. If you want to blame someone, blame him. He was asleep at the switch. Perhaps Jan Brewer should have given him a heads-up.
He's an idiot because a bill that passed both chambers by 71% combined majority made it his desk for passage? Every Republican in the House and Senate said yea to a bill that ended up on the Republican governor's desk, and he's an idiot for signing it?
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Middle of nowhere
24,260 posts, read 14,165,148 times
Reputation: 9895
Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
Exactly. So why do these "gays" bother to ask these Christian businesses to provide service?
In one case because they had been longtime customers (9 years)
In one case because the venue owner recommended the bakery.
In one case because they has purchased other items there and liked the cake provided for a family members wedding.

Why does anyone choose to shop anywhere? Generally because they want or need something that the shop sells.

Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy View Post
I was speaking in regard to the other cases. But in this case, he was targeted even though he doesn't provide that kind of service, just because he said he wouldn't provide it if asked.
The pizza shop owner is naive. She stated her beliefs about a controversial issue, and didn't expect anyone to voice their own opinion of that?
Maybe some training in public relations would be a good thing to spend some of that go fund money on.


Seriously, If I owned a business and went on the news and said that I would serve Christians, but I would not cater an event for them. Then went on to say that it's something they choose, and why should I be beat over the head to go along with something they choose?

Do you honestly believe that there would not be a huge media backlash against my business and calls for boycotts from the AFA, FRC, and others?
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:05 PM
 
19,573 posts, read 8,489,347 times
Reputation: 10096
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjrose View Post
Person "A" orders 20 pizzas for a wedding.

Person "B" orders 20 pizzas for a wedding.

Person "A" is sold the pizza, but person "B" isn't.

Same event (wedding) the only difference is who is purchasing the pizza.
If the homosexuals wanted to eat in the store, or pick up the pizzas, then he said he would be happy to serve them. He just did not want to cater a homosexual wedding, as it was offensive to his religious beliefs.
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Corona del Mar, CA - Coronado, CA
4,477 posts, read 3,282,719 times
Reputation: 5609
Quote:
Originally Posted by mlassoff View Post
No. No one is deserving of threats, violence or intimidation.

However, I read the Yelp page and Facebook page for the restaurant yesterday and only saw one threat. If there are more, I condemn them as well.

However, saying you would never eat there, calling out the owner on her bigotry, or simply making fun of the owners is not violence, nor is it threatening.

I don't support violence, threats, bullying or intimidation. I also don't support discrimination masquerading as religion.

Clear now? Still confused?
So you don't think the Yelp, Twitter or Google reviews were bullying or intimidation? Who are you to say what people feel threatened by?

There is a difference between saying "your policy on not catering a gay wedding (even though you don't do catering) disturbs" and "Shame on you, you worthless pieces of human waste".

People can visit Yelp & Google to see all the fake reviews being posted and decide for themselves if the posts are threatening, intimidating and bullying.
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:07 PM
 
Location: deafened by howls of 'racism!!!'
52,541 posts, read 34,259,842 times
Reputation: 29173
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speleothem View Post
Except that nobody ordered those pizzas and nobody was refused service.
forget that. we're punishing future wrongdoings that haven't happened yet
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:07 PM
 
Location: Richardson, TX
8,734 posts, read 13,787,377 times
Reputation: 3807
This is great! Now, I am going to be able to get my little neighborhood kosher deli to cater my BBQ, pork ribs and all. If they refuse, let's shut them down.
 
Old 04-02-2015, 01:08 PM
 
9,763 posts, read 10,510,765 times
Reputation: 2052
Quote:
Originally Posted by uggabugga View Post
forget that. we're punishing future wrongdoings that haven't happened yet
Please. This whole law was a pre-emptive strike.
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