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Old 05-29-2015, 09:18 AM
 
2,014 posts, read 1,525,745 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phma View Post
Batts said. "There are people, and they've said this to me, 'If I get out of my car and make a stop for a reasonable suspicion that leads to probable cause but I make a mistake on it, will I be arrested?' They pull up to a scene and another officer has done something that they don't know, it may be illegal, will they be arrested for it? Those are things they are asking."

They don't know how to do the job. Training is lacking or in question at least. Been on the job several years and don't know dept. policy because they never had to try and follow it before. Now the fear is that they will be held accountable when in the past they never had to meet that standard. Time to clean house. They aren't getting anything else done.
Complete BS! It's not training, it's not that they don't know policy and what to do. The problem is a politically correct, ideology driven race baiting city administration that wants to scapegoat the police as the source of the problem when it's obvious that it is their totally failed policies and governance.
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Old 05-29-2015, 09:23 AM
 
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I don't recall a clearer case of people reaping what they sowed. Looks good on them. They wanted thug rule and now they have it.
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Old 05-29-2015, 09:24 AM
 
2,014 posts, read 1,525,745 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2sleepy View Post
There is no valid source confirming that the Mayor said any such thing, according to Fox that came from an 'unidentified' Police Officer; In my opinion it was nothing more than Fox news trying to Benghazify the Baltimore Mayor. And the problems with the Police Department go back for quite a long time..so some research before you post again, ok?
Still living the dream in a state of denial. Wake up.
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Old 05-29-2015, 09:26 AM
 
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maybe - a big maybe - the freddie gray incident has incited the local population/make more prone to violence.


Yet shootings like those noted in the article are bad guy on bad guy. There aren't any cops involved. Its not like cops are letting shootings happen now and they go up.

For a cop to impact this violence he would have to do something teneative, the bad guy shoot, and people hurt. In the violence noted no cops involved.

The idea that these bad guys are magically on the street/not being taken off of it. . .and that is causing the shootings - is a crazy leap.

and random homcidies are VERY unlikely to have arrests. . . .


I know this makes a good cop story and a good media story. Yet there is no way that in general you can link a decrease in arrests to same week violence and murder trends. Maybe long-term . . .but the same week? thats insanity.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Packard fan View Post
BALTIMORE (AP) — A 31-year-old woman and a young boy were shot in the head Thursday, becoming Baltimore's 37th and 38th homicide victims so far this month, the city's deadliest in 15 years.

Baltimore gets bloodier as arrests drop post-Freddie Gray

Be careful what you wish for, Baltimore. By scaring the cops into next week with lawsuits over "police brutality".
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Old 05-29-2015, 09:28 AM
 
16,409 posts, read 8,488,319 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phma View Post
Police don't want to be held accountable for their actions. This is a push back by them in hopes that they can go back to doing whatever they want to do. This is an important stand they are making. Are police going to be held accountable to do the job correctly and fallow dept policy or are they going to allowed to continue this do nothing policy.
It kind of reminds me of the Ronald Reagan Air traffic Controllers strike. He replaced them all that did not return and do the job.
I do not believe it is either or. Yes some cops might want what you suggest, however plenty are also worried that despite being a good LEO they could still get into trouble. Presumably looking at the guy whose neck was broken, some of those officers were not directly responsible for his death. Yet all 6 are being charged by a DA who seems to have a racial chip on her shoulder.

Who on earth in their right mind would want to be a cop to replace the ones fired in a hell hole like Baltimore?
And the types that would, are they really the ones you want. You might go from some bad apples to a majority of bad apples.
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Old 05-29-2015, 09:49 AM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector1 View Post
I do not believe it is either or. Yes some cops might want what you suggest, however plenty are also worried that despite being a good LEO they could still get into trouble. Presumably looking at the guy whose neck was broken, some of those officers were not directly responsible for his death. Yet all 6 are being charged by a DA who seems to have a racial chip on her shoulder.

Who on earth in their right mind would want to be a cop to replace the ones fired in a hell hole like Baltimore?
And the types that would, are they really the ones you want. You might go from some bad apples to a majority of bad apples.
Did the grand jurors have a 'racial chip' on their shoulders too?
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Old 05-29-2015, 09:55 AM
 
15,355 posts, read 12,598,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nurider2002 View Post
Saw a tee shirt in a shop on the Avenue yesterday, "Baltimore, There'r More Than Just Murder Here". too funny!
But thankfully, there is. I've lived in Baltimore over 50 years and come from a family with it's own history of racism. What's happeining here has got nothing to do with Obama, democrats or the Mayor. Like all cities, blacks have been treated like sub humans in this town since day one. What happens when people are constantly beaten down and demoralized? Some become violent, some turn to drugs to blot out their miserable existence. Baltimore in well into it's fourth generation now since the crack epidemic of the early 80s destroyed the black communities that used to have 2 parent families and ties to the communities churches. Kids growing up in these hoods mother's, grandmother's and great grandparents have been addicts. Many know nothing from birth except drug abuse. And we should expect kids in that environmnent to relate to mainstream societal values?

Even kids who want to avoid gang culture cannot stay away from it. It's join or be a target. But as a middle class white man, I have experienced the human side of the drug gang members. I have had gangs help me rescue a stray dog from a drug corner - when they understood I was trying to save the dog who was dying, they circled it, caught it and put it in my truck for me. On another occasion they took me and another woman into a crack house to rescue a baby from a mother who could not and would not care for the child.

These people are human beings. I know the endless violence makes it hard to see them as real people, but they are. They are simply living the only life they have ever known. The cops have a tough job and I don't know how anybody can do that job without becoming desensitized to humo an suffering. They see the worst of human behaviore usually and have to try to control that behavior and not get killed. How do you do that without excessive force?

Thiis is not a race issue between cops and citizen, most of the cops are black! The police cannot conduct a police state and expect people to accept this. Black men should not fear for their safety when they see a cop, regardless of their past offenses, if any. But until we as a society make a real effort to target these communities with alternatives to the drug trade, nothing will change. The police cannot solve the crime problem. People have to have opportunities for a better alternative; job training, mentoring, recreational outlets for the kids, and a concerted effort by the community to offer folks in these neighborhoods a chance at something better are the only way crime and poverty will be resolved. Instead of everybody blaming the victims and or the police, we need to step up, and find out how we can help.

The fact that the majority of us just live our lives and blame people for their behavior, rather than taking steps to be part of the solution says more about us than about the police or the gang members. We are all the same, whether we choose to recognize it or not.
I think you have some good points but ummm... paragraphs are your friend.
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Old 05-29-2015, 09:58 AM
 
15,355 posts, read 12,598,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007 View Post
I wonder what the stats were like prior to the Freddie Gray incident?

I keep seeing information speaking of how arrest are dropping in Baltimore due to cops basically not doing their jobs, yet no one mentions the fact that Baltimore was already a crime ridden city with the cops supposedly doing their jobs.

And some of the comments from the police officers are pretty atrocious. It would be best of city officials there to take not and actively recruit new police officers, especially veteran officers from other municipalities by offering higher salaries and providing better benefits and then getting rid of the older Baltimore PD officers who were lame ducks to begin with.
exactly...

Baltimore always had crime and murder even when the cops were busting heads.

When the cops in NYC stood down after their beef with the mayor crime didn't go up.
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Old 05-29-2015, 10:01 AM
 
15,355 posts, read 12,598,675 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Icy Tea View Post
My own small city had three homicides this week. What gets me is the people who committed the crimes. One ran way from the crime scene and was picked up a few days later walking along a no pedestrian roadway. He was armed but surrendered without incident and it was only because he was stopped for illegal walking that he was arrested.
Then another person shot and killed two people and immediately threw the gun away at the scene in the trash. He surrendered to police two days later after they Id'd him.
So I'm thinking. They commit murder but seem to have put absolutely no thought into the consequences of their actions. Do they even think that they'll be sentenced to extremely long prison sentences or will never be free again? Is it that they just cannot control their impulses and a firearm was the last thing they should have had. A neighboring city one county over, same size, just had an 18 year shoot and kill someone. What are the motives? Its not gang violence this time, it just seems to be lack of mental development or complete lack of ethics. The riots in Baltimore had the same MO. Just a lack of higher thought on the part of the participants. Same with the DC kidnapper/ murderer. No thought, just emotion, violence and a pursuit of gratification.
maybe you watch too much TV. There aren't that many criminals out here planning their next 20 steps after a murder or robbery. Most are done on impulse.

It's why they are criminals to begin with..
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Old 05-29-2015, 10:02 AM
 
4,739 posts, read 4,426,054 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Feltdesigner View Post
exactly...

Baltimore always had crime and murder even when the cops were busting heads.

When the cops in NYC stood down after their beef with the mayor crime didn't go up.


This idea that you can link police tactics to violent crime, within a week, is pretty crazy. I mean NYC made that case for decrease in violent crime thanks to Mayor Rudolph G. . . but crime rates were coming down anyway (more likely correlation not causation)


Baltimore was a dangerous city. It was getting more dangerous. Pissing off the population is making it more dangerous, no doubt


but unless the police went on strike ala RoboCop, I doubt being more "restarained" can be linked to anything
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