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Well first of all you need to define "their money" since everyone pays some form of tax, is not an increase in sales tax also "their money".
Then you need to explain how increasing the sales tax to pay for a lower business and income tax on the wealthy is not a redistribution.
This isn't the first time we have seen this trickle down nonsense, the theory was that a lower business and income tax would bring more businesses to Kansas, that is unsound economics.
Any discussion of the impact of taxation claims has to take into account the broader economic environment and existing taxation levels of the competing areas and a host of other factors. However, it IS a consideration and potentially a strong one at that.
For example, if you are say Philadelphia and you instituted a 5% city wage tax and companies can move 5-10 miles to the suburbs what do you think happened? (actual case)
What happened after NAFTA passed and businesses were able to move to lower operating cost areas? (whether those costs are wages, regulation, taxes, benefits is moot.)
Why does Hollywood film so much more in places like Toronto, Atlanta etc. instead of in California like they used to?
Now is a business going to up and move from Nebraska to Kansas just because KS suddenly has a 1% lower tax? No.
Are businesses going to move within a year for a 2% savings? Not really....but maybe when they open their next plant or warehouse it will go to that other area but it might be 5-10 years down the road.
That's really the critical flaw in Brownbacks plan. These business attracting efforts take YEARS so if you really think it will work you have to phase in changes sloooooowly. (or offer big tax incentives like so many cities\states do anymore)
Sadly, like with any complex issue with shades of grey, partisans are hopelessly incapable of participating in a good discussion. It just breaks down into denials of reality.
Any discussion of the impact of taxation claims has to take into account the broader economic environment and existing taxation levels of the competing areas and a host of other factors. However, it IS a consideration and potentially a strong one at that.
For example, if you are say Philadelphia and you instituted a 5% city wage tax and companies can move 5-10 miles to the suburbs what do you think happened? (actual case)
What happened after NAFTA passed and businesses were able to move to lower operating cost areas? (whether those costs are wages, regulation, taxes, benefits is moot.)
Why does Hollywood film so much more in places like Toronto, Atlanta etc. instead of in California like they used to?
Now is a business going to up and move from Nebraska to Kansas just because KS suddenly has a 1% lower tax? No.
Are businesses going to move within a year for a 2% savings? Not really....but maybe when they open their next plant or warehouse it will go to that other area but it might be 5-10 years down the road.
That's really the critical flaw in Brownbacks plan. These business attracting efforts take YEARS so if you really think it will work you have to phase in changes sloooooowly. (or offer big tax incentives like so many cities\states do anymore)
Sadly, like with any complex issue with shades of grey, partisans are hopelessly incapable of participating in a good discussion. It just breaks down into denials of reality.
This is a pretty fair article on the topic as it concerns Philly looking to start reducing their wage taxes.
Please note, A LOT of democrats are making these proposals.
Why would these businesses locate to an area where the education system is getting worse and infrastructure needs are worsening and much of the general population of the USA thinks the state is a total joke and run by extreme nuts? If workers aren't there because the state can't retain them and new people don't want to relocate there.. You aren't going to find the workers.. Case and point.. Look at many areas in Western Kansas who are trying to give away free land so businesses and people move there and are still declining..
Why would these businesses locate to an area where the education system is getting worse and infrastructure needs are worsening and much of the general population of the USA thinks the state is a total joke and run by extreme nuts? If workers aren't there because the state can't retain them and new people don't want to relocate there.. You aren't going to find the workers.. Case and point.. Look at many areas in Western Kansas who are trying to give away free land so businesses and people move there and are still declining..
So your premise is that (for example) a company isn't going to move a 5,000 job auto manufacturing facility to a town with 2,000 people in the middle of nowhere.
Hard to argue with that scenario.
Where I'm having trouble is the Sprint Campus in Kansas where they have thousands of employees. What's your take on that? Do you think they're using robots with human skins or maybe cloning to get so many workers at a business in Kansas?
I mean, since your scenario is that businesses wouldn't move to Kansas because there's nobody there to hire and so forth....maybe you can explain this impossible phenomenon?
Sales taxes dont go to the federal government. This isnt the first time I've seen such stupid ass postings claiming "sales tax" in response to federal governmental tax discussions.
What are you talking about, the discussion is about Kanas and the state business and income tax, state and local sales tax, maybe you don't understand the discussion?
Who stated sales tax goes to the federal government?
I would love to know your reasoning how an increase in sales tax allows them to keep more of "their money".
Quote:
Originally Posted by pghquest
And yet areas like Pittsburgh, used such economics to turn their city around, and other areas like New York etc, use the very same idea, even offering tax exemptions for 10 years.. Surely they know something you dont, and given your babble about sales taxes above, I'd say its probably a lot.
Many cities have changed their tax structure but it needs to be accomplished with a balanced budget and reasonable projections, not a plan where companies are going to immediately flock into your state.
Yes companies have been relocating because of long term tax exemptions for 10-20 years offered by various states, so.
Kansas was supposed to be the GOP’s tax-cut paradise. Now it can barely pay its bills.
National conservative activists raved. Patrick Gleason of Americans for Tax Reform said Kansas was "the story of the next decade." The Cato Institute praised Brownback's "impressive" tax cuts and gave him an "A" on fiscal policy. And the Weekly Standard's Bill Kristol said that, if reelected, Brownback would be "a formidable presidential possibility."
What are you talking about, the discussion is about Kanas and the state business and income tax, state and local sales tax, maybe you don't understand the discussion?
Who stated sales tax goes to the federal government?
I would love to know your reasoning how an increase in sales tax allows them to keep more of "their money".
Many cities have changed their tax structure but it needs to be accomplished with a balanced budget and reasonable projections, not a plan where companies are going to immediately flock into your state.
Yes companies have been relocating because of long term tax exemptions for 10-20 years offered by various states, so.
There has been a border war between Ks and Mo for quite a few years. One state or county offers a guy in another state a great tax deal to move to their state. All this does is= Nothing for the average citizen.
Mo suggested let's quit this craziness and Ks refused.
There has been a border war between Ks and Mo for quite a few years. One state or county offers a guy in another state a great tax deal to move to their state. All this does is= Nothing for the average citizen.
Mo suggested let's quit this craziness and Ks refused.
Yes it is madness and these companies are playing one state against another, the special exemptions for companies sometimes hurt jurisdictions in the long run.
There are also deals offered to companies within a state, many of them are politically connected and are questionable. One city was ready to give an apartment builder a 20 year tax abatement that would have cost the residents dearly over it's life.
So your premise is that (for example) a company isn't going to move a 5,000 job auto manufacturing facility to a town with 2,000 people in the middle of nowhere.
Hard to argue with that scenario.
Where I'm having trouble is the Sprint Campus in Kansas where they have thousands of employees. What's your take on that? Do you think they're using robots with human skins or maybe cloning to get so many workers at a business in Kansas?
I mean, since your scenario is that businesses wouldn't move to Kansas because there's nobody there to hire and so forth....maybe you can explain this impossible phenomenon?
They are enjoying the KCMO Metro. As we know when you get past Topeka there sure is a lot of nothing that city people want. I think there are quite a few at Sprint that live in Mo. There are sure quite a few that live in Mo, there are a lot that work at other than Sprint and that can be verified about the traffic going that way on I-470 in mornings or evenings.
They are enjoying the KCMO Metro. As we know when you get past Topeka there sure is a lot of nothing that city people want. I think there are quite a few at Sprint that live in Mo. There are sure quite a few that live in Mo, there are a lot that work at other than Sprint and that can be verified about the traffic going that way on I-470 in mornings or evenings.
Sprint compares to nothing.
You just changed the discussion. Please go back and read jb's keen insights about how companies won't move to a state by pointing to some depopulated rural portion of it and saying, "see nobody is around to work" lol.
Meanwhile Kansas now ranks 48th in job growth.....
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