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Old 06-20-2015, 05:20 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 43,945,307 times
Reputation: 17189

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spatula City View Post
That's the common narrative, but it doesn't hold up to scrutiny.

Did Prohibition Really Work? Alcohol Prohibition as a Public Health Innovation
lol...a link to a 134 page paper. I guarantee you didn't actually read.it.

Quote:
The real problem is the people who think that they can't be free unless they have the ability to shoot someone. They don't want guns, they want what guns represent. They want what all of the propaganda and salesmanship have promised them.
I don't own a gun so shooting someone will be tough to do.

Quote:
Intelligent people know the difference, but some people simply cannot be taught.

Gun prohibition is doomed, but only because of American stupidity.
Even a prohibition would not work. As has been pointed out many times.......how did prohibition of alcohol work? How has the prohibition of pot worked?
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Old 06-20-2015, 07:44 AM
 
1,735 posts, read 1,763,038 times
Reputation: 522
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spatula City View Post
Alcohol prohibition actually did decrease alcoholism, but there are too many gun-fetishists and paranoid idiots in America for gun prohibition to ever work.
Yet we repealed it? Then why did we have the assault weapons ban from 1994? What did that do?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Spatula City View Post
The people on this board alone are enough to make me think there would be a lot of violence if such a law ever went into effect. Alex Jones would probably incite hundreds, even thousands of murders as soon as it was announced. Limbaugh even more.
Like the assault weapons ban from 1994?
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Old 06-20-2015, 07:56 AM
 
Location: United States
12,390 posts, read 7,057,123 times
Reputation: 6134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumpen View Post
Cars and license to drive them is heavily regulated, much more than guns.
Actually, in the United States, firearms are the most regulated consumer good. Only radio active material (a non-consumer good) is more regulated than firearms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaseMan View Post
If ISIS or Al-Qaeda had killed as many Americans, they'd be calling for a return of the draft and demanding Obama nuke the entire middle east. Gun violence in our own country? Shrug. They say Obama should shut up and we should ignore it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaseMan View Post
None of the conservatives in this thread could address this. Probably because they know it's true.
Are you serious, are you comparing a major act of war to a reluctance to have our Constitutional rights infringed because of criminal active?
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Old 06-20-2015, 08:26 AM
 
22,923 posts, read 15,393,507 times
Reputation: 16962
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
They carry them on their backs as they ride to the shooting range. They freely carry them in public without a peep. Is this what you are talking about? If not, you need to provide something of substance.

They can do whatever they want with ammunition they purchase themselves. The government does purchase a lot of the ammunition that people use at gun ranges.

People can still buy civilian ammo for "army guns".
Using Switzerland as an example is a fallacious exercise.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_po...in_Switzerland

"The sale of ammunition – including Gw Pat.90 rounds for army-issue assault rifles – is subsidized by the Swiss government and made available at the many shooting ranges patronized by both private citizens and members of the militia. There is a regulatory requirement that ammunition sold at ranges must be used there."

You are making some very broad generalizations that are just NOT applicable .....either due to regulations or Swiss ethical and moral imperatives.

What you suggest as practice in Switzerland is NOT the common practice at all.

My Uncle (now deceased) was Swiss and an officer in their militia and I visited him often over my 70 year to date, lifespan. His issued weapons and Swiss firearms controls were frequent topics of discussion, contrary to your beliefs; aside from the militia aspect of issued weapons kept in the home (under very strict regulations) they mirror almost exactly, todays laws of firearm ownership in Canada, right next door to you.
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Old 06-20-2015, 08:34 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 43,945,307 times
Reputation: 17189
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
Using Switzerland as an example is a fallacious exercise.
I'm not the one that brought them up.


Quote:
What you suggest as practice in Switzerland is NOT the common practice at all.
I posted links which trumps you having an uncle.
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Old 06-20-2015, 09:45 AM
 
800 posts, read 777,945 times
Reputation: 575
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post
Using Switzerland as an example is a fallacious exercise.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_po...in_Switzerland

"The sale of ammunition – including Gw Pat.90 rounds for army-issue assault rifles – is subsidized by the Swiss government and made available at the many shooting ranges patronized by both private citizens and members of the militia. There is a regulatory requirement that ammunition sold at ranges must be used there."

You are making some very broad generalizations that are just NOT applicable .....either due to regulations or Swiss ethical and moral imperatives.

What you suggest as practice in Switzerland is NOT the common practice at all.

My Uncle (now deceased) was Swiss and an officer in their militia and I visited him often over my 70 year to date, lifespan. His issued weapons and Swiss firearms controls were frequent topics of discussion, contrary to your beliefs; aside from the militia aspect of issued weapons kept in the home (under very strict regulations) they mirror almost exactly, todays laws of firearm ownership in Canada, right next door to you.
Now the conservatives are going to tell that even though your family is Swiss and you've been there numerous times you still don't know Switzerland as well as them because they read some poorly researched article on some gun forum online.

Have they ever been to Switzerland once? Nope.

Have they met a Swiss person? Nope.
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Old 06-20-2015, 09:48 AM
 
Location: USA
2,593 posts, read 4,225,317 times
Reputation: 2240
Well the only good thing about MORE guns would be that it would be even more of a deterrent for some foreign army to try and invade us. No one has even had the ability to launch a halfway successful invasion of the US since the British did in 1812 & that's mostly because they had more people than we did.

Some people worry China will turn on us & invade us with troops someday in the future. I really don't think they are that stupid. We have so many guns here that they'd face an insanely fierce insurgency. Combine that with our weather & it just makes invading us total suicide. Maybe if they nuke us first then invade it could work, but otherwise, bad, bad idea.
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Old 06-20-2015, 10:22 AM
 
Location: United States
12,390 posts, read 7,057,123 times
Reputation: 6134
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lumpen View Post
Really, do you have to have a vision test, written test, and field tests to operate a gun??
The facts are the facts, firearms are the most regulated consumer good, period.
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Old 06-20-2015, 10:26 AM
 
Location: San Francisco, CA
15,088 posts, read 13,403,072 times
Reputation: 14266
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
They carry them on their backs as they ride to the shooting range. They freely carry them in public without a peep. Is this what you are talking about? If not, you need to provide something of substance.
That would be the linked material I posted, which you ignore because it doesn't fit your argument. As I said, when they carry them in public, they have laws about how they can carry them, how the ammo is transported, etc. Unless they have a special purpose and registration, they don't go around the streets with rounds in the chambers.

And here's the other thing people don't get with respect to Switzerland. I have spent a lot of time there, and I can echo this quote from the article:

Quote:
Mathias carefully puts away his pistol and shakes his head firmly when I ask him if he feels safer having a gun at home, explaining that even if he had ammunition, he would not be allowed to use it against an intruder.
"The gun is not given to me to protect me or my family," he says. "I have been given this gun by my country to serve my country - and for me it is an honour to take care of it. I think it is a good thing for the state to give this responsibility to people."
People in Switzerland are NOT living this conservative Wild West wet dream fantasy where every person is strapped with a firearm and ready to quick-draw and spray lead at the drop of a hat. They don't go armed to the teeth in public for "protection." They don't live in a state of paranoia, their guns loaded two inches away not the night table as they sleep; at home, their guns are generally disassembled and ammo is kept carefully separate from it. And if gun crime happens there, they would be as susceptible to it as anyone else; there aren't ten other people in the McDonald's at Zurich who are all packing loaded firearms, ready to take out anyone who makes a threatening move. Swiss people do not have broad gun ownership for "protection and safety," and it is not the reason why their crime rate is so low.

I've had my own conversations with plenty of Swiss people; they HATE being compared to America on this and think it portrays how ignorant Americans are of how guns function in the Swiss culture. And, by the way, they generally look at American conservative ideas as horrible.

So it's not at all the way the rednecks portray the gun need / benefit over here. If the argument is that we all need to pack a gun to combat massacres and crime, then we are way, WAY off target of how a civilized nation should function.
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Old 06-20-2015, 10:40 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 43,945,307 times
Reputation: 17189
Quote:
Originally Posted by ambient View Post
That would be the linked material I posted, which you ignore because it doesn't fit your argument. As I said, when they carry them in public, they have laws about how they can carry them, how the ammo is transported, etc. Unless they have a special purpose and registration, they don't go around the streets with rounds in the chambers.
So you are cool with people walking around with guns as long as they leave the ammo in their pockets?

Quote:
And here's the other thing people don't get with respect to Switzerland. I have spent a lot of time there, and I can echo this quote from the article:
Based upon how the topic of Switzerland started, I'm doubting that is true but moving on

Quote:
People in Switzerland are NOT living this conservative Wild West wet dream fantasy where every person is strapped with a firearm and ready to quick-draw and spray lead at the drop of a hat. They don't go armed to the teeth in public for "protection." They don't live in a state of paranoia, their guns loaded two inches away not the night table as they sleep; at home, their guns are generally disassembled and ammo is kept carefully separate from it. And if gun crime happens there, they would be as susceptible to it as anyone else; there aren't ten other people in the McDonald's at Zurich who are all packing loaded firearms, ready to take out anyone who makes a threatening move. Swiss people do not have broad gun ownership for "protection and safety," and it is not the reason why their crime rate is so low.
I care less what "conservatives" argue. My position does not get based off political labels.

Quote:
I've had my own conversations with plenty of Swiss people; they HATE being compared to America on this and think it portrays how ignorant Americans are of how guns function in the Swiss culture. And, by the way, they generally look at American conservative ideas as horrible.
Probably a common dinner table topic eh?

Quote:
So it's not at all the way the rednecks portray the gun need / benefit over here. If the argument is that we all need to pack a gun to combat massacres and crime, then we are way, WAY off target of how a civilized nation should function.
Why do you feel a need to call those you have a disagreement with names? When was your last mental health evaluation?
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