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The problem is the whole good guy with a gun scenario is used when most incidents happen that a bad guy with a gun can be stopped with a good guy with a gun but we forget that most cases it is hard to tell if a good guy with a gun would truly stop an active shooter situation if all other variables were the same besides at the least one single gun owner.
I do think we need to restrict who can own guns, availability of guns and also magazine size. No reason to walk around as a civilian with a 30 round magazine.
Of course it works. People are people, and the only difference in locations are the languages they speak. All are capable of the same crimes, and all commit the same crimes.
You say no one is going to take your guns, but you have been proven wrong by what happened durng Katrina. If its convenient, your Guns will be taken, and you will be left to protest it after the fact, when you have already lost them. Only a fool thinks Registration is for your own good.
As far as what you think, should you be held responsible if a car you owned is involved in a crime? Should you also go to jail? That's pretty absurd thinking.
I guess if you are trying to say that if gun smuggling was easy and unchecked, then sure, we are just like Mexico.
Actually if you give your car to someone who drunk drives in it, then yes, you should be held responsible for that action. I never loan my car out to people.
And again, no one is going to take away your guns. You can try to use the Katrina myth, but that was just a stupid cop that didn't know any better and had bad information.
So does NYC, and yet they have low crime. If you are just expecting a simple answer for gun related crimes, then the bad news is that there is no simple action....other than sitting on your hands and sticking your head in the sand to pretend like there is nothing wrong and nothing we can do about it.
The NRA, and gun owners have always called for more enforcement of gun laws, so your statement doesn't hold up.
That's not true at all, they wouldn't even allow a director of the ATF and have done everything they can to circumvent the ATF whether limiting funding or blocking investigation.
Seems like it would be important to trace guns used in a crime back to dealers.
Quote:
Congress blacked out the information by passing the so-called Tiahrt amendment,
named for Rep. Todd Tiahrt (R-Kan.). The law removed from the public record a
government database that traces guns recovered in crimes back to the dealers.
So does NYC, and yet they have low crime. If you are just expecting a simple answer for gun related crimes, then the bad news is that there is no simple action....other than sitting on your hands and sticking your head in the sand to pretend like there is nothing wrong and nothing we can do about it.
Gun crime is at about a 30 year low throughout the entire country, not just NYC. NYC's overall crime reduction has much more to do with massive gentrification, than anything else.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight
That's not true at all, they wouldn't even allow a director of the ATF and have done everything they can to circumvent the ATF whether limiting funding or blocking investigation.
The NRA has absolutely no control over the funding of the ATF, or over what it investigates. The ATF has gotten itself into hot water with congress many time all on it's own, with no NRA involvement.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight
Seems like it would be important to trace guns used in a crime back to dealers.
So what? It only blocks the data from public assess, not law enforcement. Dealers still remain 100% criminally liable, and all sales records are still required to be turned in to the ATF for review.
The law is only there to offer some protection from people, or groups that are fishing for lawsuits.
Gun crime is at about a 30 year low throughout the entire country, not just NYC. NYC's overall crime reduction has much more to do with massive gentrification, than anything else.
So what? It only blocks the data from public assess, not law enforcement. Dealers still remain 100% criminally liable, and all sales records are still required to be turned in to the ATF for review.
Dealers are almost never prosecuted, lost "guns" that they are unable to account for go by the wayside, it would be nice to be able to trace a gun back to the source. The ATF is prohibited from even inspecting a dealership more than once a year, doesn't matter since they don't have the manpower, lucky if they can inspect within 5 years. Restricting the release to the public of information relative to guns used in a crime, what's the point. There is a small amount of dealers that are responsible for a large amount of illegal guns, they deserve to be under the microscope with no restrictions.
There are many reasons for the drop in NYC crime, stop & frisk, strict gun laws, gentrification is towards the bottom. A large majority of the guns used in a crime come from outside NYC, particularly GA, SC, VA.
Congress controls the ATF budget, hasn't changed much in 10 years, maybe they are influenced by the NRA.
That's not true at all, they wouldn't even allow a director of the ATF and have done everything they can to circumvent the ATF whether limiting funding or blocking investigation.
Seems like it would be important to trace guns used in a crime back to dealers.
Would it also be important to trace guns smuggled into Mexico by our government to be traced back to their origin?
That was a big mistake to find out how the guns make it over the border to Mexico, what was that 200 guns? There are several thousand guns that end up in Mexico but the sting was poorly devised.
There are 200,000 guns lost or stolen per year, there are dealerships that can't account for several hundred guns that is more than F&F . That should be the focus, not a one time government action from several years ago.
Dealers are almost never prosecuted, lost "guns" that they are unable to account for go by the wayside, it would be nice to be able to trace a gun back to the source. The ATF is prohibited from even inspecting a dealership more than once a year, doesn't matter since they don't have the manpower, lucky if they can inspect within 5 years. Restricting the release to the public of information relative to guns used in a crime, what's the point. There is a small amount of dealers that are responsible for a large amount of illegal guns, they deserve to be under the microscope with no restrictions.
There are many reasons for the drop in NYC crime, stop & frisk, strict gun laws, gentrification is towards the bottom. A large majority of the guns used in a crime come from outside NYC, particularly GA, SC, VA.
Congress controls the ATF budget, hasn't changed much in 10 years, maybe they are influenced by the NRA.
There is absolutely no reason for gun owners, or the NRA to protect dealer that are providing guns to people that are prohibited from possessing them. In fact, there is every reason for gun owners, and the NRA to see these dealer prosecuted. Lower gun crime rates equals less pressure to ban guns, so the idea that gun owners, or the NRA would protect rouge dealers, simply defies any logic.
As to NYC, it's had strict anti-gun laws for a very long time now, long before it's more recent reduction in crime levels. Stop and frisk has been almost completely eliminated, yet crime is still down. The major gentrification in NYC correlates perfectly with the reduction in overall crime. To say gentrification isn't a major reason for the lower crime rates in NYC, is not being honest to say the least.
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