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Now black slaves and freemen diggin ditches, serving their confederate officers mess, ok, I'll give you that one, but fighting for the South... not so much.
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I suppose we're also supposed to ignore the fact that the Emancipation Proclamation did NOT END SLAVERY in the Union states.
Most 5th graders understand that.
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After the war, slavery still existed in the "northern" states, until the 13th amendment in December of 1865.
And your point is????
You see Toyman you assume that I come to this discussion in a binary fashion, South bad, North good. But I can assure you that I see this nation's history in a shades of gray - no pun intended. I don't harbor any illusions about racism in the north, or the fact that outside of Republican abolitionist, Republicans and Democrats alike weren't all that concerned about ending slavery, just fighting against those who they believed were destroying the Union.
This post suffers from the fallacy of false equivalency. Homegrown, U.S.-based terrorists who kill innocent people based on an ideology of white supremacy have unfortunately been with us (here, right in the U.S.) for centuries.
The U.S. has made rooting out Islamist terrorists on foreign soil its policy for several decades, and whether it has done so productively or not is definitely something members of a democracy should discuss. Where is your argument there?
I don't think anyone is advocating "judg[ing] all southerners and anyone with a rebel flag based on the actions of one nutcase" here. Rather, what people *on the soil where the original white supremacist-based terrorist acts originated* are advocating is that the U.S. government and its constituent states stop officially endorsing a symbol which seems to support such terrorism against black people in the U.S.
If that stance ends up finally taking hold here, which I suspect it might, that will do nothing to change the neo- and pro-confederacy industries that sell goods that are marketed to whom they are. One will still be able to stop in at a rest stop in, say, GA, and buy all the confederate paraphernalia one might want to for display in one's home, on one's automobile, or wherever. No one is dictating what judgments anyone should make about such behavior; I'd guess that most people's judgments will stay about the same as they were last week. One's freedom to do so may seem to be different because more people will be voicing opinions about such actions, but that really doesn't fundamentally change anything.
No one is telling anyone what they are "supposed" to think. In short, I'm pretty convinced that these recent pushes, while welcome in some respects, will amount to pretty much window dressing, and I'm wondering if you disagree or if your argument is merely meant to inflame.
If you can convince me that your equivalence argument has any merit based on any logical premises, go for it.
They were common in western New York in the late 70s/early 80s. As a sign of "rebelliousness" among teenagers. No racism involved. Maybe you need to find a better group of friends to hang with.
They were common also in the midwest and you are wrong on the Racism. I sure new a lot of racist teenagers back then and all across the USA the word ****** was very common.
I am confident that were you to walk up to a person displaying the confederate flag and asked them if they hate ******S, 90% Would say hell yes i hate ******S
There are others ways of engaging the past in which it is not so much a cause of the present but a means by which one can think critically about the present. You can try so hard to be balanced and objective but I think that we all find it impossible to look at past events and historical characters without our views being coloured by the context in which we live and the knowledge we have about what happened after those events.
The word swastika, comes from the Sanskrit “svastika,” which means ‘to be good.’
If I were a holocaust survivor, there is no doubt in my mind that swastika jewelry was a slap in the face.
But If I saw an Asian lady worn a piece of swastika jewelry I perhaps would assume She was innocent, apparently unaware of the emotional baggage a swastika carries. Maybe she has no Jewish friends. After all, Swastika is an important part of certain culture.
For a person like me (mixed German/Japanese), I learned from experiences that freedom of speech is limited. Yes, I do need to be careful of what I say in order not to **** people off.
I learned from experiences that not everybody flies confederate flag is a racist. Since we all judge others based on our own personal biases and experiences, I say cut your fellow human beings some slack.
Have some faith in The Better Angels of Our Nature. If people tell you they are not racists, they perhaps are telling you the truth.
"conservative white males also talk about the over representation of blacks with violent crime as means to disparage all black people."
All we have to do is look at crime statistics from the FBI to know what areas to avoid. Just because they all have high black populations does not mean that all blacks are a threat, just a high percentage of the population living in those areas. Unfortunately, poor law abiding blacks, white and others that can't afford to get out in those areas are the most likely victims.
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Moderator cut: link removed, linking to competitor sites is not allowed
"white men over represent in proportion to there population pedophiles and child molesters."
No kidding, if a black women or child ever said they were sexually assaulted by a black man I'd know she was lying
As I've said in other threads, high crime rates are in the big cities, so anyone living in the big cities will experience higher statistical probability that they will be involved in a crime. Just because there is more crime in big cities, and a larger percentage of blacks live in big cities, does not mean that crime is somehow embedded into in the DNA of blacks.
I am confident that were you to walk up to a person displaying the confederate flag and asked them if they hate ******S, 90% Would say hell yes i hate ******S
Whatever keeps your stereotypes alive I suppose.
And when you walk up to a person with a southern accent, and "ask them if they hate ******S, 90% Would say hell yes i hate ******S" too eh?
Well Versatile, I do believe this thread is dead. Good job!
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