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Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,330 posts, read 54,400,252 times
Reputation: 40736
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dexter14
But you DO realize the laws in the US are mostly setup around Christian beliefs right? You do realize there are dozens of countries where girls are allowed to be married as young as 10 years old right? You do realize there are countries where incest is legal right? You do realize there are countries where having sex with animals is legal right? So why are these things illegal in the US? Because they are deemed morally wrong in our culture, and why are they deemed morally wrong? Christian beliefs.
What I'd like to know is IF Christians are so intent on putting their beliefs into US policy, WHY aren't they as vocal about 'Thou shalt not kill'? WHY aren't they as concerned about bloody, unnecessary wars of choice causing tens of thousands of needless deaths as they are about who's attracted to whom?
At best I'd say that represents a seriously warped sense of priorities.
How? If a same sex couple is allowed to marry, HOW does that affect any others' beliefs? They're NOT being forced to do anything they don't believe in.
Sweet Cakes bakery ordered to pay $135K to lesbian couple simply because they refuse to sell them a gay wedding cake.
They did not refuse service because they are gay, they refused service because participating in gay marriage is against their religious belief.
If a business post a sign saying they "reserve the right to refuse service", they should't be punished.
Live and let live
Gays and lesbians should get married, Religious folks should be able to refuse businesses based on their religious belief.
Do you believe a Muslim business owner should be forced to print a Muhammad T shirt?
Sweet Cakes bakery ordered to pay $135K to lesbian couple simply because they refuse to sell them a gay wedding cake.
They did not refuse service because they are gay, they refused service because participating in gay marriage is against their religious belief.
If a business post a sign saying they "reserve the right to refuse service", they should't be punished.
Live and let live
Gays and lesbians should get married, Religious folks should be able to refuse businesses based on their religious belief.
Do you believe a Muslim business owner should be forced to print a Muhammad T shirt?
Great points. Not to mention the cases we are starting to see popping up already where clerks are getting into trouble for refusing to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples because it goes against their religious beliefs. Seems people ARE being forced to do things they don't believe in. The new American bigots.
Location: By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea
68,330 posts, read 54,400,252 times
Reputation: 40736
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981
Sweet Cakes bakery ordered to pay $135K to lesbian couple simply because they refuse to sell them a gay wedding cake.
They did not refuse service because they are gay, they refused service because participating in gay marriage is against their religious belief.
If a business post a sign saying they "reserve the right to refuse service", they should't be punished.
Live and let live
Gays and lesbians should get married, Religious folks should be able to refuse businesses based on their religious belief.
Do you believe a Muslim business owner should be forced to print a Muhammad T shirt?
I haven't read this before, did they have that sign posted?
It all seems pretty random to me. Do their religious beliefs not prohibit adultery? Do they ask all their customers if they've been faithful? Whether they've ever stolen anything? Blasphemed?
Isn't a common belief that "we're all sinners"? If so, doesn't that mean all their customers are sinners too?
Oh really? Whom exactly am I advocating be denied privileges extended to others under the law?
Sorry but when a person wants their "opinions" inscribed in laws that prevent federal privileges from being extended to those whom they profess to like, even love, that's certainly not friendship.
You don't think most people know that there is a difference between the two? That's weird. But, of course, supporting segregationist laws were pure racism. Supporting homophobic laws is pure homophobia.
Funny that you aren't preaching to those who do think it's their business. Seems like you time would be better spent. But your choice obviously.
Wait hold on there! You are aware that in this country there are acceptable forms of discrimination and people are being denied basic civil rights(and dying for it) as we speak? What i find is odd is your only concerned with your basic rights (to same sex marriage, gay rights) While as you speak there are other not getting equal protecti
Sweet Cakes bakery ordered to pay $135K to lesbian couple simply because they refuse to sell them a gay wedding cake.
They did not refuse service because they are gay, they refused service because participating in gay marriage is against their religious belief.
If a business post a sign saying they "reserve the right to refuse service", they should't be punished.
Live and let live
Gays and lesbians should get married, Religious folks should be able to refuse businesses based on their religious belief.
Do you believe a Muslim business owner should be forced to print a Muhammad T shirt?
If they provide a specific service to someone, you can't discriminate on who you provide that service to. If you don't provide a specific service then you are fine. That is the difference between the two examples. Many people argued interracial marriage went against their religious beliefs. Should a businness owner who is against interracial marriage be able to deny services to an interracial couple and claim that it is ok for them to discriminate because its their religious freedom.
Great points. Not to mention the cases we are starting to see popping up already where clerks are getting into trouble for refusing to issue marriage licenses to same sex couples because it goes against their religious beliefs. Seems people ARE being forced to do things they don't believe in. The new American bigots.
They HAVE TO FOLLOW THE LAW, PERIOD. If you can't FOLLOW the LAW and do your job, GET ANOTHER JOB in which that law doesn't interfere with your work.
But you DO realize the laws in the US are mostly setup around Christian beliefs right? You do realize there are dozens of countries where girls are allowed to be married as young as 10 years old right? You do realize there are countries where incest is legal right? You do realize there are countries where having sex with animals is legal right? So why are these things illegal in the US? Because they are deemed morally wrong in our culture, and why are they deemed morally wrong? Christian beliefs.
Actually most of the laws you mention revolve around laws of consent, little do with Christian laws. Regardless, bad laws or lack of certain laws in other countries has no baring on the laws that we should have here. When it comes down to it, we aren't a Theocracy.
They HAVE TO FOLLOW THE LAW, PERIOD. If you can't FOLLOW the LAW and do your job, GET ANOTHER JOB in which that law doesn't interfere with your work.
Ok, so the law states you can't refuse service to someone based on personal and/or religious beliefs? So how about if a Christian were to go into a cake store owned by a gay couple and wanted a cake saying "I don't support gay marriage" or "marriage should be between only one man and one woman". I can bet you that store would refuse. Would you say the same thing to the couple who owned that store? That they MUST bake that cake and FOLLOW THE LAW? Would you support those store owners being fined $150k for not complying? Works both ways.
If they provide a specific service to someone, you can't discriminate on who you provide that service to. If you don't provide a specific service then you are fine. That is the difference between the two examples. Many people argued interracial marriage went against their religious beliefs. Should a businness owner who is against interracial marriage be able to deny services to an interracial couple and claim that it is ok for them to discriminate because its their religious freedom.
Actually, similar argument has been used by people who are against gay marriage.
One thing leads to another.
One of those arguments increasingly raised by opponents of same-sex marriage is that legalizing same-sex marriage will eventually open the door to demands for legal recognition of plural marriage, especially polygamy.
Gays and lesbians have argued that polygamy and gay marriage are completely different. You cannot prove one thing will definitely lead to another.
That being said, I believe in live and let live concept, which means business owners have the right to refuse businesses for religious reasons. Free market will take care of the rest.
If they don't want to do businesses with black person, interracial couples, as long as they know the consequences of their choices (loss of businesses, lose of money), they should be able to run their businesses however they want to.
edit: By the way, the shop owner did not refuse business because the customers are lesbians, they refused businesses because participating in gay marriage is against their religion.
They can purchase cookies and chocolate bars, just not a gay wedding cake.
From what I learned,
Question: "What does the Bible say about interracial marriage?"
Answer: The Old Testament Law commanded the Israelites not to engage in interracial marriage (Deuteronomy 7:3–4). However, the reason for this command was not skin color or ethnicity. Rather, it was religious. The reason God commanded against interracial marriage for the Jews was that people of other races were worshippers of false gods. The Israelites would be led astray from God if they intermarried with idol worshippers, pagans, or heathens. This is exactly what happened in Israel, according to Malachi 2:11.
A similar principle of spiritual purity is laid out in the New Testament, but it has nothing to do with race: “Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness?” (2 Corinthians 6:14). Just as the Israelites (believers in the one true God) were commanded not to marry idolaters, so Christians (believers in the one true God) are commanded not to marry unbelievers. The Bible never says that interracial marriage is wrong. Anyone who forbids interracial marriage is doing so without biblical authority.
so interracial marriages and gay marriages are not exactly the same.
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