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I think I'd rather have Hugo Chavez. A man of the people who knows how to put the big oil companies in their place. That's the sort of leader we need...
Odd. I've noticed that neocons tend to base their ideas on gut feelings, personal anecdotes, greedy self-interest, and counter-factual mantras and materials authored and distributed by the right-wing disinformation media. This leads to a widespread inability on their part to construct and defend a reasoned argument in support of much of anything. Sad, really...
And I've found that liberals base their entire belief structure on woefully naive idealism, bizarre reaches of psuedo-academia, jealousy of success, delusional concepts of the human condition, weeping emotional pleas, mindless contrarianism and groupthink.
woefully naive idealism, bizarre reaches of psuedo-academia, jealousy of success, delusional concepts of the human condition, weeping emotional pleas, mindless contrarianism and groupthink.
Wait. Didn't you just quote from the GLBT Scouts Pledge?
Yeah! You know I've been noticing lately that my kids look kind of white. Dammit, is all I can say. I sure hope some noble non-white comes along and screws them over. Rah! Rah! Go, non-white people...
I'm sure that comment could've been awesome if it made any sense.
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The proper place for most of this discussion would be over in the Subforum of Bile & Hatred, but if you want to focus on the political and economic aspects of immigration, the facts are that the current situation does not work to anyone's advantage, and that there simply is no potential solution that does not include a) something that would sound like amnesty to the knee-jerks, and b) something that would sound like open borders to the knee-jerks.
This assumes a number of completely flawed premises.
First, the "facts" are that the current system may not work to anyones advantage, however, you tacitly acknowledge that America somehow bears a burden to work for the advantage of foriegn nationals.
There are plenty of soloutions that do not involve "amnesty" nor "open borders", but DO involve directly addressing the problem (like, large scale but selective deportations, sealing the borders, etc)
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You are going to see substantial annual immigration into this country for the foreseeable future regardless of how you wish to react to it.
Big negative on that one.
If we wished immigration to cease alltogether, we could most certainlly make it so. To suggest that immigration is somehow akin to the sun rising is yet another totally flawed premise that serves to support the rest of your downward conclusions.
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Preservation of any precious domestic resources will not be accomplished by wasting them on such pie-eyed ideas as building some giant fence or attempting to round up and deport 12-15 million people. By clinging to their illusions and prejudices rather than recognizing reality, the knee-jerks are helping only to delay resolution of our present problems while perpetuating what is a bad situation for everyone...
Again, you make these idiotic assumptions, are totally dismissive of certain realities then contort facts to fit into your own narrow view of what constitutes a "solution". Deportation and hardened border security- be it fixed fortifications or electronic monitoring with fast response teams- is far from being a pie-eyed idea. Matter of fact, it is extremely practical and a number of nations accomplish those very things using said methods.
You really need to adopt some new debating tactics.
This whole "make a dumb statement that is preemptively dismissive of whatever I don't like, then expound further on it" thing is kinda moronic.
And I've found that liberals base their entire belief structure on woefully naive idealism, bizarre reaches of psuedo-academia, jealousy of success, delusional concepts of the human condition, weeping emotional pleas, mindless contrarianism and groupthink.
Hmmm. Contrarianism and groupthink both at the same time. Interesting concept. The conservative mind is such a wondrous and mysterious place...
Hmmm. Contrarianism and groupthink both at the same time. Interesting concept. The conservative mind is such a wondrous and mysterious place...
Mindless contrarianism towards anything that can be remotely construed to be traditional, conventional or status-quo, groupthink in that to a leftist, the entire concept of "individual" is lesser in significance than that of the whole- of 'the village'. It's why people who live piled on top of each other in cities trend liberal, while people who live in wide open spaces trend conservative. It's also why certain key-words (racist, sexist, etc) have such a profound impact upon the leftists mind and they associatively toss them out whenever backed into a corner, whereas those things really don't mean much- without applicable context- to the conservative type.
Now, I know these textural dynamics of what I said might have sailed over the head of someone with 9th grade reading comprehension skills, but really, you didn't need me to explain that to you... You always kinda struck me as being a bit brighter than that.
nefarious - evil
no evil agenda. both parties have agenda no?
i just switched to republican.
i am white (mideastern origin) and religious
not democrat material no?
I'm sure that comment could've been awesome if it made any sense.
Oh, I think it went straight to the heart of your lefties and their "Mindlessly Pro Non-White People dogma" point. If we dare legitimize it by calling it a point at all.
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Originally Posted by LM1
This assumes a number of completely flawed premises. First, the "facts" are that the current system may not work to anyones advantage, however, you tacitly acknowledge that America somehow bears a burden to work for the advantage of foriegn nationals.
No, you just made that up. My statement was that the current situation does not work to anyone's advantage. That's a fairly plain and straight-forward statement. It doesn't make reference to the tacit bearing of a burden to work for anything at all.
Quote:
Originally Posted by LM1
There are plenty of solutions that do not involve "amnesty" nor "open borders", but DO involve directly addressing the problem (like, large scale but selective deportations, sealing the borders, etc)
What do you mean "etc."? These are the only two ideas you folks seem to have, and they don't even approximatley qualify as solutions. You can't actually do either one of them, even if it were the case that doing them actually made the slightest bit of sense. There is absolutely no way to seal a 2,000-mile border. There is absolutely no possibility that we will deport 12-15 million people. When will you people get over it? Move on. Get with the program. All you are doing at the moment is perpetuating the status quo.
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Originally Posted by LM1
Big negative on that one. If we wished immigration to cease alltogether, we could most certainlly make it so. To suggest that immigration is somehow akin to the sun rising is yet another totally flawed premise that serves to support the rest of your downward conclusions.
Sure. All you have to do is cause a worldwide depression and then follow that up with World War 3. The 1930's and early 40's were the last time global immigration rates were significantly depressed, so let's go with what's worked before. Your only other option is somehow to cause the levels of jobs and wages available in home countries to reach that which would match the relative levels in this country. Do you have a plan for that? If not, you remain entirely powerless against the on-going desire of millions of people to move from one place to another. You may as well paint a big "S" on your chest and believe that you can stand on the tracks and stop the on-rushing freight train. This is the level of futility that your emotions are driving you to.
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Originally Posted by LM1
Again, you make these idiotic assumptions, are totally dismissive of certain realities...
Which realities would those be?
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Originally Posted by LM1
...then contort facts to fit into your own narrow view of what constitutes a "solution". Deportation and hardened border security- be it fixed fortifications or electronic monitoring with fast response teams- is far from being a pie-eyed idea. Matter of fact, it is extremely practical and a number of nations accomplish those very things using said methods.
Can you give me a cost estimate for constructing this extremely practical border security endeavor of yours? How about for staffing or for annual maintenance and upkeep? What sort of tax increase do you propose in order to fund The Great Roundup? How many rounder-uppers do you think you will need? Where are you going to get them from? Will they need training? What about supplies and equipment? Can you ballpark all of that so I have some idea of what we're actually dealing with here?
Quote:
Originally Posted by LM1
You really need to adopt some new debating tactics. This whole "make a dumb statement that is preemptively dismissive of whatever I don't like, then expound further on it" thing is kinda moronic.
Kinda moronic would be pretending that one had a magic wand.
I'm beginning to think you don't know anything about gay people.
I know that most gay people are clever enough to realize when someone is putting them on.
I said "most."
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