Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Closed Thread Start New Thread
 
Old 07-07-2015, 06:43 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,604 posts, read 26,223,464 times
Reputation: 12628

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
What's your point?
Do you even have one?

Ken


Black people killed by white racist.....BAD!


Christians killed by Islamic extremist...not so bad.

 
Old 07-07-2015, 06:45 PM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,225,145 times
Reputation: 7621
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Black people killed by white racist.....BAD!


Christians killed by Islamic extremist...not so bad.
Who said that?

Ken
 
Old 07-07-2015, 06:46 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,604 posts, read 26,223,464 times
Reputation: 12628
Quote:
Originally Posted by beb0p View Post
Let me get this straight, a woman was gunned down and somehow this is a political tool to blame the media and Obama?

I didn't know people can go this low.
.

A tragedy being used as a political tool is a problem?

Where have you been the past six and a half years?
 
Old 07-07-2015, 06:49 PM
 
19,966 posts, read 7,801,084 times
Reputation: 6556
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
Yup.
And here is the section he was referring to:

"...Municipal Court Practices
Ferguson has allowed its focus on revenue generation to fundamentally compromise the
role of Ferguson’s municipal court. The municipal court does not act as a neutral arbiter of the
law or a check on unlawful police conduct. Instead, the court primarily uses its judicial authority
as the means to compel the payment of fines and fees that advance the City’s financial interests.
This has led to court practices that violate the Fourteenth Amendment’s due process and equal
protection requirements. The court’s practices also impose unnecessary harm, overwhelmingly
on African-American individuals, and run counter to public safety.
Most strikingly, the court issues municipal arrest warrants not on the basis of public
safety needs, but rather as a routine response to missed court appearances and required fine
payments. In 2013 alone, the court issued over 9,000 warrants on cases stemming in large part
from minor violations such as parking infractions, traffic tickets, or housing code violations. Jail
time would be considered far too harsh a penalty for the great majority of these code violations,
yet Ferguson’s municipal court routinely issues warrants for people to be arrested and
incarcerated for failing to timely pay related fines and fees. Under state law, a failure to appear
in municipal court on a traffic charge involving a moving violation also results in a license
suspension. Ferguson has made this penalty even more onerous by only allowing the suspension
to be lifted after payment of an owed fine is made in full. Further, until recently, Ferguson also
added charges, fines, and fees for each missed appearance and payment. Many pending cases
still include such charges that were imposed before the court recently eliminated them, making it
as difficult as before for people to resolve these cases.
The court imposes these severe penalties for missed appearances and payments even as
several of the court’s practices create unnecessary barriers to resolving a municipal violation.
The court often fails to provide clear and accurate information regarding a person’s charges or
court obligations. And the court’s fine assessment procedures do not adequately provide for a
defendant to seek a fine reduction on account of financial incapacity or to seek alternatives to payment such as community service. City and court officials have adhered to these court
practices despite acknowledging their needlessly harmful consequences. In August 2013, for
example, one City Councilmember wrote to the City Manager, the Mayor, and other City
officials lamenting the lack of a community service option and noted the benefits of such a
program, including that it would “keep those people that simply don’t have the money to pay
their fines from constantly being arrested and going to jail, only to be released and do it all over
again.”
Together, these court practices exacerbate the harm of Ferguson’s unconstitutional police
practices. They impose a particular hardship upon Ferguson’s most vulnerable residents,
especially upon those living in or near poverty. Minor offenses can generate crippling debts,
result in jail time because of an inability to pay, and result in the loss of a driver’s license,
employment, or housing.
We spoke, for example, with an African-American woman who has a still-pending case
stemming from 2007, when, on a single occasion, she parked her car illegally. She received two
citations and a $151 fine, plus fees. The woman, who experienced financial difficulties and
periods of homelessness over several years, was charged with seven Failure to Appear offenses
for missing court dates or fine payments on her parking tickets between 2007 and 2010. For
each Failure to Appear, the court issued an arrest warrant and imposed new fines and fees. From
2007 to 2014, the woman was arrested twice, spent six days in jail, and paid $550 to the court for
the events stemming from this single instance of illegal parking. Court records show that she
twice attempted to make partial payments of $25 and $50, but the court returned those payments,
refusing to accept anything less than payment in full. One of those payments was later accepted,
but only after the court’s letter rejecting payment by money order was returned as undeliverable.
This woman is now making regular payments on the fine. As of December 2014, over seven
years later, despite initially owing a $151 fine and having already paid $550, she still owed $541..."

As can be seen, that section says NOTHING about racial bias and that womans' case.

The following section deals with racial bias - and lists some pretty good reasons for concern about that:

...Ferguson’s approach to law enforcement both reflects and reinforces racial bias,
including stereotyping. The harms of Ferguson’s police and court practices are borne
disproportionately by African Americans, and there is evidence that this is due in part to
intentional discrimination on the basis of race.
Ferguson’s law enforcement practices overwhelmingly impact African Americans. Data
collected by the Ferguson Police Department from 2012 to 2014 shows that African Americans
account for 85% of vehicle stops, 90% of citations, and 93% of arrests made by FPD officers,
despite comprising only 67% of Ferguson’s population. African Americans are more than twice
as likely as white drivers to be searched during vehicle stops even after controlling for non-race
based variables such as the reason the vehicle stop was initiated, but are found in possession of
contraband 26% less often than white drivers, suggesting officers are impermissibly considering
race as a factor when determining whether to search. African Americans are more likely to be
cited and arrested following a stop regardless of why the stop was initiated and are more likely to
receive multiple citations during a single incident. From 2012 to 2014, FPD issued four or more
citations to African Americans on 73 occasions, but issued four or more citations to non-African
Americans only twice. FPD appears to bring certain offenses almost exclusively against African
Americans. For example, from 2011 to 2013, African Americans accounted for 95% of Mannerrespect to speeding charges brought by FPD, the evidence shows not only that African
Americans are represented at disproportionately high rates overall, but also that the disparate
impact of FPD’s enforcement practices on African Americans is 48% larger when citations are
issued not on the basis of radar or laser, but by some other method, such as the officer’s own
visual assessment.
These disparities are also present in FPD’s use of force. Nearly 90% of documented
force used by FPD officers was used against African Americans. In every canine bite incident
for which racial information is available, the person bitten was African American.
Municipal court practices likewise cause disproportionate harm to African Americans.
African Americans are 68% less likely than others to have their cases dismissed by the court, and
are more likely to have their cases last longer and result in more required court encounters.
African Americans are at least 50% more likely to have their cases lead to an arrest warrant, and
accounted for 92% of cases in which an arrest warrant was issued by the Ferguson Municipal
Court in 2013. Available data show that, of those actually arrested by FPD only because of an
outstanding municipal warrant, 96% are African American.
Our investigation indicates that this disproportionate burden on African Americans
cannot be explained by any difference in the rate at which people of different races violate the
law. Rather, our investigation has revealed that these disparities occur, at least in part, because
of unlawful bias against and stereotypes about African Americans. We have found substantial
evidence of racial bias among police and court staff in Ferguson. For example, we discovered
emails circulated by police supervisors and court staff that stereotype racial minorities as
criminals, including one email that joked about an abortion by an African-American woman
being a means of crime control ...

Doesn't sound like a bogus report to me.

Ken
Disparate impact theory. Blacks are a huge majority in Ferguson. They are the ones committing offenses at a higher rate and not paying tickets or showing up for court etc. They are disparate offenders and that's why there's a disparate outcome. Duh.
 
Old 07-07-2015, 06:50 PM
 
3,216 posts, read 2,072,377 times
Reputation: 1861
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
And the violence those guns were involved in in BLACK NEIGHBORHOODS.
In each case the audience was predominantly black and the issue was the violence in their neighborhoods
Use a little common sense will ya?
Geeze!
.

Ken
Gun control and violent black behavior are two different subjects. The First Lady spewed her anti second amendment agenda, her speeches do not condemn the blacks that are killing her people.
 
Old 07-07-2015, 06:52 PM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,225,145 times
Reputation: 7621
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Now you're admitting he's no more than an absentee president. Also interesting...
Ever read Good to Great? It talks about leaders surrounding themselves with highly competent people. Seems neither Obama nor the Dem Congress did so.
Reading some consultant's e-mails is not the Presidents' job.

Gruber hardly "surrounded" either the President or Obama. Few members of Congress had ever heard of him.

Ken
 
Old 07-07-2015, 07:01 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,421 posts, read 20,194,290 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by urbanlife78 View Post
Ah, and for a moment I thought you were concerned about the actual murder....actually, no I wasn't, I knew from the beginning that the murder didn't matter to you as long as it fueled this strawman argument of yours.
The murder matters. What also matters is that it is "swept under the rug" (apparently) by this administration, which only cares about blacks being killed.
 
Old 07-07-2015, 07:03 PM
 
Location: NE Ohio
30,421 posts, read 20,194,290 times
Reputation: 8958
Quote:
Originally Posted by mtl1 View Post
If any white person did this to a person of another ethnic group especially black, the media would make it major news.
Exactly.
 
Old 07-07-2015, 07:03 PM
 
Location: Free From The Oppressive State
30,132 posts, read 23,523,766 times
Reputation: 38388
Quote:
Originally Posted by BMORE View Post
I'm sorry, but why would the media comment on this? This is a recurring event across the country, daily. It's murder. Now if a black cop walked up to this lady and shot her in the head, then of course there will be a media frenzy and he would definitely face jail time.
Two days after the Ferguson incident, a black Salt Lake City officer shot and killed an unarmed white guy...no media frenzy.
 
Old 07-07-2015, 07:06 PM
 
19,966 posts, read 7,801,084 times
Reputation: 6556
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordBalfor View Post
That's not the section of the report that pertains to race.
Sounds like you didn't actually read the report.
I posted one of the sections that pertains to race. It shows some definite discrepancies with regards to the way Blacks vs White are treated.
Example:
"...African Americans are more than twice
as likely as white drivers to be searched during vehicle stops even after controlling for non-race
based variables such as the reason the vehicle stop was initiated, but are found in possession of
contraband 26% less often than white drivers, suggesting officers are impermissibly considering
race as a factor when determining whether to search. ..."

Ken
Disparate impact theory. First they can't and didn't control for every non-race based variable. Notice the report says "26% less often" and not at a rate 26% less. If blacks and whites had the same population rate of having contraband and blacks are searched twice as often than whites then blacks should be expected to be found with contraband 50% less often. Ie, But since they are not, it shows they are more likely to have contraband and justifies more searches.

The DOJ even uses fuzzy math to support it's disparate impact theory report.

Last edited by mtl1; 07-07-2015 at 07:15 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Closed Thread


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top