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I think officer involved shootings need to be investigated by a Federal task force and not fellow cops or State troopers. An unbiased outside agency would help to bring some trust back into the system.
With the recent events of high-profile mass shootings. Should police officers be allowed to carry military-style assault weapons. Back in 2008 Miami Police Chief John Timoney told the Miami Herald that semiautomatic assault weapons have become “the weapon of choice among gangs.. They're everywhere".
How would one expect police officers to defend their community and themselves basically using pea shooters.
No... Back to the basic 4" barrel .38, 6 shooter.
For Sheriffs and Deputies, with Corporate Police forces being illegal and no existent.
This is in keeping with the spirit of the Second Amendment.
Back to the OP's question there would rarely be a need for suppressive fire by police and hence no need for full auto. There is a better case to be made for full auto in the hands of civilians than in the hands of police, IMO. If I were a cop I would want a shotgun, not a full auto or even a semi auto rifle. The shotgun is the better close-range weapon, and 99 times out of 100 a cop is going to be attacked from close range, not from 100 yards or better.
A shotgun is a very versatile weapon. As a patrol weapon, I would opine it is more of a go to for middle distance, while the handgun is the short range option. Oh, I'm not slighting the shotguns short range capabilities, but loaded with slugs, it can be of use out to 200 yards, and 00 still wallops at 100. Inside 50 yards, its devastating. A shoulder fired Claymore mine. In, probably, well Intl the high 90% of police gunfights, nothing more would be needed.
As I said in an earlier post, I would want a carbine in the trunk more, if I were a rural officer. Distance to an enemy, would be more likely to be further, than in a city, and, said enemy would be far more likely to have a rifle themselves. Or , at the least, a shotgun, of equal capabilities. Nightmare situation, he's standing off at 400 yards, and has you pinned down with a good old 06, and your comms are not working. In that situation, I wouldn't mind having a 308 AR handy.
The likelyhood of such a nightmare is far greater for a rural deputy than a patrolman in. Miami or LA.
A shotgun is a very versatile weapon. As a patrol weapon, I would opine it is more of a go to for middle distance, while the handgun is the short range option. Oh, I'm not slighting the shotguns short range capabilities, but loaded with slugs, it can be of use out to 200 yards, and 00 still wallops at 100. Inside 50 yards, its devastating. A shoulder fired Claymore mine. In, probably, well Intl the high 90% of police gunfights, nothing more would be needed.
As I said in an earlier post, I would want a carbine in the trunk more, if I were a rural officer. Distance to an enemy, would be more likely to be further, than in a city, and, said enemy would be far more likely to have a rifle themselves. Or , at the least, a shotgun, of equal capabilities. Nightmare situation, he's standing off at 400 yards, and has you pinned down with a good old 06, and your comms are not working. In that situation, I wouldn't mind having a 308 AR handy.
The likelyhood of such a nightmare is far greater for a rural deputy than a patrolman in. Miami or LA.
I think someone has watching to many movies.
Lobbing slugs out to 200 yards is dangerious because of the lack of accuracy.
How can you suggest shooting slugs to 200 yards and buck shot at a 100 yards with a 5-8 foot spread and then complain about officers being inaccurate with handguns? Most police issued shotguns do not even have sights, just a bead.
Shotguns are good at some things, accurate fire beyond 25 yards for the majority of users is not one of them. Not to mention the recoil is difficult for some, especially people of smaller stature. Not to mention the recoil also makes practice more difficult, limiting practice time which degrades actual efficiency. This coupled with limited ammo supply, heavy weight, slow reloads and a propensity to jam via short stroking in stressful situations do not make the shot gun ideal.
A police force is not 25 year old 6 foot tall males.
Last edited by shooting4life; 07-18-2015 at 08:25 PM..
Lobbing slugs out to 200 yards is dangerious because of the lack of accuracy.
How can you suggest shooting slugs to 200 yards and buck shot at a 100 yards with a 5-8 foot spread and then complain about officers being inaccurate with handguns? Most police issued shotguns do not even have sights, just a bead.
Shotguns are good at some things, accurate fire beyond 25 yards for the majority of users is not one of them. Not to mention the recoil is difficult for some, especially people of smaller stature. Not to mention the recoil also makes practice more difficult, limiting practice time which degrades actual efficiency. This coupled with limited ammo supply, heavy weight, slow reloads and a propensity to jam via short stroking in stressful situations do not make the shot gun ideal.
A police force is not 25 year old 6 foot tall males.
I am a small in stature male and I don't have any problem with a 12 gauge.
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[/b]I am a small in stature male and I don't have any problem with a 12 gauge.
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I am happy for you.
Women and people of smaller stature have a hard time with shotguns loaded with buck/slugs in general. Especially if it is a one size fits all stock system for a department. Ergos are key for dealing with heavy recoil and shotguns that are left in cars for multiple people are built for larger men.
Women and people of smaller stature have a hard time with shotguns loaded with buck/slugs in general. Especially if it is a one size fits all stock system for a department. Ergos are key for dealing with heavy recoil and shotguns that are left in cars for multiple people are built for larger men.
I would agree that a large bore shotgun should be fitted to the individual, but even the smallest of people can use them with adequate modifications and sufficient training. Mine is off the shelf with an adjustable stock and it is no problem what so ever.
Lobbing slugs out to 200 yards is dangerious because of the lack of accuracy.
How can you suggest shooting slugs to 200 yards and buck shot at a 100 yards with a 5-8 foot spread and then complain about officers being inaccurate with handguns?
Shotguns are good at some things, accurate fire beyond 25 yards for the majority of users is not one of them. Not to mention the recoil is difficult for some, especially people of smaller stature. Not to mention the recoil also makes practice more difficult, limiting practice time which degrades actual efficiency. This coupled with limited ammo supply, heavy weight, slow reloads and a propensity to jam via short stroking in stressful situations do not make the shot gun ideal.
A police force is not 25 year old 6 foot tall males.
Yes, those were extreme examples. Its all just hypothetical stuff. Just spitballing, and, as I said, I was talking about a rur situation, and a one on one , highly unlikely thing. I've played around with the extreme limits of all my guns. Just to see what those limits really are. We are lucky, in that, as we have a really cool place to do that. A huge old dry bed, that butts into a high rock cliff. Lobbing slugs to see how far they can carry was just one experiment. One of my friends got to playing with a 58 sharps, cavalry carbine once. Those big slugs will carry a long ways. We joked about being able to have a smoke after letting her rip, and be stubbing the butt before seeing the splash.
Similar effect with a 1oz 12 ga, rifled slug. 00 at 100 yards would keep someone's head down, needs be, but I'm not intending tosay someone should be looking for a reason to use these limits, for real. Just helps to know those limits, and it was interesting testing them. Since we have a safe place to do so, it was worth actually seeing them. Some of the results were pretty surprising.
I would agree that a large bore shotgun should be fitted to the individual, but even the smallest of people can use them with adequate modifications and sufficient training. Mine is off the shelf with an adjustable stock and it is no problem what so ever.
Most PD's share shotguns in patrol cars which is less than ideal ergo wise.
Not to mention the other pitfalls I have previously mentioned, also they do not penetrate body armor. See Hollywood shoutout for an example of why ar15's are needed in patrol cars.
Most PD's share shotguns in patrol cars which is less than ideal ergo wise.
Not to mention the other pitfalls I have previously mentioned, also they do not penetrate body armor. See Hollywood shoutout for an example of why ar15's are needed in patrol cars.
AR 15 I can to along with.
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