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I was a late bloomer and didn't really start dating until I was well into my 20s and lost my virginity closer to 30 than 20. Maybe that's why I don't see what all the fuss is about. I mean really, sex is overrated, and so are relationships. And yet, society expects me and other men to do x,y and z to "impress women" and "get girls" and go through all these hopes, do all this effort, just to attract a female. And once we get said female we are suppose to "grow up" and basically prostitute ourselves to a 9-5, even if we hate said 9-5, give up our own ambitions in favor of having kids, supporting a wife (so much for "independent women") and family and have no dreams aside from maybe getting a McMansion.
Enter MGTOW, an idea that was around before it had a name. It is about men rejecting the ideas of society and not denying ourselves to satisfy some woman's expectations or what society expects of men. It is NOT about men who don't want to grow up. The opposite, actually: I have a nice job, pay my own bills and even volunteer at a local animal shelter. I just don't spend any more time pursuing women because relationships as a whole are really not worth it. I would rather spend my time becoming a better writer of horror and fantasy or backpacking than trying to meet women at bars or online.
And it is not about hating women. I have more female friends than I do male friends. I have nothing against women as a whole. We don't believe women should be back in the kitchen. Most of us understand that women should be free to pursue whatever ambition they desire. Likewise, we want our own dreams to be OURS and not what society tells us. MGTOW is not anti-woman, but it is pro-men being free and liberated. Women do not have to stay in the kitchen and with the kids any more (thank God) and men don't have to climb the corporate ladder and jump through hopes to attract women and be hubbies anymore (thank God)
Also, MGTOW is as much a middle-finger to the older generation of men as it is to certain (but not all) women. We are telling our fathers and grandfathers that we see the lies they didn't see and that we know why they have grown into old, bitter men: they fell for it. The idea that I as a male have to become a walking ATM machine for a baby-factory who doesn't really care for me and I have to sell my soul for a "dream" of an ugly house filled with brats is dead. That McMansion is a gilded cage...emphasis on the cage part
And finally it is not about feminism. It may have been inspired by some ideas of feminism (if women can be liberated, than so can we) but this is not men giving up because women "refuse to be ladies". Even if I was around "Stepford Wife" kind of women I would still not want to go back to dating...in fact, that would be even worse! At least modern women can actually work and provide something material to a relationship in theory. Back in the day they were just free-loaders. Honestly: is a relationship and sex so important that I would give up my freedom to a free-loader? Not for me, it isn't, and not for a growing number of men.
That is what MGTOW is. It is men's liberation finally here and finally spreading. Deal with it
What you are is worthless if this is your opinion. Society needs strong males who bring children into the world and mentors them to become future leaders themselves. Most important for a MAN is that he does everything in his power to make sure his children are better than he is in every way. That is the goal, not the compilation of wealth and toys. I cannot impress upon you the regret you are going to feel in your older age if you continue on this selfish path. It's in your DNA but this FUBAR society has your mind messed up.
maybe maybe not.
but you can thank todays women from turning guys off from relationships and marriage all together.
I'm not so sure it's todays young women as much as their mothers who raise these young men.
When you are considered a child at 26, live at home and Mom calls your boss at work to complain about not getting that raise it makes one wonder.
The lack of a proper role male roll model at home is a huge factor in many of these Boys never learning to become men.
Most of us guys love making love to a woman and making the effort to getting to know them.
The older I get the more in demand I see for a good man.
Seems to be a shortage of good men who will make the effort in learning about women.
Making love to a woman is one of the pure joys of being human.
None of it is easy but it is worth the effort.
The whole physical thing is overrated. Honestly, I can get more pleasure from a late-night internet forearm workout than I can get from any woman, and with a lot less hassle.
I'm sorry. You are wrong. Sex with someone you truly love is fantastic. And the older you get, the better it gets. Also, you're missing out on something absolutely fantastic: bringing a child into this world.
Does it take effort? Yes. Hiking the pacific trail costs an effort too. Imagine the rush you get when doing something really difficult, like raising a child. Or making a relationship work.
You're not seeing it now, but at some point, you'll wake up and feel empty. No hiking, working or writing will ever be able to fill that void.
I was a late bloomer and didn't really start dating until I was well into my 20s and lost my virginity closer to 30 than 20. Maybe that's why I don't see what all the fuss is about. I mean really, sex is overrated, and so are relationships. And yet, society expects me and other men to do x,y and z to "impress women" and "get girls" and go through all these hopes, do all this effort, just to attract a female. And once we get said female we are suppose to "grow up" and basically prostitute ourselves to a 9-5, even if we hate said 9-5, give up our own ambitions in favor of having kids, supporting a wife (so much for "independent women") and family and have no dreams aside from maybe getting a McMansion.
Enter MGTOW, an idea that was around before it had a name. It is about men rejecting the ideas of society and not denying ourselves to satisfy some woman's expectations or what society expects of men. It is NOT about men who don't want to grow up. The opposite, actually: I have a nice job, pay my own bills and even volunteer at a local animal shelter. I just don't spend any more time pursuing women because relationships as a whole are really not worth it. I would rather spend my time becoming a better writer of horror and fantasy or backpacking than trying to meet women at bars or online.
And it is not about hating women. I have more female friends than I do male friends. I have nothing against women as a whole. We don't believe women should be back in the kitchen. Most of us understand that women should be free to pursue whatever ambition they desire. Likewise, we want our own dreams to be OURS and not what society tells us. MGTOW is not anti-woman, but it is pro-men being free and liberated. Women do not have to stay in the kitchen and with the kids any more (thank God) and men don't have to climb the corporate ladder and jump through hopes to attract women and be hubbies anymore (thank God)
Also, MGTOW is as much a middle-finger to the older generation of men as it is to certain (but not all) women. We are telling our fathers and grandfathers that we see the lies they didn't see and that we know why they have grown into old, bitter men: they fell for it. The idea that I as a male have to become a walking ATM machine for a baby-factory who doesn't really care for me and I have to sell my soul for a "dream" of an ugly house filled with brats is dead. That McMansion is a gilded cage...emphasis on the cage part
And finally it is not about feminism. It may have been inspired by some ideas of feminism (if women can be liberated, than so can we) but this is not men giving up because women "refuse to be ladies". Even if I was around "Stepford Wife" kind of women I would still not want to go back to dating...in fact, that would be even worse! At least modern women can actually work and provide something material to a relationship in theory. Back in the day they were just free-loaders. Honestly: is a relationship and sex so important that I would give up my freedom to a free-loader? Not for me, it isn't, and not for a growing number of men.
That is what MGTOW is. It is men's liberation finally here and finally spreading. Deal with it
You sound angry. So, good for you. I'm a female & guess what? I get tired of society inferring that I should A. meet a man B. fall in love C. get married D. buy a house E. have kids. I have NO desire to have that timeline, none whatsoever. In fact, I can't understand why so many women just fall into that life line. It's weird to me. Anyway, I'd like to be in a relationship but I'm not going to bow to a man either. So, just as you say you're tired of society telling men to be such & such, I too am tired of society telling women what they need to do.
MGTOW'ers have some legitimate beefs: unfair child support system, a justice system tilted heavily towards female interests, etc. but the whole "f**k I'm opting out" is just weak to me. It doesn't solve any of the problems a lot of people in the movement (not directed at you OP) are losers who still live at home.
Ah, so you're one of those people that thinks men should be attracted to whatever society tells them.
No I am one of those people who does not give a crap about anyone else's life but my own and those in my family.
Nothing anyone outside of my family does affects me and I seriously could care less how crazy, complicated, dramatic or easy anyone is because I do not have to deal with any of it.
Dating and life is generally not as complicated and dramatic as so many make it.
Anyone can have anything they want but they need to figure out if what they want is reasonable and able to be acquired.
After that let me repeat, personally I do not care what anyone else does with their lives, make them as stressful, dramatic and complicTed as you wish. None of it affects me but reading about all of the nonsense is somewhat mildly entertaining from time to time.
No I am one of those people who does not give a crap about anyone else's life but my own and those in my family.
Nothing anyone outside of my family does affects me and I seriously could care less how crazy, complicated, dramatic or easy anyone is because I do not have to deal with any of it.
Dating and life is generally not as complicated and dramatic as so many make it.
True. I notice folks who have a lot of drama, virtually always women, create their own with poor decisions.
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