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Lots of self-hating in here. Fact is most invading peoples settle on the backs of the locals, it's reality. If you're proud of your country then by intellectual honesty you should be proud of the person who discovered this land for you, which is Christopher Columbus. Without him you have no United States, and the world is a very different place including exponentially more atrocities.
Columbus Day should be celebrated for giving us what we have today, early misdeeds notwithstanding
I don't understand why you say that. He didn't discover the land that became the United States.
Right. but he just happened to have that Americus Vas Navigator along and ended up in America and not some guy named Cathay or Inidcus. No I think they all knew where they were going and what they were going to do when they got there.
Research is now casting doubt on the idea that Columbus was essentially an ambitious but broke nobody who somehow persuaded a queen that he could find a quick route to India -- and then got lost and stumbled on a new world. NJGOAT found links to some fascinating information that is based on the research. See his post #10 in the History thread called "Real story of Columbus voyages?"
Research is now casting doubt on the idea that Columbus was essentially an ambitious but broke nobody who somehow persuaded a queen that he could find a quick route to India -- and then got lost and stumbled on a new world. NJGOAT found links to some fascinating information that is based on the research. See his post #10 in the History thread called "Real story of Columbus voyages?"
All these years we've paid homage to a "broke nobody" ?
History sure got white washed along the way didn't it ?
More splitting hairs, I guess the Caribbean isn't at all related to this continent
For us to have a national holiday, I think it ought to have something to do with our nation, rather than the discovery of the Caribbean and South America.
For us to have a national holiday, I think it ought to have something to do with our nation, rather than the discovery of the Caribbean and South America.
So, since our largest city was founded not by the Spanish, nor the English, nor for religious reasons, let's celebrate Dutch heritage day and make it all about commerce!
Well..... Germany is the most powerful country in the EU. Should they be proud of their Nazi past? I should give thanks for that guy? Really?
Based on this thread, I feel like in 400-500 years there will be a Hitler Day. Then when people bring up how disturbing it is that Hitler gets a national holiday, others will just say "thats just how people were back then." Because you know everyone back in 1492 was slaughtering everyone in sight, selling children as sex slaves, and starting an Atlantic slave trade. Everyone was trying to start their own slave trade (when they weren't busy dying from whatever disease they were being plagued with). Columbus was just the best and won the slave trade prize. What a winner that guy was, am I right?!
For us to have a national holiday, I think it ought to have something to do with our nation, rather than the discovery of the Caribbean and South America.
Michele da Cuneo, Columbus' childhood friend from Savona, sailed with Columbus during the second voyage and wrote...in a letter that Columbus had provided one of the captured indigenous women to him. He wrote, "While I was in the boat, I captured a very beautiful Carib woman, whom the said Lord Admiral gave to me. When I had taken her to my cabin she was naked—as was their custom. I was filled with a desire to take my pleasure with her and attempted to satisfy my desire. She was unwilling, and so treated me with her nails that I wished I had never begun. But—to cut a long story short—I then took a piece of rope and whipped her soundly, and she let forth such incredible screams that you would not have believed your ears. Eventually we came to such terms, I assure you, that you would have thought that she had been brought up in a school for whores."
Hard to prove? I hardly think so.
I'm about as far from lefty/liberal as you can get without getting into total anarchy, and I don't think CC should be a holiday we celebrate here.
Columbus was imprisoned for brutality and tyranny in his own time, never mind the considerations of the current time. He was later released but stripped of his titles and deprived of the bulk of the [expected] profits he was to receive. He was a sadistic, murderous, thieving [censored] who doesn't deserve any honors. He was not, and is not, a 'hero'.
Columbus never set foot on North America, which he wasn't looking for anyway. He was totally screwed up and his math was wrong despite numerous people who attempted to correct his misconceptions. He was repeatedly denied financing until he finally conned Ferdinand into it. He was lost, and until the day he died he *still* believed he had found India...though no one else did.
Columbus was a dope, and a [censored], and he doesn't deserve a holiday. He should *not* be celebrated. He should not be dropped from the history books, but more accurately depicted as the murderous scum he was.
God damn he was a sicko!!
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