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Name me a single public K-12 teacher that is posting in this here forum saying the above bolded. I'll help you out here... here's your comment:
teachers complaining about how hard they work and how underpaid they are,
And please refrain from giving some anecdotal teachers you've overheard in a bar or restaurant. I mean actual public school teachers posting in here so we have some evidence of such.
Go ahead, I'll wait...
But you are right in your quote: Hard work is relative, and people who work in different fields have vastly different ideas of what that entails. Everyone else seems to think that their jobs are beastly while everyone else's job is a pie-in-the-sky job. Realistically, we know this isn't true, but for some reason, it still comes out that way in discussions.
And for all of you: for the nth time, this isn't some damn competition between professions, so why is this even brought up? Yes, nursing is hard (my mom was a CNA). So is engineering, firefighting (my dad was a professional), business (I'd die rather than make a living on my ability to sell something to someone), etc. So, yes. You're job is hard. Why in the Hell can't you believe that a public teacher's job is, too? Virtually none of you have ever done it. And for those of you that have family members that were teachers... sorry, not the same thing. You can't criticize another teachers comments simply based on what your teacher-mom talked about.
Unless you've actually done the damn job, then you have absolutely no right in criticizing those that do and their comments concerning it. So take your absurdly ill-informed opinions, put a light coat of oil on it, stick it where the sun don't shine, and shut the hell up!
In bold, by color of rainbow:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman71
You've already proven to us that you can't fathom it by illustrating how little you know about our time "off" during the summers and breaks.
Ever had to go to a basketball game in your division in another city 100 miles away from home on a Tuesday night? A volleyball tournament on a Saturday in another state? A wrestling tournament during Thanksgiving in another state?
Ever had to go to an Academic team tournament all day on a Saturday? A Key club convention in another city overnight? An all-day drill meet? Or a two day trip to another city? Many club sponsors get absolutely no stipend (like coaching) for these things. And in several cases, they have to pay out of pocket in order to do so.
Even coaching on the weekends sucks considering that - unless your the head football or basketball coach - you're making about 50 cents/hour doing this crap. Sounds like a great amount of compensation for time spent away from home right?
And let's be perfectly clear about something... when it comes to sponsoring clubs/teams, most teachers are not compensated at all, even sometimes paying out of pocket for seeing that the clubs can actually do what they need. Many don't even have a budget for the things they do. And most would rather give up the club and stay home instead, but it's a part of our job. There's very few teachers in a large school that aren't sponsoring something.
And coaching salaries suck.
Big effin' deal. I've had students take swings at me, too. It's a physical and legal risk just trying to break up fights.
So what's your point?
Where do you teach? If you don't teach in a public K-12 setting, then you have no basis for comparison. Teaching adults in a community college, teaching private schools where disciplinary actions can be more stringent, teaching adult ed in industry, or any other teaching situation is nowhere near the same as a public K-12 teacher.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Starman71
Yup. But it is capped at $250, and most - but not all - of my colleagues exceed this each year, so they deduct the rest by itemizing. I never excess the standard deduction so I end up losing the rest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi
I understand what you're saying. But I would like to point out a couple of things.
Yes, there is "Christmas vacation" and "Easter vacation". We don't have office parties, however, as many do in the private sector. And most people have off at least 1 day for Christmas and 1 day for New Years if they don't occur on the weekend.
(I just have to say, this is really petty, to begrudge people in the private sector a Christmas party. It's by no means universal, even in the private, for-profit sector, and hardly happen in the private non-profit and public sectors.)
Teachers in most systems go to work one week before school starts, and work several days after students leave at the end of the year.
While in education, every 5th year there was one summer I didn't get vacation because it was back to college to get recertified. And, just for the record, I had a Bachelors Degree, Masters Degree, advanced degree just short of a doctorate, and enough individual credits that they equaled another Masters Degree. Not all teachers have that background, but recertifcation is mandatory, and in most states every 5 years.
As an administrator, I also worked 44-55 hour weeks, often so you parents could come to school for PTA meetings, special events, and so forth. And BTW, a 44 hour week was rare...usually more like 50.
Now, I'm not complaining. I got good pay and very good benefits while I put up with a few rotten kids (most were great) and a few ahole parents (most were great).
Now, I could go on and make some slams against nurses -- without exaggerating a bit -- but I know that the vast majority of you work hard and do great things, and put up with outrageous hours and often ill treatment from doctors. Yes, you as a nurse sometimes save lives, but to be honest with you, most nurses don't save many lives, if any. And, not all teachers are good and competent, but sometimes we make lives.
And you did!
Happy now, Starman71? And that's just the two of you who I know are teachers!
Last edited by Katarina Witt; 12-24-2015 at 04:26 PM..
Happy now, Starman71? And that's just the two of you who I know are teachers!
Good God!! Are you truly that obtuse?! That dense?!? Please tell me I'm dealing with someone that does actually have common sense and adult reading comprehension. Jesus, you truly don't get it, do you!?!?
There is a big - gigantic - difference between complaining about a topic and setting people straight with regards to their ignorance. Please tell me you know the difference, please!
Here, let me help.
One: pissing and moaning (wallowing in a "woe-is-me" attitude)
Two: informing others about their misunderstandings concerning teachers and their jobs
If you can't tell the difference, then you have shown that you either 1) don't have the intelligence to do so, or 2) you simply ignore it, as it runs counter to what you want to hear, see or believe.
I'm done talking to you. You have shown time and again that you really don't have the wits to converse intelligently on certain topics outside your purview without sounding foollish. You were already on my ignore list when you had a different screen name, which of course, makes one wonder why you changed it.
Well, welcome back to my ignore list.
Last edited by Starman71; 12-24-2015 at 04:40 PM..
Ever had to go to a basketball game in your division in another city 100 miles away from home on a Tuesday night? A volleyball tournament on a Saturday in another state? A wrestling tournament during Thanksgiving in another state?
Ever had to go to an Academic team tournament all day on a Saturday? A Key club convention in another city overnight? An all-day drill meet? Or a two day trip to another city? Many club sponsors get absolutely no stipend (like coaching) for these things. And in several cases, they have to pay out of pocket in order to do so.
Even coaching on the weekends sucks considering that - unless your the head football or basketball coach - you're making about 50 cents/hour doing this crap. Sounds like a great amount of compensation for time spent away from home right?
And let's be perfectly clear about something... when it comes to sponsoring clubs/teams, most teachers are not compensated at all, even sometimes paying out of pocket for seeing that the clubs can actually do what they need. Many don't even have a budget for the things they do. And most would rather give up the club and stay home instead, but it's a part of our job. There's very few teachers in a large school that aren't sponsoring something.
Coaching sports and teaching are two different things. My teacher/administrator parents never travelled to a single sporting event in all their years. Education is not sports, although sports are allowed to creep into the schools on the tax payer's dime for reasons I will never understand. The best thing that could happen is for sports to be removed from the publicly funded educational system.
Many people travel for their jobs, including my husband who is an Engineer on a flat salary and never makes a dime of overtime on week-long trips, sometimes to Europe, with exhausting jet lag, arriving home from the airport at 8 pm only to get up and be in the office again at 8 am. A weekend trip to a sporting event, which is seen as a fun hobby where guys get together and drink beer, would be like a paid vacation for him.
Coaching sports and teaching are two different things. My teacher/administrator parents never travelled to a single sporting event in all their years. Education is not sports, although sports are allowed to creep into the schools on the tax payer's dime for reasons I will never understand. The best thing that could happen is for sports to be removed from the publicly funded educational system.
Many people travel for their jobs, including my husband who is an Engineer on a flat salary and never makes a dime of overtime on week-long trips, sometimes to Europe, with exhausting jet lag, arriving home from the airport at 8 pm only to get up and be in the office again at 8 am. A weekend trip to a sporting event, which is seen as a fun hobby where guys get together and drink beer, would be like a paid vacation for him.
But in many school systems - almost all, I would venture to guess - teaching and coaching/sponsoring go hand in hand. In every interview I've ever had, one of the questions, without fail, is what sports could/would I coach. What clubs do I have an interest in. Rookie teachers are hit up each year by the veterans to take over their clubs/teams. Principals will ask - and I really mean coerce - the rookies to take over a sport. If not, it might look bad next year when contracts are offered. Get the drift?
You're parents may have been very fortunate, but most systems will almost require it, if you'd like to keep your job.
So, nope. Coaching and teaching are NOT necessarily two different things. As a matter of fact, I once had a teaching job offer rescinded because I refused to sign a coaching contract. If I'd had my way, I'd rather not have them in school, but we deal with cards we're dealt.
As for your hubby: so he travels... just like I did as a coach/sponsor and almost every one of the teachers I've worked with. Did I say teachers were the only ones who did this? Nope. All I pointed out was that we teachers also do much of this, and without adequate compensation. Much more than many people know about.
With all due respect, you're parents are more of the exception rather than the rule.
Coaching sports and teaching are two different things. My teacher/administrator parents never travelled to a single sporting event in all their years. Education is not sports, although sports are allowed to creep into the schools on the tax payer's dime for reasons I will never understand. The best thing that could happen is for sports to be removed from the publicly funded educational system.
Many people travel for their jobs, including my husband who is an Engineer on a flat salary and never makes a dime of overtime on week-long trips, sometimes to Europe, with exhausting jet lag, arriving home from the airport at 8 pm only to get up and be in the office again at 8 am. A weekend trip to a sporting event, which is seen as a fun hobby where guys get together and drink beer, would be like a paid vacation for him.
Well, yeah, mine too LOve, but you have to keep in mind-
Someone will likely come on in a few minutes to tell you to quit whining, that it's OK for them because they get a Christmas party.
But in many school systems - almost all, I would venture to guess - teaching and coaching/sponsoring go hand in hand. In every interview I've ever had, one of the questions, without fail, is what sports could/would I coach. What clubs do I have an interest in. Rookie teachers are hit up each year by the veterans to take over their clubs/teams. Principals will ask - and I really mean coerce - the rookies to take over a sport. If not, it might look bad next year when contracts are offered. Get the drift?
You're parents may have been very fortunate, but most systems will almost require it, if you'd like to keep your job.
So, nope. Coaching and teaching are NOT necessarily two different things. As a matter of fact, I once had a teaching job offer rescinded because I refused to sign a coaching contract. If I'd had my way, I'd rather not have them in school, but we deal with cards we're dealt.
As for your hubby: so he travels... just like I did as a coach/sponsor and almost every one of the teachers I've worked with. Did I say teachers were the only ones who did this? Nope. All I pointed out was that we teachers also do much of this, and without adequate compensation. Much more than many people know about.
With all due respect, you're parents are more of the exception rather than the rule.
Ah, the old, "that's different" line! Merry Christmas to you, too!
Good God!! Are you truly that obtuse?! That dense?!? Please tell me I'm dealing with someone that does actually have common sense and adult reading comprehension. Jesus, you truly don't get it, do you!?!?
There is a big - gigantic - difference between complaining about a topic and setting people straight with regards to their ignorance. Please tell me you know the difference, please!
Here, let me help.
One: pissing and moaning (wallowing in a "woe-is-me" attitude)
Two: informing others about their misunderstandings concerning teachers and their jobs
If you can't tell the difference, then you have shown that you either 1) don't have the intelligence to do so, or 2) you simply ignore it, as it runs counter to what you want to hear, see or believe.
I'm done talking to you. You have shown time and again that you really don't have the wits to converse intelligently on certain topics outside your purview without sounding foollish. You were already on my ignore list when you had a different screen name, which of course, makes one wonder why you changed it.
Well, welcome back to my ignore list.
I didn't read your entire personal attack, supposedly a violation of the TOS here, but I could not care less if I'm on your ignore list, and I resent your implication that I changed my name for some nefarious purpose. If you go to "About the Forum" you will see this is a commonly asked question. //www.city-data.com/forum/about...-username.html
Well, you're usually pretty well through an undergrad program before the working hours, etc become clear.
Bub, you can't unring that bell:
Unring it? You just quoted me saying: "I know that the vast majority of you work hard and do great things".
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