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I agree, if I have offended anyone, I apologize. I was only responding to the "soft target," post. What is even more asinine is the horrific killing of innocent 5 and 6 year olds. The killing and wounding of innocent people, going about their daily lives, has to be one of the saddest times in American history.
It is so frightening not to know when some nutcase with a grudge against humanity will strike. I just don't feel secure, anymore. I worry for my children and grandchildren and all innocent human beings. It's just so weird to live in a world where guns and mental illness are destroying all we believe in.
I hear the Powerball jackpot is somewhere in the neighborhood of around 800,000,000 dollars tonight....
Why don't you go buy yourself a ticket, you'd probably have better odds at winning that than finding yourself in a mass shooting scenario...
Scanning all the comments in this thread and about the only clear fact is that most people believe what they do for reasons that are not easy to fully understand. That the NRA does not sell guns, for example, might be true from a strict literal standpoint. No, there is no NRA gun store where someone can actually buy a gun from the NRA, but it seems all too many don't understand what role the NRA actually does play when it comes to the sale of guns, far more significant, consequential and far-reaching than any one gun seller could even imagine on their own. Beyond what most people realize, that seems obvious. I was thinking of providing some of the information about this that everyone should surely know, when this wikipedia link finally showed up -- containing the real facts of the matter -- perhaps time better spent reading the information in this link over time spent pretending we know what we really don't.
Not that people can't be excused for not knowing what a PAC does, but I suspect all too many people, especially those inclined to describe gun-control measures as "anti-2nd Amendment gun control measures," are not really wanting to know what the NRA truly is or does, or so their comments seem to suggest.
My compliments to AngryTaxPayer for bringing some light to help us get through this fog.
A lot of people try to call the NRA a "gun lobby" to try and confuse the issue, but what it really is, is a gun rights lobby... What the NRA does is lobby on behalf of it's members. The NRA has done more to encourage gun safety than any other gun control group ever has.
But no matter, because even if the NRA were funded by and representative of gun manufacturers, it doesn't matter a bit to me because we share the same spot on the ideological spectrum. The NRA and many gun owners have the same goals, so it matters little to me who they "really" represent....
Quote:
Originally Posted by And D
You wrote what I "seem to be implying." Not quite right, so I tried to make myself more clear.
Perhaps you didn't miss anything, and perhaps we agree that the NRA is quite powerful in terms of what it does to lobby, educate and litigate and maybe we can even agree those efforts are very directly tied toward gun sales and that gun sales help finance the NRA (not just membership fees). Maybe most importantly, we can agree that too much money is being used to buy our elected representatives votes (from both sides) rather than as might be cast if our elected representatives were not so dependent on those contributions.
If we agree about that, we can probably also agree what gun-control legislation actually passes or does not pass into law is a bit too much about the influence of special interest groups and their money vs what the majority of the public may prefer.
It is so frightening not to know when some nutcase with a grudge against humanity will strike. I just don't feel secure, anymore. I worry for my children and grandchildren and all innocent human beings. It's just so weird to live in a world where guns and mental illness are destroying all we believe in.
The most dangerous of those nutcases end up being leaders in government.
People worry because they feel helpless. Take a self defense class and take control. It doesn't even have to be a class focusing on guns. The video below is a great example of a seminar that covered a lot of safety ideas without focusing on guns.
Is the agenda of the NRA rooted in patriotism, to protect our right to bear arms, or is it profits, gun sales?
I often wonder why all that money is necessary to lobby Congress against gun control measures if we as a country feel so strongly about unrestricted gun sales. The gun control debate includes a host of complicated issues, but one thing for sure, the gun makers have a lot of money at stake when it comes to restricting the sale of their products.
Bonus question: do more guns sold mean more or less incidents of gun violence?
Numbers of guns do not play into your hypothetical query unless you went into every depressed gangland hood and distributed them to every low life. If you went into nice suburbs you will find people who will cherish the weapon, keep it clean and safe from prying eyes and hands. The only time it will be fired is at a target at a range.
You make it sound as if they are lobbying for the right to shoot people. It is sales. Read on.
You are aware of the fact all industries, foreign and domestic, lobby on Capitol Hill, no?
Corn, soy beans, milk, you name it. Condoms, diapers and tampons as well.
Insurance/pharma companies have more lobbyists than most. Gee...I wonder why...
Consider what kind of money banks spend up there.
Find the NRA website and educate yourself about their agenda; it's pretty basic.
You wrote what I "seem to be implying." Not quite right, so I tried to make myself more clear.
Perhaps you didn't miss anything, and perhaps we agree that the NRA is quite powerful in terms of what it does to lobby, educate and litigate and maybe we can even agree those efforts are very directly tied toward gun sales and that gun sales help finance the NRA (not just membership fees). Maybe most importantly, we can agree that too much money is being used to buy our elected representatives votes (from both sides) rather than as might be cast if our elected representatives were not so dependent on those contributions.
If we agree about that, we can probably also agree what gun-control legislation actually passes or does not pass into law is a bit too much about the influence of special interest groups and their money vs what the majority of the public may prefer.
Fair?
The NRA speaks for its members. That is their job. That is the public using their dollars to ensure their voice is heard. Expenditure of capital to convey a message is and always has been speech. If you want to suppress speech thats cool, its just not my thing.
Do you suggest Americans voices be suppressed because they are utilizing capital to ensure a venue?
Numbers of guns do not play into your hypothetical query unless you went into every depressed gangland hood and distributed them to every low life. If you went into nice suburbs you will find people who will cherish the weapon, keep it clean and safe from prying eyes and hands. The only time it will be fired is at a target at a range.
You make it sound as if they are lobbying for the right to shoot people. It is sales. Read on.
You are aware of the fact all industries, foreign and domestic, lobby on Capitol Hill, no?
Corn, soy beans, milk, you name it. Condoms, diapers and tampons as well.
Insurance/pharma companies have more lobbyists than most. Gee...I wonder why...
Consider what kind of money banks spend up there.
Find the NRA website and educate yourself about their agenda; it's pretty basic.
I don't know what to make of all this information and examples imparted here as if we don't all know what a lobby is and what they do. I would love to compare the soy bean lobby with the NRA for fun, but I think that's a lot like comparing apples with diapers, and that doesn't make much sense to me.
I don't make anything "sound" as you wish to suggest. I have just shared information and posed a question or two that I think is sound and worth asking. Thoughts and questions that weigh on my mind anyway (with all due respect to how right or wrong we all feel about how our Congress is lobbied by special interests).
Here is another question or two that weighs on my mind a little more than what the milk lobby is up to.
What is the rate of homicides in this country by firearms per 1 million people and how does this compare to other countries? Why?
BTW, I have looked at the NRA website along with a good many other sources of information, propaganda and statistics, and I have shared a few, but to suggest I/we need only look at the NRA website is a little short of what it takes to make informed conclusions, is it not? Or maybe we need only look at the White House website to know all we need to know about Obama's agenda? Is that the thinking here?
I agree, if I have offended anyone, I apologize. I was only responding to the "soft target," post. What is even more asinine is the horrific killing of innocent 5 and 6 year olds. The killing and wounding of innocent people, going about their daily lives, has to be one of the saddest times in American history.
It is so frightening not to know when some nutcase with a grudge against humanity will strike. I just don't feel secure, anymore. I worry for my children and grandchildren and all innocent human beings. It's just so weird to live in a world where guns and mental illness are destroying all we believe in.
My god have you been brainwashed, the media has really done a number on you. What's so weird is how grossly skewed your perception of the real world is. Guns and mental illness destroying all we believe in? Are you kidding? Deer kill almost as many people per year as some random mentally ill nut with a gun.
The media is making you afraid of something so remotely unlikely to happen it's not worth worrying about. You are 100x more likely to be killed by a car, do you worry about that? Are you so frightened not knowing when some Honda may come out of nowhere and kill you?
Saddest times in American history? Some might say that the civil war was the saddest time when hundreds of thousands of Americans killed other Americans. Or maybe when the US government slaughtered Indians, including innocent 5 and 6 year olds, with guns and without the excuse of being mentally ill.
This is an incredibly safe time in the US, the crime rate has been dropping for DECADES, the murder rate is 1/2 what is was 20 years ago, and yet you think this is one of the saddest times in American history. I feel sorry for you and how out of touch you really are. You should be angry at the politicians and the media that have twisted your mind so much.
According to statistics gathered by the UN Office on Drugs and Crime, the 2011 intentional homicide rates per 100,000 for the countries identified by Matt are as follows: Norway (2), Iceland (1), France (1), Denmark (1), New Zealand (1), and the UK (1). The rate for the U.S. as a whole is 5. As of 2011, there were 3,172 white murder victims in the U.S., according to the FBI. The white population as a whole is 245.5 million, including whites who identify as Latinos. This yields an intentional homicide rate of 1.29, a number almost indistinguishable from those of Iceland, France, Denmark, New Zealand, and the UK and lower than the intentional homicide rate of Norway, Canada (2), Belgium (2), Israel (2), and Finland (2). In contrast, there were 2,695 black murder victims in 2011 against a 2013 black population of 41.7 million, which yields an intentional homicide rate of approximately 6.5., a rate higher than that of Kenya (6) but lower than that of Lithuania (7).
In spite of what liberals want people to believe there are far more, and more significant, differences between countries than how many guns there are that have bigger impact on their societies. The US doesn't have a "gun problem" it has serious people problems.
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