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View Poll Results: What level of gun restrictions is right?
I believe private citizens should not be allowed to own firearms (total ban). 7 3.78%
I believe private citizens should have many more restrictions on firearms (no military-style weapons, magazines of a certain size, etc). 37 20.00%
I believe existing gun laws are fine, we just need better enforcement. 70 37.84%
I believe existing gun laws are too restrictive; they should be loosened. 31 16.76%
I believe there should be no laws on firearm ownership, since it is a right guaranteed by the Second Amendment. 40 21.62%
Voters: 185. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 01-27-2016, 01:23 PM
 
29,358 posts, read 9,541,969 times
Reputation: 3426

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Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
I would be against any gun control measure that is focusing on the law abiding citizens.
Unfortunately, and this is what it seems so many anti-gun control advocates can't seem to understand or accept..., we ALL good law-abiding citizens pay for the "bad apples." That is not a result of public policy that "targets" good citizens or wants to "focus" on good citizens. It is simply because you can't restrain bad activity without affecting even those not so engaged.

We all pay more for products at stores because of shop-lifters. We all pay more in interest on our credit cards, because of people who abuse credit. We pay more for medical services and hospital costs because people smoke. We can't have a beer at the beach or park, because the "bad apples" can't behave!

The trade-offs are everywhere when it comes to modern-day society, what we good people need to tolerate because of bad people. The issue of gun control is not immune from this reality...

 
Old 01-27-2016, 01:30 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,866 posts, read 46,395,966 times
Reputation: 18520
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
It is real simple, increase the punishment for using a gun in a crime.


There was a day, you swang at noon, in the town square for all to see what happens.
Oh the embarrassment.
 
Old 01-27-2016, 01:34 PM
 
29,358 posts, read 9,541,969 times
Reputation: 3426
Default Always wanting to play legal expert...

Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
It is real simple, increase the punishment for using a gun in a crime.

That is common sense.

Instead you have anti gun liberals who want to reduce sentencing for criminal acts and restrict the civil rights of all Americans. An example, in California is used to be if you stole a gun you would be charged with a felony. A prop passed in the last couple of years that reduced that crime to a misdemeanor.
One man's common sense is another man's confusion...

According to Glendale criminal defense attorney David F. Poblete:

“Until November of 2014, when California voters passed Proposition 47, any theft of a firearm was considered ‘grand theft firearm.' But Prop 47 was intended to introduce a little sanity to California criminal law, by reducing the potential penalties for a number of nonviolent offenses. Prop 47 provides that theft of a firearm is only grand theft if the firearm is worth more than $950 or the defendant has a particularly serious prior. But because the particularly serious prior may have occurred decades ago—and may have next to nothing to do with the current offense—you can still see pretty unfair results under the new law.”

Example: When Scott is 19, he is convicted of Penal Code 288 lewd acts with a minor for molesting a 13-year-old girl. After serving his sentence, Scott receives psychological treatment for sex addiction and turns his life around.

Years later, when he is in his 40s, Scott develops a painkiller addiction following an injury at work. He ends up stealing small items to support his drug habit.

One day Scott shoplifts an old pistol, worth only a few hundred dollars, from a gun store.

Normally theft of a gun worth that little would be considered only petty theft. But because Scott has a prior conviction for a qualifying offense, he is charged instead with grand theft firearm.
 
Old 01-27-2016, 01:41 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
1,951 posts, read 1,627,540 times
Reputation: 1577
Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
It is real simple, increase the punishment for using a gun in a crime.

That is common sense.

Instead you have anti gun liberals who want to reduce sentencing for criminal acts and restrict the civil rights of all Americans. An example, in California is used to be if you stole a gun you would be charged with a felony. A prop passed in the last couple of years that reduced that crime to a misdemeanor.
That's the type of thing that doesn't make sense.


The pro-gun reform types want to add laws like magazine capacity limits and scary cosmetic bans, like that's going to make a measurable difference to criminal acts.


Better enforcement on laws we already have? Like throwing the book at criminals that have already broken 20 laws? Now we're talking. Keeping the same limp-wristed penalties and just adding a 21st doesn't make sense.
 
Old 01-27-2016, 01:57 PM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,480,207 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
Unfortunately, and this is what it seems so many anti-gun control advocates can't seem to understand or accept..., we ALL good law-abiding citizens pay for the "bad apples." That is not a result of public policy that "targets" good citizens or wants to "focus" on good citizens. It is simply because you can't restrain bad activity without affecting even those not so engaged.

We all pay more for products at stores because of shop-lifters. We all pay more in interest on our credit cards, because of people who abuse credit. We pay more for medical services and hospital costs because people smoke. We can't have a beer at the beach or park, because the "bad apples" can't behave!

The trade-offs are everywhere when it comes to modern-day society, what we good people need to tolerate because of bad people. The issue of gun control is not immune from this reality...


Of course there are perfectly good policies that don't target good citizens. The gun control advocates do NOT want want anybody to have guns. That is their agenda.

Here's a few good policies that would dramatically decrease gun violence - that is if you are looking for the real solution:

1. Get rid of background checks. Instead, evaluate every convicted felon or mentally ill on his or her eligibility to own firearm. If not eligible, the said person must remain in prison or in hospital for another X years until next evaluation.
2. Impose 10 years mandatory for any felony committed with a firearm; 25 if shots being fired; life if anybody including the perpetrator is hurt.
3. Parents and legal guardians must be held liable for crimes committed by their children or person under their guardianship.
 
Old 01-27-2016, 02:08 PM
 
29,358 posts, read 9,541,969 times
Reputation: 3426
Default A non-starter straw man argument right out the gate...

Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
The gun control advocates do NOT want want anybody to have guns. That is their agenda.
Rhetoric like this makes even the most patient reasonable person tune out, because when the premise is so bad, why bother with the rest?
 
Old 01-27-2016, 02:27 PM
 
Location: Nashville, TN
1,951 posts, read 1,627,540 times
Reputation: 1577
Quote:
Originally Posted by LearnMe View Post
Rhetoric like this makes even the most patient reasonable person tune out, because when the premise is so bad, why bother with the rest?
Pot, meet kettle.
 
Old 01-27-2016, 03:10 PM
 
29,358 posts, read 9,541,969 times
Reputation: 3426
Default Lazy bones...

Quote:
Originally Posted by numberfive View Post
Pot, meet kettle.
Doesn't get any easier than just lobbing accusations (even worse with over-used idioms), but hey..., why should anybody make an effort here given what we get paid, right? Even easier than just asking for a list! Though that effort did go on and on and on to the point of exhaustion...

Still, I dare ANYONE wanting to accuse me of being the pot or kettle to compare anything I have written to this statement here:

Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
The gun control advocates do NOT want want anybody to have guns. That is their agenda.

Too bad we don't have a judge and jury here to decide such matters, or even a level head or two...
 
Old 01-27-2016, 03:18 PM
 
46,175 posts, read 26,894,103 times
Reputation: 11071
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gungnir View Post
That's still insufficient unless your priority criteria is which letter begins the item. You missed off Aardvark and Zyxt.
Would you expect anything different from a lefty?

They have to go in order, or they.....
 
Old 01-27-2016, 03:25 PM
 
29,358 posts, read 9,541,969 times
Reputation: 3426
Default Doing what I can...

Quote:
Originally Posted by chucksnee View Post
Would you expect anything different from a lefty?

They have to go in order, or they.....
I got to thinking just keep things simple, including the list, as simple as possible for you pack of three here...
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