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I notice our "dear friend" neglected to mention any of that in his copypasta from wikipedia.
I wonder why. He is so objective and made an amazing career in critical thinking and conflict solving, that one may think that he will gather all the facts before trying to talk about stuff, but hell, what do I know.
Maybe if I review your history again I will come to understand that Shamir, Begin, Ben-Gurion and the rest of these leaders were simple peaceful men who avoided violence at every turn in favor of fostering peaceful co-existance with their Arab neighbors back in the 1930's. Maybe the Arabs should have ignored the alliance with the British who ruled over their lives from England.
Then why should the Arabs feel threatened by an influx of immigrants contrary to what many viewed as an agreed upon limit of those numbers by the British subject to Arab approval, let alone what seems to have been behind-the-scenes marshaling of soldiers and weapons to create a Hebrew Army. Why such an army when no doubt the idea was to simply live in peace as Palestinians, Jews and Arabs together?
Maybe I have the dates wrong, but it seems to me the documented history clearly suggests the Hebrew Army was viewed necessary by Zionist leaders in Palestine a good time before the Arabs even knew what was happening.
Why? Because these early Zionist leaders had every intent to carve out Israel and take that land by force, regardless of the Arabs, despite the Arabs, without acceptance by the Arabs, at the expense of the Arabs. That is why the Hebrew Army was needed rather than peaceful immigration of Jews to live with Arabs in Palestine.
Yes, but let's view the Zionists as the lambs and the Palestinians as the lions. How can we not?
You keep working on that version while we also look the other way with each year these different versions of history unfold, now under the wing of the United States after the British could take no more...
"In addition to financial and military aid, the United States also provides political support to Israel, having used its United Nations Security Council veto power 42 times with respect to resolutions relating to Israel, out of a total 83 times in which its veto has ever been used. Between 1991 and 2011, 15 vetos were used to protect Israel out of 24 in total."
Maybe if I review your history again I will come to understand that Shamir, Begin, Ben-Gurion and the rest of these leaders were simple peaceful men who avoided violence at every turn in favor of fostering peaceful co-existance with their Arab neighbors back in the 1930's. Maybe the Arabs should have ignored the alliance with the British who ruled over their lives from England.
Then why should the Arabs feel threatened by an influx of immigrants contrary to what many viewed as an agreed upon limit of those numbers by the British subject to Arab approval, let alone what seems to have been behind-the-scenes marshaling of soldiers and weapons to create a Hebrew Army. Why such an army when no doubt the idea was to simply live in peace as Palestinians, Jews and Arabs together?
Maybe I have the dates wrong, but it seems to me the documented history clearly suggests the Hebrew Army was viewed necessary by Zionist leaders in Palestine a good time before the Arabs even knew what was happening.
Why? Because these early Zionist leaders had every intent to carve out Israel and take that land by force, regardless of the Arabs, despite the Arabs, without acceptance by the Arabs, at the expense of the Arabs. That is why the Hebrew Army was needed rather than peaceful immigration of Jews to live with Arabs in Palestine.
Yes, but let's view the Zionists as the lambs and the Palestinians as the lions. How can we not?
You keep working on that version while we also look the other way with each year these different versions of history unfold, now under the wing of the United States after the British could take no more...
"In addition to financial and military aid, the United States also provides political support to Israel, having used its United Nations Security Council veto power 42 times with respect to resolutions relating to Israel, out of a total 83 times in which its veto has ever been used. Between 1991 and 2011, 15 vetos were used to protect Israel out of 24 in total."
I answered your questions. Now, please answer mine.
1. When did the Jews start to create "Hebrew Army"?
2. Did you hear about "Waqf land"? Can you please elaborate what do you know about it?
Maybe if I review your history again I will come to understand that Shamir, Begin, Ben-Gurion and the rest of these leaders were simple peaceful men who avoided violence at every turn in favor of fostering peaceful co-existance with their Arab neighbors back in the 1930's. Maybe the Arabs should have ignored the alliance with the British who ruled over their lives from England.
Then why should the Arabs feel threatened by an influx of immigrants contrary to what many viewed as an agreed upon limit of those numbers by the British subject to Arab approval, let alone what seems to have been behind-the-scenes marshaling of soldiers and weapons to create a Hebrew Army. Why such an army when no doubt the idea was to simply live in peace as Palestinians, Jews and Arabs together?
Maybe I have the dates wrong, but it seems to me the documented history clearly suggests the Hebrew Army was viewed necessary by Zionist leaders in Palestine a good time before the Arabs even knew what was happening.
Why? Because these early Zionist leaders had every intent to carve out Israel and take that land by force, regardless of the Arabs, despite the Arabs, without acceptance by the Arabs, at the expense of the Arabs. That is why the Hebrew Army was needed rather than peaceful immigration of Jews to live with Arabs in Palestine.
Yes, but let's view the Zionists as the lambs and the Palestinians as the lions. How can we not?
You keep working on that version while we also look the other way with each year these different versions of history unfold, now under the wing of the United States after the British could take no more...
"In addition to financial and military aid, the United States also provides political support to Israel, having used its United Nations Security Council veto power 42 times with respect to resolutions relating to Israel, out of a total 83 times in which its veto has ever been used. Between 1991 and 2011, 15 vetos were used to protect Israel out of 24 in total."
I love how you pretend to be impartial to this conflict and use your "critical thinking" skills.
How dare those filthy Jews move to Tel Aviv and steal all of that land from poor old Arab grandmamas. I bet they literally marched them out of their homes at gunpoint after raping their daughters and granddaughters.
Oh wait...
In 1906, a group of Jews, among them residents of Jaffa, followed the initiative of Akiva Aryeh Weiss and banded together to form the Ahuzat Bayit (lit. "homestead") society. The society's goal was to form a "Hebrew urban centre in a healthy environment, planned according to the rules of aesthetics and modern hygiene." The urban planning for the new city was influenced by the Garden city movement. The first 60 plots were purchased in Kerem Djebali near Jaffa by Jacobus Kann, a Dutch citizen, who registered them in his name to circumvent the Turkish prohibition on Jewish land acquisition. Meir Dizengoff, later Tel Aviv's first mayor, also joined the Ahuzat Bayit society. His vision for Tel Aviv involved peaceful co-existence with Arabs
At this point I'm pretty sure you're just some young 2nd class Palestinian refugee kid getting pooped on in Jordan. How much is Hamas paying you to spew this filth? 50c an hour?
I wonder why. He is so objective and made an amazing career in critical thinking and conflict solving, that one may think that he will gather all the facts before trying to talk about stuff, but hell, what do I know.
I am more objective than most who hold opinion on this subject, because I am not emotionally connected to family or language or culture, religion or ideology with either Jews, Israelis, Palestinians or Arabs.
Can you claim any remotely similar basis of objectivity? No need to answer, I already know you can't, and I know that is a significant problem when it comes to these matters of perspective.
Just a recommendation as well, stop wondering about critical thinking, because you seem to lack the knowledge necessary. The additional problem we are having here is not the facts but how to properly assess them.
Something Lincoln said always reminds me how it is that you see a lamb where I see a lion...
The shepherd drives the wolf from the sheep’s throat, for which the sheep thanks the shepherd as a liberator, while the wolf denounces him for the same act as the destroyer of liberty, especially as the sheep was a black one. Plainly the sheep and the wolf are not agreed upon a definition of the word liberty; and precisely the same difference prevails today among us human creatures, even in the North, and all professing to love liberty. Hence we behold the processes by which thousands are daily passing from under the yoke of bondage, hailed by some as the advance of liberty, and bewailed by others as the destruction of all liberty.
-- Abraham Lincoln, in a speech at a Sanitary Fair in Baltimore, MD, on April 18th, 1864
I am more objective than most who hold opinion on this subject, because I am not emotionally connected to family or language or culture, religion or ideology with either Jews, Israelis, Palestinians or Arabs.
Can you claim any remotely similar basis of objectivity? No need to answer, I already know you can't, and I know that is a significant problem when it comes to these matters of perspective.
Just a recommendation as well, stop wondering about critical thinking, because you seem to lack the knowledge necessary. The additional problem we are having here is not the facts but how to properly assess them.
Something Lincoln said always reminds me how it is that you see a lamb where I see a lion...
The shepherd drives the wolf from the sheep’s throat, for which the sheep thanks the shepherd as a liberator, while the wolf denounces him for the same act as the destroyer of liberty, especially as the sheep was a black one. Plainly the sheep and the wolf are not agreed upon a definition of the word liberty; and precisely the same difference prevails today among us human creatures, even in the North, and all professing to love liberty. Hence we behold the processes by which thousands are daily passing from under the yoke of bondage, hailed by some as the advance of liberty, and bewailed by others as the destruction of all liberty.
-- Abraham Lincoln, in a speech at a Sanitary Fair in Baltimore, MD, on April 18th, 1864
I never claimed objectivity. I'm a secular right wing Zionist.
But it does not mean that I don't know the facts and the history. I think I know it much better than you, and my position is established on historic facts.
I am more objective than most who hold opinion on this subject, because I am not emotionally connected to family or language or culture, religion or ideology with either Jews, Israelis, Palestinians or Arabs.
Can you claim any remotely similar basis of objectivity? No need to answer, I already know you can't, and I know that is a significant problem when it comes to these matters of perspective.
Just a recommendation as well, stop wondering about critical thinking, because you seem to lack the knowledge necessary. The additional problem we are having here is not the facts but how to properly assess them.
Something Lincoln said always reminds me how it is that you see a lamb where I see a lion...
The shepherd drives the wolf from the sheep’s throat, for which the sheep thanks the shepherd as a liberator, while the wolf denounces him for the same act as the destroyer of liberty, especially as the sheep was a black one. Plainly the sheep and the wolf are not agreed upon a definition of the word liberty; and precisely the same difference prevails today among us human creatures, even in the North, and all professing to love liberty. Hence we behold the processes by which thousands are daily passing from under the yoke of bondage, hailed by some as the advance of liberty, and bewailed by others as the destruction of all liberty.
-- Abraham Lincoln, in a speech at a Sanitary Fair in Baltimore, MD, on April 18th, 1864
Yeah those poor lambs invading Israel in 1948
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