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Those that feel 'entitled to free college' usually just
01: Get scholarships
02: Have their parents pay for it
or
03: Get financial aid & grants
I wasn't even aware that anyone still had to pay for college at this point.
Are you kidding or are you seriously that naive? You do know the USA has $1.3 trillion in outstanding student loans, right? Do you honestly think the country would have this debt crisis if Americans in general could go to college free of charge? And in what fantasy world do you live in where scholarships and grants are so freely available? Even the smartest, most capable US students rarely ever get scholarships or grants to cover all of college, as costs keep rising the loan obligation goes up with it.
Those that feel 'entitled to free college' usually just
01: Get scholarships
02: Have their parents pay for it
or
03: Get financial aid & grants
I wasn't even aware that anyone still had to pay for college at this point.
LOL.
Thanks for the laugh.
If only it was anything like that. I got a few scholarships, but they covered maybe 5% of my tuition expenses altogether. I wasn't eligible for any financial aid because of my parents' income, who refused to help with college at all, and I was supporting myself entirely from the age of 17.
Paying for college without loans (I wanted to avoid debt at all costs) while still making rent and bills meant working 3 jobs while going to school full-time for 4 years straight. I'm pretty sure I was NoDoz's greatest customer ever, because I considered myself lucky if I got 4 hours of sleep on a night.
I'll never forget the day after my last exam...I slept for literally 20 hours straight.
The funny thing is, were this scheme to ultimately be pushed to attainment, given how long it takes to pass and implement complex social legislation, every brain dead eighteen-year-old that was advocating for it will have graduated just in time to pay for everybody else's free lunch for the rest of his/her life.
Most people are thinking about their children and the dying middle class. If a college degree becomes the most basic education level needed to be competitive in the job market - but only the rich can afford it - then the rich will simply get richer while the poor continue to stay poor.
Most people are thinking about their children and the dying middle class. If a college degree becomes the most basic education level needed to be competitive in the job market - but only the rich can afford it - then the rich will simply get richer while the poor continue to stay poor.
The problem is that Americans do not save. We have a history of p*ss poor saving habits.
That's why we have this student loan "crisis"..parents didn't save.
That's why we have this retirement "crisis"..people didn't save.
We have a consumer mentality and access to easy debt for that instant gratification of buying "stuff".
And since consumerism now drives our economy you are hit from all sides (media, government, etc) to buy, buy buy and if you don't have the money to buy then borrow it to buy.
SAVE is a 4 letter word as well but you rarely hear that.
Except that student loans are available to everyone that needs them, and many that don't. If a degree is such a vital stepping stone to success, why can't you pay back your student loan?
Meanwhile, higher education itself becomes less relevant to the skill set needed to be financially successful. As it is, we are turning out overeducated dolts, steeped in nonsense that only makes them less desirable to employers. I don't need an unshaven, unwashed, sandal-wearing neo-Marxist post-structural feminist accountant, thank you very much. I'm asking for a law suit just making eye contact with such a person.
Well, nowadays it's nearly impossible to be financially successful without a degree (unless you have the mechanical aptitude to get into the trades).
But a degree does not guarantee success.
To use an all-murrican metaphor - you can't hit the bullseye if you don't pick up the bow and arrow and aim at the bullseye. But attempting it doesn't mean you'll hit the bullseye.
P.S. * You're
(For the title ... sorry, OCD...)
Last edited by ohhwanderlust; 03-09-2016 at 06:54 PM..
Third-party payments lead to many unintended negative consequences. Recently, the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons asserted that the third-party payment system is key to the increasing cost of health care. The same can be said about any industry that the consumer is not directly paying for the good consumed, including higher education.
The problem arises from the “Moral Hazard” associated with not paying for services. Because students are not sensitive to the costs associated with an additional year of higher education they will consume more of it. Progressive politicians may consider more higher education consumed a good thing, but I’m not talking about more students — which has other problems associated that I discuss below — but the same students taking longer to finish.
The United States has seen the rise of the five year degree. Of the 60% of students who graduate from public schools in the U.S., over half take longer than four years to graduate. Compare that with private institutions (there are natural differences in students at each type of school that pay a role) which see 80 percent of its graduates out in four years. Their sensitivity to the marginal cost of that fifth or sixth year factors into their decision to consume.
Today, Germany’s 392 Hochschulen (colleges and universities) are still overcrowded and underfunded. Only one German university (Ludwig-Maximilians-Universität in Munich) was ranked in the top 50 of the Times Higher Education World Universities 2012-2013 survey (in 48th place). (The top 25 are mostly US and UK universities.)
Quote:
The modern university debate has been going on since the Federal Republic of Germany came into being in 1949, but it has reached a new intensity in recent years. While an average of only 14 percent of German high school students earned the academic diploma (Abitur) that leads to college study in 1966, by the late 1990s, that figure had soared as high as 41 percent in the city-state of Hamburg.
Change Comes Slowly
Many entrenched German traditions — free college tuition and automatic acceptance to a university with just an Abitur — have been changing, albeit very slowly. Reluctantly forced into rethinking a system that is crumbling under its own weight, German universities and technical colleges, also faced with a growing budget crunch, are looking at new ways of selecting students and paying for higher education in the land that invented the modern research university. Its father, Wilhelm von Humboldt of Berlin (site of today’s Wilhelm-von-Humboldt-Universität) must be turning over in his grave.
The Berlin university named for Humboldt ranked 139 in the 2008 (London) Times Higher Education ranking of 200 world universities. By 2010, Humboldt had fallen to 178, while Göttingen was the highest ranked (43rd) German university and Berlin’s Freie Universität dropped out of the top 200. But in 2012-2013 the rankings changed once more. – See the full 2012-2013 list in Part 2.
Source: Times Higher Education – Top 200 World Universities
These debates always contain "Well nation A does this why can't we" ignoring all the differences between nation A and us. Also ignoring the problems nation A has.
Well, nowadays it's nearly impossible to be financially successful without a degree (unless you have the mechanical aptitude to get into the trades).
But a degree does not guarantee success.
To use an all-murrican metaphor - you can't hit the bullseye if you don't pick up the bow and arrow and aim at the bullseye. But attempting it doesn't mean you'll hit the bullseye.
P.S. * You're
(For the title ... sorry, OCD...)
That's right. So instead of individuals owing for degrees that got them nothing it's taxpayers owing for degrees that got them nothing.
I, for one, do not want to foot the bill for someone in college majoring in Star Trek.
My alumni so I will not be accused of cherry picking, from College Calc:
Quote:
Undergraduate Tuition
University of Houston tuition is $7,651 per year for in-state residents. This is 19% more expensive than the national average public four year tuition of $6,429. The cost is $6,915 and 47% cheaper than the average Texas tuition of $14,566 for 4 year colleges. Tuition ranks 38th in Texas amongst 4 year colleges for affordability and is the 71st most expensive 4 year college in the state. If attending from out-of-state, the tuition is $18,739 which represents a 145% premium.
The school charges an additional fees of $954 in addition to tuition bringing the total effective in-state tuition to $8,605.
Housing Costs
On campus room and board is provided by the school at a cost of $9,278 per academic year. Students electing to live off campus elsewhere in Houston should budget at least this amount.
Books and Supplies
The estimated annual cost for books and supplies is $1,200.
Expenditure Price
Texas Resident Total Cost $19,083
In-State Tuition $7,651
Other Fees $954
Room and Board $9,278
Books and Supplies $1,200
About ten grand a year, despite tuition being 19% higher than the average tuition nationally.
That is 40K for a degree. Now how much is the average degree worth over a lifetime?:
The average student comes out with 23K in debt, less than 3% of the expected lifetime earnings gain he will receive from his college degree. This is a problem?
Meanwhie, what is that "free" college degree in Germany worth? From:
The Value of a College Degree, Around the Globe
Quote:
There are exceptions to the overall utility of a college degree when it comes to joblessness — for instance, when an economy is booming or when high school prepares people better for jobs. In these cases — like in Germany or in Japan — university graduates barely get an edge.
Sounds like American college students are getting the better deal.
That's right. So instead of individuals owing for degrees that got them nothing it's taxpayers owing for degrees that got them nothing.
I, for one, do not want to foot the bill for someone in college majoring in Star Trek.
Neither do I.
The thing with countries that provide affordable or free (to the students) university is that they generally don't offer nonsense majors like basket weaving or Star Trek. lol.
I think it'd be a good idea for the US to take a similar approach. If someone wants to major in The Unfair Extraction of Gypsy Tears Studies, they could go take a seminar or some private classes on that. Leave the actual accredited university studies be reserved for fields that are actually useful.
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- you can't hit the bullseye if you don't pick up the bow and arrow and aim at the bullseye. But attempting it doesn't mean you'll hit the bullseye.
