Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Look, he was ticketed for violating the borough ordinance (and, repeatedly, according to the article). The same thing would've happened if he'd put up Feel the Bern signs.
Well first of all, I'm not convinced that he would have been ticketed for flying a "feel the bern" flag....
Second, who decides what constitutes a "political yard sign"....? We all know that Liberals hate America, so maybe some day they decide that symbols of America are themselves an endorsement of a certain political ideology of hate and oppression and you can't fly them?
Maybe a gay pride flag could be looked at in a conservative town as an endorsement of the Democratic party or candidate?
Them bastards set my pick up truck on fire because I had a Trump sticker on the bumper!
Police said there ain't nothing can be done but said in the future I shouldn't advertise for Trump else I be looking for trouble.
I wouldn't blame you if you took their advice, but at the same time, you let the arsonists win if you do. The whole point is to silence people who don't think the way they do. If you don't express your support for Trump ( a man whom I cannot stand btw, so you know I'm being objective ) then they accomplish their goal. You'll have effectively been silenced.
If it IS against the ordinance, then he is in the wrong.
He is? Since when does a town's ordinance trump the Constitution of the United States? You're missing the point. The ordinance itself is unconstitutional.
A government can only limit free speech, or any other Constitutional right, if it has a compelling interest to do so. For example, if someone had a huge billboard in their yard that blocked the view of someone on an intersecting street from observing oncoming traffic, it would be reasonable to force the person to remove the sign and would satisfy the compelling interest requirement.
However, keeping a town "uncluttered", or whatever reason for the ordinance, doesn't seem like it should fit that bill.
Quote:
IF he can show where others have flown "political" flags and have NOT been fined he can fight it under, "Past precedent".
So again I ask, is it ok to ban free speech so long as you ban all speech? Is that the argument you're making?
Last edited by WhipperSnapper 88; 04-08-2016 at 06:46 PM..
you should be. reasonable rules and ordinances are what keeps a standard in your neighborhood.
How is a town's ordinance banning political speech protected by the First Amendment "reasonable"...? What is the government's compelling interest in keeping him from flying his flags? Who or what are they hurting?
Quote:
you want to live next to that clown in the article?
Why not? I bet if he were flying Hillary flags or Gay Pride flags, he wouldn't be as offensive to your senses, and I don't even support Trump so you know I'm being objective.
Quote:
if he does stuff like this, he does other stuff to annoy neighbors.
Like what? Exercise his Constitutional right to freedom of speech, expression, and association?
Look, he was ticketed for violating the borough ordinance (and, repeatedly, according to the article). The same thing would've happened if he'd put up Feel the Bern signs.
Which it shouldn't. Town ordinances don't supersede natural rights. The governments job is to protect rights, not violate them. This neighbor wouldn't have done a thing of the flag was his political ally, but it wasn't so he used the force of government to squelch free speech.
Pathetic. And I thought leftists were supposed to support these types of things...
No one is changing the meaning of anything. You quoted it yourself:
The borough attorney told police a flag is indeed considered a lawn sign under the ordinance and under previous court rulings, according to the police report Hornick provided to NJ Advance Media.
You understand how legal precedent works, right? This is going to get laughed out of court.
"You understand how legal precedent works, right? This is going to get laughed out of court."
Have you READ the actual LAW?
Does it explicitly state "flags on flagpoles"?
Or does it say "lawn signs"?
I don't know. I don't think you know.
All you are doing is repeating what someone else thinks.
There was another story a while back about a man flying the American flag on is porch.
The "ordinance" in his community forbid it.
He went to court and the courts ruled IN HIS FAVOR.
"That is why it will go to court", and we will see what happens.
He is? Since when does a town's ordinance trump the Constitution of the United States? You're missing the point. The ordinance itself is unconstitutional.
A government can only limit free speech, or any other Constitutional right, if it has a compelling interest to do so. For example, if someone had a huge billboard in their yard that blocked the view of someone on an intersecting street from observing oncoming traffic, it would be reasonable to force the person to remove the sign and would satisfy the compelling interest requirement.
However, keeping a town "uncluttered", or whatever reason for the ordinance, doesn't seem like it should fit that bill.
So again I ask, is it ok to ban free speech so long as you ban all speech? Is that the argument you're making?
"The ordinance itself is unconstitutional."
I BELIEVE it is also but, it is just OUR OPINIONS and is NOT YOUR decision to make.
Which is why i said it will be decided in a court of law, NOT on an Internet forum.
Yes, I know. Just like the HOA CC&Rs, I'm certain the city ordinance refers to signage in the yard, specifically, not signage in the windows of the home.
Here is the text of the ordinance:
G. Political signs; subject, however, to the following restrictions:
[Amended 7-14-1983 by Ord. No. 1110; 3-11-1986 by Ord. No. 1267]
[indent](1) Only one sign per candidate or public issue shall be allowed on each property.
[
Well, along with not waiting to put up his sign until it is allowed, he's also breaking the above rule. He has two flags on his lawn!
First CA banned the American flag in schools, now democrats are trying to put a guy in jail for flying his Trump flag... In his own yard. A Democrat complained that the guy had a Trump flag up, which he claims violates a town ordinance and the homeowner faces a 2000 fine and jail time if he doesnt take it down. What a great, "free" country. I hope the guy takes this to SCOTUS. Man ticketed for flying Donald Trump flags at his home | NJ.com
Alright, so I'm going to be a bit of an ass. But only becaue this is a Trump issue, as I don't think this would have been posted if it were a Cruz flag.
Conservatives always claim to support the rule of law. They do not show sympathy for those who break the law, EVEN IF the law is unjust. And I do agree, a law like this is unjust. It is a violation of the first amendment, at least to a point. Ordinance says no use of lawn signs with 30 days of an election. I don't know what California election is coming up within a month, but that's their law which still allows freedom of speech most of the time. It's selective, and I'm guessing that the law exists to prevent increases in property damage as an election grows close, sine our elections are run like it's a freaking sport.
To be clear, I do not agree with this law. But I also do not agree with law that put people in jail for 8 years because they have pot. Both laws are absurd. However, the rule of law argument seems to die out when the law happens to be something they (the conservatives) don't agree with. Why is that?
Some other details the article doesn't mention is if selective enforcement is also an issue here. Are there other political banners that are staying up and it's just Trump or GOP flags/signs that are being targeted? If so, that's completely unacceptable.
Point being, the man broke the law. Rather or not the law is stupid is sort of irrelevant, if the rule of law thing is something you value. If not, why is there any support for the war on drugs?
Also, why, OP, are you telling a dishonest narrative: he's not facing any prison or jail time, only a fine. Why lie to promote a view? Why do you have so much in common with Hillary Clinton?
First CA banned the American flag in schools, now democrats are trying to put a guy in jail for flying his Trump flag... In his own yard. A Democrat complained that the guy had a Trump flag up, which he claims violates a town ordinance and the homeowner faces a 2000 fine and jail time if he doesnt take it down. What a great, "free" country. I hope the guy takes this to SCOTUS. Man ticketed for flying Donald Trump flags at his home | NJ.com
Simple solution. Move. I wouldn't want to live in a town that squashes my freedom to express myself anyway.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
