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View Poll Results: Better for economy: hire 3 at $10/hr or 2 at $15/hr
3 at $10/hr 32 53.33%
2 at $15/hr 28 46.67%
Voters: 60. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-01-2016, 07:59 AM
 
14,944 posts, read 8,555,251 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251 View Post
Im a liberal with a business degree who currently works in management at the 3rd largest department store chain by volume of sale in the country.

I can tell you for a fact that both of you are wrong.

the customer is the last one to see any change, not the first. Anyone who has ever been a part of any business should know that. people in business get raises all the time and you cost didnt go up .

If you guys want, i can explain in full what happens before a customer would ever see a price increase.
I can tell you as a businessman and a consumer who has been around for several decades on this rock that ESPECIALLY when it comes to retail department stores, prices change on a daily and weekly basis. It matters not whether lower level labor costs increase or remain static, those damned prices change ... sometimes up, sometimes down.

I can also guarantee you that P&L margins will be maintained through various methods which include price increases and cost reductions .... and DO NOT GO DOWN.

As previously mentioned, department stores are notorious for price increases which ocurr constantly, and often disguised as Big Sales events. All you have to do is pay attention to notice. Like those big Memorial Day, or Labor Day sales, watch in the weeks leading up to the big sale how many items will have their ticketed price go up ,30%, only to be marked down 25% for the big sale, resulting in an increase of 5%.

Khols is a master of such illusion. One item I buy from them regularly are dress slacks for work. The marked retail MSRP is $65, and had been the same for the past several years. They are ALWAYS on "sale". I generally get them for $37.95 ( 2=$75.90). But sometimes they have a BIG SALE, and Mark them " buy 1 and get the 2nd one 1/2 off). The trick is, the 1st one will be the listed $65, and the 2nd one at 1/2 off will be $32.50. At that great sale price, you pay $97.50 for 2_ instead of $75.90. That great sale will cost you a whopping $21.60 MORE than the previous day before the "sale".

Of course, if you are either not paying attention, or choose to be deceptive in promoting your narrative, you could claim that those slacks have been $65 a pair for the last 6 years, and have not seen an increase in price even though labor has gone up. Though that is a BS argument that holds no water, and if you got your money"s worth from your marketing degree, then you understand that already.
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Old 05-01-2016, 08:24 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,522,222 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
Three at $15/hr and the executives make $4,999,985 per year instead of $5,000,000.
How did you calculate this?
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Old 05-03-2016, 08:28 AM
 
14,944 posts, read 8,555,251 times
Reputation: 7360
Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda_d View Post
It's called slavery. Isn't that, in fact, what conservatives are essentially proposing by their constant calls to eliminate all welfare and social programs?
Welfare and social programs rely on funding that essentially comes from money earned by those working in order to take care of those who are not. That is all well and good, so long as this "charity" is offered freely and voluntary, and goes to those who are UNABLE to take care of themselves. A compassionate society does take care of those who are unable to take care of themselves. It's a moral obligation.

The problem we have today is that we have forced charity which isn't charity at all, but is in fact THEFT, and too often goes to those who are simply UNWILLING to put forth the hard work and effort to take care of themselves. In this instance, everyone loses ... and it creates two classes of individuals, one who sees the fruits of their own hard work stolen from them in order to hand it to another who'd rather sit on their azzes and do nothing, or behaves irresponsibly (substance abusers) whose OWN actions and behavior renders them incapable of working to earn a living. And the easier we make it for this type to get a free ride, the greater the numbers we will have of them.

Just ask yourself a simple question ... If there were two cab companies in town, one who offers free cab rides to anyone, and the other company that charges $20, which one would YOU call?

Ask yourself another question ... what do you call a person who refuses to work and earn a living, and chooses instead to wait until you cash your paycheck on Friday ... sticks a pistol in your face and commands you to hand over that cash? He's a criminal, whose crime is called robbery. Now what is the difference between him, and another who chooses to sit at home and allow someone else (Uncle Sam) to snatch a portion of your paycheck, who then passes it to him? Is this not also robbery?

Now, what do you call a person who is forced to work for NO PAY? Is that not the definition of a slave? Well, guess what, depending on your "tax bracket" this is PRECISELY what you are, for 2 or 3 months of each and every year you work. For the average person who will work for 40 years, that ultimately means that for about TEN YEARS, you will have worked for absolutely NO PAY, so that another can do absolutely nothing, except enjoy spending your money without lifting a finger.

Following this formula has only one ultimate outcome ... a society comprised of slaves, freeloaders, and thiefs.

Welcome to Socialism ... a system of false promises, resulting in misery for most.
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Old 05-04-2016, 10:41 AM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,376,733 times
Reputation: 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMESMH View Post
And what economic theory does your post above illustrate and what component of that theory are you illustrating that would 'make the economy better' under that theory?

I'm all ears.
The problem with being self educated in economics is this, it is the result of a thought experiment I ran myself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RMESMH View Post

When I read the 'What? ' post by LE, I immediately knew (economic theory wise) why he started his post with 'What? '.
If I can get what I need done using 2 people with $15hr or 3 at $10hr I'm not wasting the opportunity of the third person to find something else useful to do if I use two instead of three people to do the job. You have higher demand with 2 at $15 than you do with 3 at $10. In our current economy we are demand limited. Paying less workers more money pushes demand higher, as well as reducing supply. More than 3 decades of supply side economics has left us with more supply than demand. That is why our economy sucks.


I ran into the same problem with chess, I was shown an opening, I played 6,000 games as variations of that opening, They said you are using a program because I didn't know the name of the variations I was using. With having played 6,000 games and being able to remember what worked and what didn't I'd brut forced the problem.
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Old 05-04-2016, 10:48 AM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,376,733 times
Reputation: 768
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
Liberals

Are we OK with "grade school fractions"? Can y'all handle that?

The choice between 2 or 3 ..... If you choose 2 @$15, you're relegating 33.3% of the general blue coller workforce to indefinite unemployment.
If I'm the only idiot that has something that needs doing then it isn't 1/3rd of the work force out of work it is 99.9999% of the workforce out of work. Someone else will put that other person to work. Not my problem.
Quote:
Originally Posted by GuyNTexas View Post
Of course, we cannot let those 33.3% unemployed starve to death, or be homeless, so we'll need to increase the taxes on those 66.6% of the $15/hr lucky ones who have to do 100% of the work to house and feed the 33.3% that sit at home doing nothing. The two $15 workers now must do the work of three, while the increase in taxes reduce their effective incomes, so they are working harder for less than the supposed $15.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ContrarianEcon View Post
Nice one. Two outcomes for the other one not hired.


One, doesn't get a job and is homeless.


Two, does get a job somewhere else. If at $10hr then you have $40 in hourly income over three people instead of $30 over three people. You are correct some people should not be allowed to speak or vote.
That says it better than I can now.
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Old 05-04-2016, 11:25 AM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,376,733 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Three Wolves In Snow View Post
Two people get a job for $15/hour.
One person doesn't get jack, because liberals don't care about him.

Two people can pay to have food, shelter, clothing, transportation...
One person lives in a cardboard box, starves, has worn, torn clothing, travels on foot because liberals don't care about him.

The price of food, clothing, etc goes up because the employers, just like their own employer, had to start charging more to be able to keep on two people with no skills at $15/hour. The employer struggles to keep the two working full time, but it's getting more and more difficult every day, as no one wants to pay $30 for a large pizza with one topping.

Anyway,

The two who have their little wage "victory" vote Dem.
One person who doesn't have a job, and according to libs, can't get an ID, can't even get to the voting booth, doesn't have an address for an absentee ballot...what he wants doesn't count, because liberals don't care about him.

It is ruled that everyone will pay more in to the welfare system, everyone will have healthcare, they will get food, they will get help with housing, because, liberals say, they "care" about everyone.

So now the two people with their $15/hour job have to pay more out of their paychecks. Before rent, food, and other such items, they have to pay for the one person's healthcare, the one person's food stamps, the one person's housing assistance, and some of the liberals even want to pay for this person's college degree.

The two people take what they have left over to pay for their rent, and....wow, can't buy the food that normally was eaten because there's not as much money left. And still have to pay electric, hope that gas prices don't go up, put off car maintenance longer than recommended, sure hope they don't have to go to the dentist or doctor....wow...no more eating out, no more going to the movies, no more buying fun food at the store, going to have make these clothes last longer, spend less on laundry soap - will have to wear clothes twice before washing, have to wash hair less - can't afford that shampoo and conditioner anymore...something should be done about this! Minimum wage needs to be raised! It doesn't allow one to live! How can someone live like royalty on this amount? Raise the minimum wage! Raise the minimum wage!

So, the vote passes, the minimum wage is raised.

Now there's one person working for $30/hr and 2 people without a job.

This has been happening. This has been happening in real life. You all aren't paying attention. This has BEEN happening for YEARS, and yet you keep asking for more and more and more money because you know it buys votes, votes, votes to pretend that you will help the poor. You're not helping the poor. You're completely and totally SCREWING the poor.
I answered the question in the thread title not in the original post. What is better for the economy, me employing two people at $15hr or 3 people at $10hr? We are in a demand limited economy so 2 at $15hr wins hands down as what is better for the economy. It reduces supply and increases demand.


As far as upping the minimum wage, we are currently in a demand limited economy and so upping the minimum wage is what is needed. Also we need to remove from the effective US economy a lot of production capacity. I'm talking about that part of the global economy that does business with the US. Os insisting that the US minimum wage gets paid to all workers being used by the US economy is also good for balancing supply and demand.
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Old 05-04-2016, 11:26 AM
 
3,792 posts, read 2,376,733 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by florida.bob View Post
Idiotic arguments against 15 min wage notwithstanding, perhaps all companies should pay their employees nothing. Let's see how that works.
Then you have no economy as there is no cash flow.
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Old 05-11-2016, 03:12 AM
 
169 posts, read 110,955 times
Reputation: 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by Retroit View Post
If minimum wage is increased, businesses pass on the extra cost to the consumers, which hurts the poor the most. Ultimately, all you are doing is increasing the cost of living.

Not only that the money supply is being forced to be expanded.
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