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Old 07-05-2016, 06:24 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,557 posts, read 44,271,977 times
Reputation: 13504

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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Guess what? Licensing doctors prevents some people from being able to get medical care, too. There are some pretty remote areas in TX, and some people have to travel pretty far to reach a state-licensed doctor. Should SCOTUS strike down licensing MDs, too?

That's how absurdly ridiculous that line of reasoning is.

What ever happened to critical thinking skills? /SMH
Well, well, well... Perhaps SCOTUS should strike down state licensing of doctors, too. The doctor shortage in TX is FAR more critical than
requiring equal medical and facilities standards of surgical abortion centers:
Quote:
"The number of Texas primary care physicians — whose services prevent patients from developing more costly and harmful conditions — is particularly low. Texas does not have enough primary care doctors in 126 of its 254 counties, according to the United States Department of Health and Human Services, which sets a threshold of one for every 3,000 residents."
Despite Additional Dollars, Texas Doc Shortage Is Hard to Fix | Kaiser Health News

No problem, SCOTUS, right? Just eliminate the state licensing of MDs. Let anyone practice medicine. If lower standards don't matter for abortion, why should lower standards be a problem in any other medical capacity?
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Old 07-05-2016, 07:39 AM
 
Location: Long Island
56,851 posts, read 25,787,282 times
Reputation: 15428
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
Even the state attorney had to agree that it prevented some women from being able to get abortions. It did indeed block access, mostly for poor women who could not afford to travel long distances to clinics that were still open.

Your argument is akin to suggesting that someone who wants to move should hire a semi trailer when all his possessions would fit in a U Haul truck. Some of the regulations for surgery centers are excessive and unnecessary when applied to abortion clinics. That is proved by the fact that serious complications were extremely rare under previous regulations.

Texas lost the case because it could not show that requiring abortion clinics to be surgery centers would benefit a single woman, and it could not show that making doctors have admitting privileges would improve treatment of complications, since there had been no complications needing admission and abortion related deaths were rare.

The only standards needed for abortion centers are those crafted specifically for abortion centers. That and enforcement of those standards will provide all the protection women seeking abortion need.


Yes this law didn't actually improve health care for women, it had quite the opposite effect since it closed over half the clinics and limited access to women. Travel distances, time, expense and wait times had a negative effect. They couldn't find the problem they were addressing and could not prove it wasn't a burden.
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Old 07-05-2016, 07:47 AM
 
Location: Long Island
56,851 posts, read 25,787,282 times
Reputation: 15428
Anyone think that the Texas foster care system is ready to handle another 70,000? Instead of passing legislation for make believe problems they should be addressing the actual issues.


Quote:
The staffing shortage is especially acute in Dallas County, which now has only about one-fifth of its 161 CPS investigator slots filled.
Yeah, that’s how bad it has gotten.
“We’ve just been in a real crunch,” one veteran investigator told me confidentially.
The Dallas office, which is a part of the Region 3 North Texas hub based in Arlington, is so shorthanded that it’s now bringing in workers from other corners of the state.
And Dallas, like other CPS branches in Texas, also doesn’t have enough foster-care homes in which to place neglected and abused kids.
“We’ve had kids sleeping in a CPS office for two weeks because we have no place for them to go,” the CPS worker told me.

Texas’ broken foster care system is on display in shorthanded Dallas office | | Dallas Morning News
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Old 07-05-2016, 07:49 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,557 posts, read 44,271,977 times
Reputation: 13504
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodnight View Post
Yes this law didn't actually improve health care for women, it had quite the opposite effect since it closed over half the clinics and limited access to women. Travel distances, time, expense and wait times had a negative effect.
So does TX licensing MDs. Is that next? SCOTUS will strike the licensing of MDs because that impedes access to health care? Let anyone practice medicine? No minimum standards required?

Somehow, I doubt it. Only WOMEN deserve and are subject to lower medical standards, according to SCOTUS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Well, well, well... Perhaps SCOTUS should strike down state licensing of doctors, too. The doctor shortage in TX is FAR more critical than
requiring equal medical and facilities standards of surgical abortion centers:
Quote:
"The number of Texas primary care physicians — whose services prevent patients from developing more costly and harmful conditions — is particularly low. Texas does not have enough primary care doctors in 126 of its 254 counties, according to the United States Department of Health and Human Services, which sets a threshold of one for every 3,000 residents."
Despite Additional Dollars, Texas Doc Shortage Is Hard to Fix | Kaiser Health News

No problem, SCOTUS, right? Just eliminate the state licensing of MDs. Let anyone practice medicine. If lower standards don't matter for abortion, why should lower standards be a problem in any other medical capacity?
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Old 07-05-2016, 09:23 AM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
36,970 posts, read 40,917,684 times
Reputation: 44897
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Guess what? Licensing doctors prevents some people from being able to get medical care, too. There are some pretty remote areas in TX, and some people have to travel pretty far to reach a state-licensed doctor. Should SCOTUS strike down licensing MDs, too?

That's how absurdly ridiculous that line of reasoning is.

What ever happened to critical thinking skills? /SMH
Study: women had to drive 4 times farther after Texas laws closed abortion clinics - Vox

What is painfully obvious is that you continue to harp on a line of reasoning that no one else here is buying. Your point of view is that abortion centers are substandard if they do not follow rules for surgery centers. SCOTUS ruled as it did because Texas could not show that harsher standards were needed to safeguard women having abortions. Abortion centers were already licensed and already had standards they needed to meet. There is no evidence that the centers that closed because they could not comply with the new law were ever substandard.

Please note that not all doctors are required to have hospital privileges. Many just have outpatient practices. Should texas make every doctor apply for hospital privileges?

Texas, by the way, is looking toward telemedicine to link patients in remote areas with doctors. That will work for many encounters but does not help a woman who wants an abortion. The law that was struck down placed abortion totally out of reach for some women.

Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Any woman who is forced to use substandard facilities has had their 14th Amendment right violated.

Why are you advocating the unequal treatment of women? Why are you advocating that women be stripped of their 14th Amendment right to equal protection? Is it your opinion that women deserve lesser quality medical care and facilities than men?
The "lesser quality" mantra you keep repeating is a figment of your own imagination. No one else believes it, so you might want to consider whose "critical thinking skills" are deficient.
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Old 07-05-2016, 10:45 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,557 posts, read 44,271,977 times
Reputation: 13504
What about the more than half of all TX counties that have an inadequate number primary care physicians? That FACT negatively impacts a LOT more people than a few abortion clinics that closed because they wouldn't meet ambulatory surgery center standards.

So... why didn't SCOTUS abolish state licensing of MDs? THAT would have made MUCH more of an impact on improving health care access.

So... why not? You guessed it... only WOMEN deserve lower standards than everyone else. /puke
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Old 07-05-2016, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Georgia, USA
36,970 posts, read 40,917,684 times
Reputation: 44897
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
What about the more than half of all TX counties that have an inadequate number primary care physicians? That FACT negatively impacts a LOT more people than a few abortion clinics that closed because they wouldn't meet ambulatory surgery center standards.

So... why didn't SCOTUS abolish state licensing of MDs? THAT would have made MUCH more of an impact on improving health care access.

So... why not? You guessed it... only WOMEN deserve lower standards than everyone else. /puke
Perhaps you fail to understand that the topic of discussion is access to abortion, not access to primary care doctors. Your attempt to misdirect is a failure.

Your idea of abolishing licensing for doctors is bizarre. Abortion centers are still licensed. They must meet standards appropriate for abortion centers, which is all that is needed.
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Old 07-05-2016, 12:24 PM
 
Location: Home, Home on the Front Range
25,826 posts, read 20,595,336 times
Reputation: 14813
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
What about the more than half of all TX counties that have an inadequate number primary care physicians? That FACT negatively impacts a LOT more people than a few abortion clinics that closed because they wouldn't meet ambulatory surgery center standards.

So... why didn't SCOTUS abolish state licensing of MDs? THAT would have made MUCH more of an impact on improving health care access.

So... why not? You guessed it... only WOMEN deserve lower standards than everyone else. /puke

If Texas really cared about the health care needs of its residents, it wouldn't consistently rank at the bottom for access to ALL healthcare.
The fact that this is the case, puts lie to the purported concern for the quality of these clinics.

People seem to be under the impression that the clinics that closed did nothing but abortions.
This is not the case.
They provided cancer pre-screening and other services that many women were deprived of as a result of this short-sided and vengeful decision, now corrected.
Rightly or wrongly, many women only ever seek care at women's health centers.
As has been pointed out, it was the loss of these services that had the most deleterious impact and Texas could not prove otherwise.
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Old 07-05-2016, 02:02 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,557 posts, read 44,271,977 times
Reputation: 13504
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzy_q2010 View Post
Perhaps you fail to understand that the topic of discussion is access to abortion, not access to primary care doctors.
Why is access to abortion more important than access to an MD or surgeon at all?

Quote:
Your idea of abolishing licensing for doctors is bizarre. Abortion centers are still licensed.
They have much lower medical and facilities standards, and you know it. SCOTUS should do the same with MDs/surgeons. Strike down high state licensing standards and only allow much lower state MD and surgeon licensing standards to ensure access to MDs and surgeons.

That should make complete sense to you because that's EXACTLY what SCOTUS just did, but to women only.
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Old 07-05-2016, 02:05 PM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
88,557 posts, read 44,271,977 times
Reputation: 13504
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerLily24 View Post
If Texas really cared about the health care needs of its residents, it wouldn't consistently rank at the bottom for access to ALL healthcare.
The fact that this is the case, puts lie to the purported concern for the quality of these clinics.
No, it doesn't. TX didn't lower MD/surgeon licensing standards to ensure more access to doctors/surgeons. Why should they lower abortion facilities standards to ensure more access to abortion clinics?

This is nothing more than a SCOTUS attack on women only.
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