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Old 07-11-2016, 02:47 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
13,562 posts, read 10,318,711 times
Reputation: 8252

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Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007 View Post
Sorry to harp on you but you do realize that veterans can get mental health services at the VA for free right? My FIL is a Vietnam vet with PTSD and he gets his mental health care via the VA. My dad is also a Vietnam era vet (did not go to war, came into the military when the war was ending) and he gets all of his medical care through the VA.

I agree we do not provide enough support for our veterans but also please note that black Americans are overrepresented in the military and in the veteran population so if you are willing to give Affirmative Action only to veterans, more black people will probably get that assistance versus Asians or other minority groups.

Also FWIW, veteran owned businesses also get a preference for some federal agencies in contracting opportunities.
For Federal employment, veterans also get some preferences or points as part of the hiring process.

 
Old 07-11-2016, 03:31 PM
 
29,474 posts, read 22,487,125 times
Reputation: 48169
That's news to me.

No one I know or any of their family members or relatives have moved back to the country of their ancestors.
 
Old 07-11-2016, 04:50 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA USA
337 posts, read 732,016 times
Reputation: 235
The guy who cuts my hair is Vietnamese from Vietnam. His brother moved back to Vietnam after over fifteen years of living in the San Francisco Bay Area (Sunnyvale). I asked my haircutter why his brother moved back. He replied "because it's boring and expensive here." He explained to me that in Asia, everything is urban, exciting and 24/7. He also went on about how expensive California is (he didn't need to explain that one to me). His brother also bought a hotel somewhere in Vietnam, something he could never dream of here.

I also have many Chinese-American high school classmates (all Cantonese) who have moved back to Hong Kong. I suspect they moved back for similar reasons.
 
Old 07-11-2016, 04:52 PM
 
20,524 posts, read 15,867,636 times
Reputation: 5943
Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007 View Post
Sorry to harp on you but you do realize that veterans can get mental health services at the VA for free right? My FIL is a Vietnam vet with PTSD and he gets his mental health care via the VA. My dad is also a Vietnam era vet (did not go to war, came into the military when the war was ending) and he gets all of his medical care through the VA.

I agree we do not provide enough support for our veterans but also please note that black Americans are overrepresented in the military and in the veteran population so if you are willing to give Affirmative Action only to veterans, more black people will probably get that assistance versus Asians or other minority groups.

Also FWIW, veteran owned businesses also get a preference for some federal agencies in contracting opportunities.
I'm def Ok with helping especially US combat veterans of ANY "race".
 
Old 07-11-2016, 07:25 PM
 
Location: Silicon Valley, CA
13,562 posts, read 10,318,711 times
Reputation: 8252
Quote:
Originally Posted by athleticsfan72737489 View Post
The guy who cuts my hair is Vietnamese from Vietnam. His brother moved back to Vietnam after over fifteen years of living in the San Francisco Bay Area (Sunnyvale). I asked my haircutter why his brother moved back. He replied "because it's boring and expensive here." He explained to me that in Asia, everything is urban, exciting and 24/7. He also went on about how expensive California is (he didn't need to explain that one to me). His brother also bought a hotel somewhere in Vietnam, something he could never dream of here.

I also have many Chinese-American high school classmates (all Cantonese) who have moved back to Hong Kong. I suspect they moved back for similar reasons.
That's going to depend on what generation they are, and what country of origin or ancestry.

If they're a 2nd generation or have spent most of their formative years in the USA, they probably don't have much of a connection with "the old country".

If they're from China, Hong Kong, or Taiwan, things won't necessarily be less expensive there, especially real estate.
 
Old 07-12-2016, 10:45 PM
 
1,094 posts, read 497,374 times
Reputation: 858
Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007 View Post
Sorry to harp on you but you do realize that veterans can get mental health services at the VA for free right? My FIL is a Vietnam vet with PTSD and he gets his mental health care via the VA. My dad is also a Vietnam era vet (did not go to war, came into the military when the war was ending) and he gets all of his medical care through the VA.

I agree we do not provide enough support for our veterans but also please note that black Americans are overrepresented in the military and in the veteran population so if you are willing to give Affirmative Action only to veterans, more black people will probably get that assistance versus Asians or other minority groups.

Also FWIW, veteran owned businesses also get a preference for some federal agencies in contracting opportunities.

Good post here, thanks.
 
Old 07-13-2016, 08:18 AM
 
1,094 posts, read 497,374 times
Reputation: 858
Quote:
Originally Posted by athleticsfan72737489 View Post
The guy who cuts my hair is Vietnamese from Vietnam. His brother moved back to Vietnam after over fifteen years of living in the San Francisco Bay Area (Sunnyvale). I asked my haircutter why his brother moved back. He replied "because it's boring and expensive here." He explained to me that in Asia, everything is urban, exciting and 24/7. He also went on about how expensive California is (he didn't need to explain that one to me). His brother also bought a hotel somewhere in Vietnam, something he could never dream of here.

I also have many Chinese-American high school classmates (all Cantonese) who have moved back to Hong Kong. I suspect they moved back for similar reasons.
Thanks for sharing this, it absolutely sounds like a lot of what I've been hearing-- the main draw seeming to be a combo of galloping economic opportunity with cultural excitement, entrepreneurial spirit and lower cost of living especially compared to California. In fact on that note, for small businesses in particular the cost of getting started up has become almost prohibitive in some parts of the USA. The crazy health insurance costs seem to be the real killer for American start-ups and is something I hear a lot from the American expats ane emigres in Europe too. This is a major competitive advantage other countries have over American ones, since companies don't have to worry about providing healthcare the way American companies have been shouldered (even though taxes are around the same when we factor in all the US taxes). Pus the legal fees and insurance, and US business taxes are inf act among highest in world-- in some states (California is one) there are even special "franchise taxes" (both state and local) that hit you whether you turn a profit or not, which can be devastating. I'd imagine that entrepreneurs especially are probably finding more favorable conditions in Asia to set up their businesses. I certainly hear this a lot from Korean, Chinese and Taiwanese Americans, more and more among Indian, Filipino and Vietnamese Americans too.
 
Old 07-13-2016, 03:28 PM
 
Location: Oakland, CA USA
337 posts, read 732,016 times
Reputation: 235
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corascant View Post
Thanks for sharing this, it absolutely sounds like a lot of what I've been hearing-- the main draw seeming to be a combo of galloping economic opportunity with cultural excitement, entrepreneurial spirit and lower cost of living especially compared to California. In fact on that note, for small businesses in particular the cost of getting started up has become almost prohibitive in some parts of the USA. The crazy health insurance costs seem to be the real killer for American start-ups and is something I hear a lot from the American expats ane emigres in Europe too. This is a major competitive advantage other countries have over American ones, since companies don't have to worry about providing healthcare the way American companies have been shouldered (even though taxes are around the same when we factor in all the US taxes). Pus the legal fees and insurance, and US business taxes are inf act among highest in world-- in some states (California is one) there are even special "franchise taxes" (both state and local) that hit you whether you turn a profit or not, which can be devastating. I'd imagine that entrepreneurs especially are probably finding more favorable conditions in Asia to set up their businesses. I certainly hear this a lot from Korean, Chinese and Taiwanese Americans, more and more among Indian, Filipino and Vietnamese Americans too.
I think another question is: at what point do we reach the inflection point where the immigration levels from Asia to the U.S. decrease? However, there are so many people in Asia (I think it makes up 60% of the world's population) and the population there skews younger. I'm guessing we still might not reach that point for a while.

The reason I brought this up is because the level of Mexican immigration to the US has dropped precipitously. I have traveled throughout Central Mexico several times now and have heard many first-hand reports from Mexicans who have zero interest in moving north. I'd say most young people living in Guanajuato, Jalisco and other neighboring states have this sentiment. These states were responsible for much of the immigration to the U.S. The Mexican middle-class is growing. The quality of life is almost like what it is here. I'm thinking many nations in Asia might be somewhat similar.
 
Old 07-13-2016, 04:42 PM
 
1,094 posts, read 497,374 times
Reputation: 858
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverkris View Post
That's going to depend on what generation they are, and what country of origin or ancestry.

If they're a 2nd generation or have spent most of their formative years in the USA, they probably don't have much of a connection with "the old country".

If they're from China, Hong Kong, or Taiwan, things won't necessarily be less expensive there, especially real estate.
My experience is there's a mind boggling variation in the real estate costs in those places, and true that the major cities can be ridiculous (if not quite at Manhattan or SF-level bubbles), but overall the cost of living in China, Taiwan and Korea at least is well below US levels but still with first world amenities, and access to capital and labor for business. True that Shanghai housing prices were truly nuts (in that case not far off from SF-level insanity), but most of China in my past couple trips there has been vastly more affordable compared to US for the prevailing salaries in each region (let alone what a returning expat or 2nd-generationer might save up). Not as familiar with Taiwan but sensed that too for real estate outside of Taipei.

And everything else (non-housing) is vastly more affordable cost of living wise than US. Things like food, clothes, electronics but especially healthcare. Even healthy Americans are now being forced to pay thousands or even tens of thousands of dollars in premiums every year for crappy health insurance, and then thousands more in deductibles before they can use the insurance, and then then thousands more in co-pays on top, and then if they wind up outside of that crummy insurance network (or an ER doc is outside) they have to pay thousands more. So much so that the USA has millions of medical bankruptcies every year, and vast majority of those bankruptcies are for insured Americans!

As contrast I almost never encountered Asians in Asia-- let alone Europeans or even South Americans-- who ever went bankrupt for medical bills or got hit for so much for premiums or deductibles. That's because the USA has by far the most expensive health care in the world, BY FAR, and yet with mediocre overall results (highest infant mortality in the world). And I'll repeat, it is not because the USA is low-tax compared to Asia or Europe-- this myth always comes up as the response, "Asia and Europe have cheaper healthcare because they have higher taxes". No, they don't have higher taxes-- when you put together all the taxes Americans pay (state/local, plus property which is killer in the United States), and especially for business owners (franchise and self-employment or payroll taxes), American taxes are actually a bit (or significantly) higher than Asia and even Europe, yet we get much less. And then pay for healthcare out of pocket too (aren't healthcare premiums also a tax now, since they're required by law? And just to be clear so the thread doesn't get high-jacked-- this was a problem before Obamacare and after as well, it's a deep problem in US policy that goes beyond the two parties or recent politicians). And this is even before getting into college tuition costs!

Again i'll admit I don't know a whole lot about health care systems in Asia as opposed to Europe, but from general observation, it seems like most Asian countries tend towards some kind of universal coverage like Europe, and very unlike America. And for much less cost than American healthcare, which is bankrupting even for insured Americans and especially for small businesses (it's the single biggest grievance I encounter among small-business owners and entrepreneurs, both in USA and expats in Europe). So it seems like the killer healthcare costs in the USA alone would push the cost of living in the US way above the cost of living even in the most expensive Asian cities in China and Japan. Especially since American wages have been largely stuck, not coming anywhere near covering the costs of all those additional premiums or deductibles.
 
Old 07-13-2016, 09:07 PM
 
1,094 posts, read 497,374 times
Reputation: 858
Quote:
Originally Posted by Corascant View Post
My experience is there's a mind boggling variation in the real estate costs in those places, and true that the major cities can be ridiculous (if not quite at Manhattan or SF-level bubbles), but overall the cost of living in China, Taiwan and Korea at least is well below US levels but still with first world amenities, and access to capital and labor for business. True that Shanghai housing prices were truly nuts (in that case not far off from SF-level insanity), but most of China in my past couple trips there has been vastly more affordable compared to US for the prevailing salaries in each region (let alone what a returning expat or 2nd-generationer might save up). Not as familiar with Taiwan but sensed that too for real estate outside of Taipei.

And everything else (non-housing) is vastly more affordable cost of living wise than US. Things like food, clothes, electronics but especially healthcare. Even healthy Americans are now being forced to pay thousands or even tens of thousands of dollars in premiums every year for crappy health insurance, and then thousands more in deductibles before they can use the insurance, and then then thousands more in co-pays on top, and then if they wind up outside of that crummy insurance network (or an ER doc is outside) they have to pay thousands more. So much so that the USA has millions of medical bankruptcies every year, and vast majority of those bankruptcies are for insured Americans!

As contrast I almost never encountered Asians in Asia-- let alone Europeans or even South Americans-- who ever went bankrupt for medical bills or got hit for so much for premiums or deductibles. That's because the USA has by far the most expensive health care in the world, BY FAR, and yet with mediocre overall results (highest infant mortality in the world). And I'll repeat, it is not because the USA is low-tax compared to Asia or Europe-- this myth always comes up as the response, "Asia and Europe have cheaper healthcare because they have higher taxes". No, they don't have higher taxes-- when you put together all the taxes Americans pay (state/local, plus property which is killer in the United States), and especially for business owners (franchise and self-employment or payroll taxes), American taxes are actually a bit (or significantly) higher than Asia and even Europe, yet we get much less. And then pay for healthcare out of pocket too (aren't healthcare premiums also a tax now, since they're required by law? And just to be clear so the thread doesn't get high-jacked-- this was a problem before Obamacare and after as well, it's a deep problem in US policy that goes beyond the two parties or recent politicians). And this is even before getting into college tuition costs!

Again i'll admit I don't know a whole lot about health care systems in Asia as opposed to Europe, but from general observation, it seems like most Asian countries tend towards some kind of universal coverage like Europe, and very unlike America. And for much less cost than American healthcare, which is bankrupting even for insured Americans and especially for small businesses (it's the single biggest grievance I encounter among small-business owners and entrepreneurs, both in USA and expats in Europe). So it seems like the killer healthcare costs in the USA alone would push the cost of living in the US way above the cost of living even in the most expensive Asian cities in China and Japan. Especially since American wages have been largely stuck, not coming anywhere near covering the costs of all those additional premiums or deductibles.
Also to follow up on that first point esp, the cost of living (including real estate) in the Asian countries that have become attractive lately, a lot of the biggest increases in migration to Asia have actually been to Vietnam, Thailand, India and Philippines where housing and everything are indeed a good deal less, not ust compared to America but to other places in Asia too. So it seems like this combo of rapid growth, low cost of living and a lot of business opportunity is the magic formula that's really attracting people in.
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