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Old 07-01-2016, 07:03 AM
 
Location: annandale, va & slidell, la
9,268 posts, read 4,268,975 times
Reputation: 8452

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Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
You have to choose. Democracy or extreme inequality. You can brag about being rich, but you are not truly rich unless you buy politicians to get favorable laws passed. And the worse inequality gets, the less power you get as well, unless you are a billionaire (which I doubt).
I chose to do what was best for me. It worked!
Now I'm going to round up some ice for my cooler and take my boat out the Chandeleur Islands and fish.
Meanwhile you can expend your precious life span on anger and envy.
Catch you later!
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:05 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,390,040 times
Reputation: 1715
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Do you deny that market fundamentalism leads to skyrocketing income and wealth inequality? Do you deny that wealth = power? Why would you support policies that leads to skyrocketing inequality and transfer of power into the hands of a tiny elite to steamroll over anyone else? Or do you think we dont need laws? Just saying "government is evil, everything will be fine if we shrink government" is a bad argument.
Yes I want to shrink the government. There are some specifics I definitely would like to do without.

However, I can't address which policies you are referring to in regards to wealth = power. Do I want to punish wealthy? No. I want a clear barrier installed between all interests, corporate, non-profit, religious and politicians to get money away from politicians.

What are some of the policies that worry you? For all I know, we may agree on them. But one shouldn't argue or debate a generality as it's just way too broad.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:05 AM
 
14,233 posts, read 5,932,076 times
Reputation: 6046
Quote:
Originally Posted by finalmove View Post
I chose to do what was best for me. It worked!
Now I'm going to round up some ice for my cooler and take my boat out the Chandeleur Islands and fish.
Meanwhile you can expend your precious life span on anger and envy.
Catch you later!
Joe Sixpack claiming to be rich again? This is pathetic.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:09 AM
 
Location: MS
4,396 posts, read 4,494,421 times
Reputation: 1555
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Do you deny that market fundamentalism leads to skyrocketing income and wealth inequality? Do you deny that wealth = power? Why would you support policies that leads to skyrocketing inequality and transfer of power into the hands of a tiny elite to steamroll over anyone else? Or do you think we dont need laws? Just saying "government is evil, everything will be fine if we shrink government" is a bad argument.
In the last couple of years automobile dealerships lobbied the state government in one of the Carolinas to write a law that stating that new cars had to be sold at a dealership. This was a direct attempt to keep Tesla from selling in their state.

Your stance on this is that government should make laws to help the little guys like Tesla (which is in fact not very "little".

Our stance is that government should not have the power to make a law barring entry into a market. That way the powerful lobby for the auto dealerships has no real power. They can't stop the sale of new cars over the internet and having them delivered to your door. That is progress and I can't wait until they offer 2nd day "prime" delivery.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:09 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,390,040 times
Reputation: 1715
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Joe Sixpack claiming to be rich again? This is pathetic.
Agh sportsman paradise!

Catch a speckled for me!
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:09 AM
 
14,233 posts, read 5,932,076 times
Reputation: 6046
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stymie13 View Post
Yes I want to shrink the government. There are some specifics I definitely would like to do without.

However, I can't address which policies you are referring to in regards to wealth = power. Do I want to punish wealthy? No. I want a clear barrier installed between all interests, corporate, non-profit, religious and politicians to get money away from politicians.

What are some of the policies that worry you? For all I know, we may agree on them. But one shouldn't argue or debate a generality as it's just way too broad.
So who will write the laws in your paradise where the wealthy have stupendous amounts of power? Do you think the average Joe like yourself will have a say in this? Or are you also claiming to be among the billionaire class like the poster above here?
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:12 AM
 
6,490 posts, read 3,907,074 times
Reputation: 4665
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stymie13 View Post
However, I can't address which policies you are referring to in regards to wealth = power. Do I want to punish wealthy? No. I want a clear barrier installed between all interests, corporate, non-profit, religious and politicians to get money away from politicians.
if you truly believe this, and believe the Citizen's United should be overturned, then Clinton is the clear right choice.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:13 AM
 
4,491 posts, read 1,967,253 times
Reputation: 1987
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stymie13 View Post
I'd contend every property owner, parent, student loan debtor, etc... Has loopholes.

Is the tax system unfair? You bet: for everyone.
Well, sure, but the scale isn't the same. A middle class homeowner who has a few kids and donates to the church might get some money back, but he probably doesn't have enough kids to pay $0 in income tax. If so, he should sue the condom company and get even more.

And certainly, no argument that our tax system is flawed. A goody and kind of stupid as Rand Paul's little commercial about putting the tax code in a wood chipper was, his point is one I agree with. The tax code should not need to be as long as it is. But even if their are complexities and 'loopholes' for people in all tax brackets, it remains nearly impossible to deny that people on the very top have a disproportionate amount of benefits when compared to every other tax bracket.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:13 AM
 
14,233 posts, read 5,932,076 times
Reputation: 6046
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert_J View Post
In the last couple of years automobile dealerships lobbied the state government in one of the Carolinas to write a law that stating that new cars had to be sold at a dealership. This was a direct attempt to keep Tesla from selling in their state.

Your stance on this is that government should make laws to help the little guys like Tesla (which is in fact not very "little".

Our stance is that government should not have the power to make a law barring entry into a market. That way the powerful lobby for the auto dealerships has no real power. They can't stop the sale of new cars over the internet and having them delivered to your door. That is progress and I can't wait until they offer 2nd day "prime" delivery.
This is just totally unrealistic. You are saying that in a society where the super rich can steamroll over anyone, we will just create a law that prevent their power from getting out of hand? How will this be done? Who controls the politicians, the donations? Who controls the judiciary in this society? Who controls the media? You have to choose, its either massive income and wealth inequality or democracy.
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Old 07-01-2016, 07:15 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,390,040 times
Reputation: 1715
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
So who will write the laws in your paradise where the wealthy have stupendous amounts of power? Do you think the average Joe like yourself will have a say in this? Or are you also claiming to be among the billionaire class like the poster above here?
I hate answering generalities.

Laws will continue to be written as they are today. With divorcing the money from politics, nothing changes. This isn't left right, it's money. That money is corporate, private, and non-profit based. Both parties are just as guilty as the other.

I see nothing from either side moving to reform anything. I'm an independent. I despise both left and right as uncompromising idealists without sound reasoning.

Some of my reforms will never happen, although it would divorce the lobbying sector from politics.
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