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Old 07-01-2016, 08:08 AM
 
Location: Boston, MA
13,630 posts, read 9,833,473 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by finalmove View Post
Anyone know what this rant is about?
I dunno, he's too smahht for me.
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:10 AM
 
2,851 posts, read 3,235,156 times
Reputation: 1194
Quote:
Originally Posted by skepticratic View Post
I'm not disagreeing that our tax code is severely flawed. Though let's be clear, you made it about politics. Not me.

Libertarians do have a pretty consistent view on what taxes should be. Democrats and Republicans seem a bit schizophrenic by contrast.
To be fair, I didn't mention political parties. Though we all know which side is which.

I agree on some of the libertarians viewpoints on taxation. I enjoyed the fact that many of the republicans were looking at streamlining the tax code or setting it as a flat tax (or near flat tax in the case of Trump) code. I also disagree with the numerous government backup plans to bail people out of their poor decisions both corporate and social welfare (WIC, EITC, Mortgage bailouts etc)
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:13 AM
 
14,224 posts, read 5,981,258 times
Reputation: 6051
Quote:
Originally Posted by skepticratic View Post
I don't necessarily agree with all of his points, but I have no choice, at an intellectual level, other than to disagree with you here.

At worst, what he suggested would do little to change anything. I feel it would overall, at least be an improvement from where we're currently at. You're free to argue that your plan is better, but to say that his would make things worse simply isn't true. Repealing income tax would benefit everyone. You could argue that it benefits the super right more, but given the number of loopholes they have, it might not benefit them that much more. Donald Trump's last public tax return shows that he paid nothing in federal income tax. Abolishing the 16th amendment would help me more than him, in that case. And while I think a bigger discussion would need to be had on this, he has proposed a plan to at least working to prevent the corruption you're referring to, dealing with repealing the 17th amendment. While I'm not totally on board, I don't think he's wrong to say this would help in that area.
How much of the federal income tax is paid by the rich?

He suggests that the people will have the power and ability to do all these great things to bring democracy back to the people, and ensure that an increase in wealth and power of the ultra wealthy does not translate into political power. Where is the historical evidence of this ever taking place?
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:16 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,407,631 times
Reputation: 1715
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
But you deny reality. It is PROVEN that your policies will sharply increase the wealth and power of the super rich. It is also proven that when wealth and income inequality gets out of hand, elites will ALWAYS form to hijack the political system for their own ends, and the voice of the people will be muzzled.
Then lay out a plan not state the obvious.

More money in individuals hands, and less in governments, empowers people, not 'elites'

What is an 'elite'? A millionaire? Billionaire? Need some specifics, not complaints.
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:18 AM
 
14,224 posts, read 5,981,258 times
Reputation: 6051
Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverBulletZ06 View Post
To be fair, I didn't mention political parties. Though we all know which side is which.

I agree on some of the libertarians viewpoints on taxation. I enjoyed the fact that many of the republicans were looking at streamlining the tax code or setting it as a flat tax (or near flat tax in the case of Trump) code. I also disagree with the numerous government backup plans to bail people out of their poor decisions both corporate and social welfare (WIC, EITC, Mortgage bailouts etc)
What are the historic consequences of eliminating social safety nets? Increased crime, fear, political instability and possible revolutions? What's so great about that? We can bemoan "poor life choices" all we want, but have you thought about the consequences of eliminating any realistic hope of decent survival for millions of people, who you would have to share country with?
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:19 AM
 
34,637 posts, read 19,108,038 times
Reputation: 22178
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
How much of the federal income tax is paid by the rich?

He suggests that the people will have the power and ability to do all these great things to bring democracy back to the people, and ensure that an increase in wealth and power of the ultra wealthy does not translate into political power. Where is the historical evidence of this ever taking place?
Capitalism is a system where the rich, who invest wisely, will continue to gain wealth. It's also a system that allows people with good ideas to start in a garage and become the wealthiest on the planet. Capitalism doesn't guarantee equal results, only equal opportunity.
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:22 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,407,631 times
Reputation: 1715
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
How much of the federal income tax is paid by the rich?

He suggests that the people will have the power and ability to do all these great things to bring democracy back to the people, and ensure that an increase in wealth and power of the ultra wealthy does not translate into political power. Where is the historical evidence of this ever taking place?
Since February 3rd, 1913, there is no evidence. That was both the advent of the IRS and when the Federal Reserve came into being.
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:22 AM
 
34,637 posts, read 19,108,038 times
Reputation: 22178
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
How much of the federal income tax is paid by the rich?
The rich pay much more than their fair share.

Top 20% of Earners Pay 84% of Income Tax - WSJ
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:24 AM
 
Location: louisville
4,754 posts, read 2,407,631 times
Reputation: 1715
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
What are the historic consequences of eliminating social safety nets? Increased crime, fear, political instability and possible revolutions? What's so great about that? We can bemoan "poor life choices" all we want, but have you thought about the consequences of eliminating any realistic hope of decent survival for millions of people, who you would have to share country with?
When has 1 safety net been eliminated? In my life, the ONLY restriction was the Clinton-congress compromise of welfare to work requirement. Which has since been undone.

Name one other social safety net decrease, ever?
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Old 07-01-2016, 08:25 AM
 
34,637 posts, read 19,108,038 times
Reputation: 22178
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stymie13 View Post
Since February 3rd, 1913, there is no evidence. That was both the advent of the IRS and when the Federal Reserve came into being.
I'd argue that government quantitative easing benefits the rich on Wall Street while hurting the middle class and poor.
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