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Old 07-20-2016, 11:09 AM
 
Location: London
12,275 posts, read 7,105,961 times
Reputation: 13660

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Return2FL View Post
Hunger is a great motivator. There's zero doubt that not getting food from government programs would put people back at their jobs. Welfare destroys the soul of a man. Rather than become a doctor or a lawyer or a garbage man, he can sit home on his PS4 and not have to worry about his next meal or how to pay the rent. He can have kids, lots of them, and know that the government will pick up the tab when he doesn't. It's very sad.

You mean all the zillions of unskilled jobs that aren't being automated, offshored, or taken by illegals who accept less than minimum wage?

...or rather than actually work, why not just steal food or rob someone? If they succeed they get money, if not, they get free room and board in jail. You think that people bumming around on a busted couch eating stale liquor store Cheetos has higher standards than that?

Even if they do, and wouldn't be normally inclined towards crime, every human will do what they have to do to survive. It's the instinctual drive to survive. Nobody will politely lie down to die in the nearest gutter. They'll find a way to meet their needs, but sucks for everyone else who might encounter them.

And I hope you know I was being sarcastic in the post you quoted. Throwing people to the wolves is not effective, as evidenced by the terrible lifestyles and poor health of Americans despite them knowing very well that they're on their own with getting and paying for treatment.
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Old 07-20-2016, 11:10 AM
 
16,212 posts, read 10,778,077 times
Reputation: 8442
Quote:
Originally Posted by 3~Shepherds View Post
You might be young.......when welfare was presented whites were embarrassed to sign up. Matter of fact, in the 70's I knew people who disowned their white family members for signing up on welfare. People were ashamed to be on food stamps......why do you think they came up with the EFT visa card, to keep welfare people from being embarrassed. Now its a honor to carry a EFT card and present it proudly.
You think black people weren't embarrassed to be on welfare.... It was not socially acceptable either in black families and many black families were ashamed of their relatives who used welare and food stamps. This reminds me of an episode of Chris Rock's show "Everybody Hates Chris" where his mom had some food stamps to buy groceries and some cash to pay the electric bill. A friend of the mother came up when she was about to pay for her groceries and the mom used the cash to pay because she didn't want to be embarrassed by her friend seeing her using foodstamps. This was a common mindset for black people when I was a kid. My mom was a teen mom who went on welfare after I was born and had foodstamps too and we were spoken negatively about for being poor and using those social welfare services.

I remember going to the "welfare office" with her. She HATED going! Her family spoke VERY negatively about her due to it and ostracized her to where she still has issues over 30 years later feeling that she is the "black sheep" of the family. (She got off of welfare, got a GED, went to college and started her own business over the years).
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Old 07-20-2016, 12:01 PM
 
Location: St Paul
7,713 posts, read 4,729,381 times
Reputation: 5007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Relaxx View Post
Please stop you're obsession with black people.

The out of wedlock birth for whites is is about 30%, for Latinos 53%, for Asians 17%, and for Native Americans it's 67%. Yet I hear no criticism of these other groups. These statistics could also mean that blacks tend to marry later than whites.

And no the Great Society did not cause high out of wedlock birthrates. It's not a black problem, it's a poverty problem.
Interesting that school suspensions/behavior, as well as the "education gap" mirror perfectly the traditional two parent household. Asians, then Whites, then Hispanics (who often have the additional challenge of wrestling with language issues) then Indians, then Blacks. If I wasn't so certain it was the fault of the "White Supremacist" school system & the racist White teachers, I'd almost think this was obviously a main reason behind the unequal achievement of poor Blacks.
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Old 07-20-2016, 12:39 PM
 
2,678 posts, read 1,693,771 times
Reputation: 1045
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quick Enough View Post
"Please stop you're obsession with black people."

What blacks can dish it out but, NOT take it?

MANY blacks have "obsessions" with white people , The National Association for the Advancement of Colored people, jess jacjson, al sharpton, obama, blm, etc. I could go on and on listing names and organizations.

"And no the Great Society did not cause high out of wedlock birthrates"

YEAS it did.

The new welfare state LBJ created allowed "single" mothers to get housing and other types of welfare NOT allotted to married couples.

You can ATTEMPT to IGNORE history and the facts but, it won't work.
Blacks do not have an obsession with Al sharpton or Jesse Jackson. And they do not view them as their "leaders." If you must know, many black people can think for themselves and think critically.

After slavery blacks just wanted to live off the land and earn money for their families the honest way. Slave marriages were not recognized by the law.

Black migration from the south to north changed the political landscape of African Americans. It's very obvious why some turned to social programs, lack of access to jobs, limited social mobility, very little opportunities for them. Also mass incarceration has an effect on black families as well.

I know the facts and I'm not ignoring history.
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Old 07-20-2016, 05:06 PM
 
56,990 posts, read 35,095,587 times
Reputation: 18824
Quote:
Originally Posted by chadgates View Post
I don't know anyone who lived during the Roman Empire, but I could write a pretty strong paper telling you many reasons which led to their fall and ultimate demise. Many of which would have been flat out denied by the Romans if I were to somehow be able to time travel and reason with them about it.

I don't know why this should be any different.
The Roman Empire?

The difference is that people who lived during that period aren't alive to tell you anything. There weren't any printing presses during that time, so even the best accounts are nothing more than conjecture based on events. But if we could actually talk to the Romans, I'm sure the conclusions would be far different.

Black people who were adults through the Great Society are STILL FRICKEN ALIVE! So there's no need to talk about us like animals at a zoo...especially when we're right here and speak an intelligible language.

But again, you'd actually have to know black people. And that's a huge hurdle for most of you.
Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
Ok, black person, what broke up the black family? I'm listening. Actually reading.

The black people I know have pretty stable families. I have to look at statistics instead of anecdoctal evidence.
It damn sure wasn't the welfare state. That conclusion doesn't even make sense.

Use your head...Geez.
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Old 07-20-2016, 05:12 PM
 
Location: Florida
33,507 posts, read 18,059,857 times
Reputation: 15498
Black father's don't marry their women. They leave the government to raise their babies. Very sad. Many black men can't find a job to even consider taking care of a family. The cost of living is very high today
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Old 07-20-2016, 11:03 PM
 
56,990 posts, read 35,095,587 times
Reputation: 18824
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova View Post
Black father's don't marry their women. They leave the government to raise their babies. Very sad. Many black men can't find a job to even consider taking care of a family. The cost of living is very high today
Wow. So enlightening..
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Old 07-21-2016, 05:58 AM
 
58,684 posts, read 27,030,609 times
Reputation: 14174
Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007 View Post
As shown within the OP, the out of wedlock birthrate for black people has always been higher than that of white Americans. However, today whites actually have one of the fastest growing rates, not black.

I am a black woman and I don't believe the welfare programs of the 1960s are the primary cause for single parenting or out of wedlock births.

As a previous posted noted, the stigma associated with divorce started to lessen in the 1960s (FWIW my grandparents actually divorced in the 1960s). The women's rights movement also grew which placed more emphasis on a woman pursuing other careers and activities in life beyond being barefoot, pregnant, and raising children.

IMO it was an entire cultural shift of the US and the world in general.

I will also mention that contrary to what many of you believe, a majority of black women in particular still get married and the vast majority of black children know their fathers. I was born out of wedlock and have always known my father. FWIW both sets of my grandparents divorced, maternal in the 1960s and paternal in the 1970s. Both of my parents as a result had a poor view of marriage based on being children of divorce. The idea of marriage being a given in our society just diminished during the 60s and 70s.

We should also note that prior to the implementation of the "Great Society" programs that a majority of black people lived in poverty and had very low rates of educational achievement. Today, even with out of wedlock births and single parents, crime rates are down, poverty is way down compared to that time (nearly a 180 degree turnaround), and educational achievement is up for black Americans.

So if you are going to "blame" these social welfare programs for less marriage in the black population, IMO you should also admit that lack of opportunity based on race from 1900-1970 was much more of a detriment to black people than the Great Society and the decrease in marriage rates of black Americans.
" out of wedlock birthrate.....However, today whites actually have one of the fastest growing rates, not black.'

PLEASE , if you are going to make claims , BACK THEM UP WITH DATA to support your claim.

Obviously, you did NOT look at the chart in post #22
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Old 07-21-2016, 01:45 PM
 
7,512 posts, read 11,323,254 times
Reputation: 3637
I think Black family breakdown has been affected more by decades of Blacks having higher unemployment and under employment numbers. Maintaining stable families is harder when you lack financial stability.


Quote:
The black-white unemployment gap appears to have emerged in the 1940s, according to a 1999 analysis of Census data. Although labor economists, sociologists and other researchers have offered many explanations for the persistent 2-to-1 gap — from the differing industrial distribution of black and white workers to a “skills gap” between them — there’s no consensus on causes. One 2011 working paper, after reviewing existing research on wage and unemployment differentials among blacks and whites, concluded that “none of the existing models of race discrimination in the labor market explains the major empirical regularities.”

Black unemployment rate is consistently twice that of whites | Pew Research Center

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Old 07-21-2016, 01:50 PM
 
4,040 posts, read 2,545,512 times
Reputation: 4010
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
The Roman Empire?

The difference is that people who lived during that period aren't alive to tell you anything. There weren't any printing presses during that time, so even the best accounts are nothing more than conjecture based on events. But if we could actually talk to the Romans, I'm sure the conclusions would be far different.

Black people who were adults through the Great Society are STILL FRICKEN ALIVE! So there's no need to talk about us like animals at a zoo...especially when we're right here and speak an intelligible language.

But again, you'd actually have to know black people. And that's a huge hurdle for most of you.


I know plenty of black folks. Mostly successful and respectable people.
I just don't know many of the "poor me I can't make it in this world cause the man" ones.
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