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The vast majority of people have no issues with paying for roads, schools, police, water systems, etc. The problem occurs when you force them to pay for bombs that aren't used to protect them, art they find offensive, sodas for people who don't work, medical care for people who are here illegally, weapons for other countries, jails to hold people who were found with a plant, police to visit massage parlours and strip clubs looking for prostitutes, sexual reassignment surgery for prisoners, etc.
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Originally Posted by whogo
You can actually have that without all the other things 51% of the population think are needed. The real solution is have government decentralized as much as possible. Of course, decentralization and socialism tend to clash.
It seems we're moving into the discussion of government's proper role and size - I was under the impression that the OP wanted to pretty much abandon the idea. Interesting debate, but perhaps off-topic?
Being bullied is no fun at all for anyone.
Some are scared to fight back against bullies that are much bigger than they are.
Some others don't give it a second thought, because they have been bullied their entire lives.
How, exactly, has the government bullied you, other than requiring you to follow laws passed by elected representatives?
<shrug> Stateless societies haven't fared better, have they? North Pakistan is certainly not under government control, but I don't think it's what you'd call free, either.
It seems we're moving into the discussion of government's proper role and size - I was under the impression that the OP wanted to pretty much abandon the idea. Interesting debate, but perhaps off-topic?
Valid point. I'll try to stay more on topic (following this post ).
<shrug> Stateless societies haven't fared better, have they? North Pakistan is certainly not under government control, but I don't think it's what you'd call free, either.
What about the non-aggression principle? Where can I find that?
I can see some humor in the fact that defying government went from the left to the right in a mere forty years or so. In the sixties many were arguing about the validity of the draft and ordered to die for a cause many didn't believe in. The people on the right of things were fond of saying "love it or leave it," and now we see the same sentiment being expressed with regard to those who for whatever reason have a difference of opinion from that of government and feel that government is "bullying" them, because government is the more powerful of the two.
Government IS too powerful, but--it's real boss, that class of powerful citizens who control government, has deemed it necessary to continue that control of power to the detriment of others. Rights: No you don't have any "natural rights," and worse, your granted rights aren't always held up as in the case of the Japanese interment camps, or Native peoples relegated to their "reservations." Then again, that was only affecting--"those people".
At seventy one I don't share the OP's sentiments for the fact that "our rights" have been ignored for centuries, yes, most are still recognized by the civil courts, but most of those whose rights are truly being trampled on aren't in the same socio/economic category as the OP, labor laws are ignored all the time, as are property laws (eminent domain) and the fact the many doing time in our jails have been denied the full protection of a "fair" trial. But again, that's just "those people's rights."
Most of these types of rights trampling aren't usually discussed by those who see these examples as either an annoyance or worse they are alright with the routine ignoring of someone's rights as long as their own pet peeves are addressed, i.e., gun rights, abortion rights etc. Innocence assumed until guilt is proven, a fundamental right we supposedly have, is all too often ignored by the IRS, many jurors, Judges, police, always to the detriment of those we imprison.
Bullies: yeah they're a real pain whether they be government or those who deem they're opinions as a kind of higher law. The Bundy's, and their cohorts of recent lawbreaker fame are typical of the type I'm referring to, their gun toting swaggering around little towns and menacing the locals with their brand of bellyaching about government bullies, all the while dressed in typical bully gear meant to intimidate and frighten their victims. So, if you're a bully, or supporting bullies like the Bundy's I'd strongly suggest leaving America for whatever land you may think is bully free.
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