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Old 08-23-2016, 04:14 PM
 
8,275 posts, read 7,967,216 times
Reputation: 12122

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
You are suggesting we overthrow the government because for some reason you dont like it, To overthrow current American government would involve millions like yourself taking up arms and i presume killing government employees, when you've killed enough government employees to your satisfaction for change you will then replace the dispatched government with What?Anarchy?
Sounds like a tough sell to most people who have jobs/family/house/nice car.etc
Bread and circuses. Our overlords count on the very thing you wrote, which is most people will tolerate poor governance and corruption so long as they have creature comforts. Most people probably don't even know about the corruption since their knowledge of government is whatever propaganda they halfway hear on the today show as they get ready for work.

 
Old 08-23-2016, 05:34 PM
 
Location: *
13,240 posts, read 4,945,717 times
Reputation: 3461
Quote:
Originally Posted by Misanthrope83 View Post
We hold these Truths to be self-evident, that all Men are … endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights…. That to secure these Rights, Governments are instituted among Men…. That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these Ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its Foundation on such Principles, and organizing its Powers in such Form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. … Mankind are more disposed to suffer, while Evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the Forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long Train of Abuses and Usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object, evinces a Design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their Right, it is their Duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Declaration of Independence (1776).


Anyone? I don't consider the CSA a change as it was merely setting up its own country.

We were given that right in our DOI but its never been done...why not? Surely MORE than enough people are tired of business as usual in DC and in our state capitals so what gives? Life still too cushy? Things are PERSONALLY bad enough yet? Do you think it will ever happen?
Long story short version: fear of the unknown.

Whine all you want (not you personally) however let's face it, those early designers had courage! & spirit & a streak of pragmatic anarchy.

Why not call for a 2nd Constitutional Convention. After all, the 1st one ended up creating a new government rather than fixing the existing one. Without firing a shot.
 
Old 08-23-2016, 05:35 PM
 
45,290 posts, read 26,541,776 times
Reputation: 25035
Stockholm syndrome.
 
Old 08-23-2016, 05:39 PM
 
Location: Toronto, ON
2,339 posts, read 2,076,743 times
Reputation: 1650
Every time an outlier candidate poses a thread to the status quo, those who have the most to lose change the rules. Simple. Effective. And nobody notices.
 
Old 08-23-2016, 06:05 PM
 
Location: Home is Where You Park It
23,856 posts, read 13,803,195 times
Reputation: 15483
Quote:
Originally Posted by Misanthrope83 View Post

We were given that right in our DOI but its never been done...why not? Surely MORE than enough people are tired of business as usual in DC and in our state capitals so what gives? Life still too cushy? Things are PERSONALLY bad enough yet? Do you think it will ever happen?
Your base assumption is erroneous.

Americans regularly change their head of state and their other elected officials. Seems like that's enough for most of us.

I'd never say never about anything, but it seems to me most Americans LIKE their form of government, no matter how much they dislike any given representative or policy of said government. The fighting is almost always about representatives and policies, not about the form. But the kind of revolution you seem to want would change the form.

I think most Americans would like to see Citizens United revisited and fixed by amendment. It's hardly worth throwing the baby out with the bathwater though.
 
Old 08-23-2016, 06:14 PM
 
Location: Los Angeles
14,361 posts, read 9,809,814 times
Reputation: 6663
Quote:
Originally Posted by jacqueg View Post
Your base assumption is erroneous.

Americans regularly change their head of state and their other elected officials. Seems like that's enough for most of us.

I'd never say never about anything, but it seems to me most Americans LIKE their form of government, no matter how much they dislike any given representative or policy of said government. The fighting is almost always about representatives and policies, not about the form. But the kind of revolution you seem to want would change the form.

I think most Americans would like to see Citizens United revisited and fixed by amendment. It's hardly worth throwing the baby out with the bathwater though.
The baby was thrown out long ago. Even though we're slowly being bled it's death by a thousand cuts.
 
Old 08-23-2016, 06:19 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
36,853 posts, read 17,417,491 times
Reputation: 14459
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGeekGuest View Post
Long story short version: fear of the unknown.

Whine all you want (not you personally) however let's face it, those early designers had courage! & spirit & a streak of pragmatic anarchy.

Why not call for a 2nd Constitutional Convention. After all, the 1st one ended up creating a new government rather than fixing the existing one. Without firing a shot.
Not only a fear of the unknown but a complete inability to believe that personal morals could possibly translate into societal morals thru cooperation/contracts/and non-aggression.

How someone can live their entire lives in private against theft, robbery, murder, kidnapping, and other forms of aggression (as the vast majority of folks do) yet simply suspend those values on a macro level is something I'll never understand. It's astonishing.

It's why the statist is void of principle.
 
Old 08-23-2016, 06:59 PM
 
27 posts, read 18,958 times
Reputation: 35
Quote:
Originally Posted by Misanthrope83 View Post
Surely MORE than enough people are tired of business as usual in DC and in our state capitals so what gives? Life still too cushy? Things are PERSONALLY bad enough yet? Do you think it will ever happen?

Blame it on those pesky Hyksos folks!
 
Old 08-24-2016, 05:21 AM
 
35,309 posts, read 52,417,008 times
Reputation: 31001
Quote:
Originally Posted by War Beagle View Post
Bread and circuses. Our overlords count on the very thing you wrote, which is most people will tolerate poor governance and corruption so long as they have creature comforts. Most people probably don't even know about the corruption since their knowledge of government is whatever propaganda they halfway hear on the today show as they get ready for work.
For some one with a good job/family/house and all the toys maybe things arent as bad as you claim and maybe its you who is falling for the bogus propaganda. I've always assumed there is some level of corruption in government and that politicians have a tendency to play loose with the truth but that said i'm not about to cash in my comfortable life take up arms against the government and risk the death of millions and the resultant anarchy because righties arent happy in their perceived continual sky is falling world.
 
Old 08-24-2016, 05:37 AM
 
Location: Port Charlotte, FL - Dallas, PA
5,181 posts, read 4,967,219 times
Reputation: 5105
Division, complacency, distraction. Take your pick (you may choose up to three). Feel free to add more.
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