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Old 09-18-2016, 07:27 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,642 posts, read 26,374,838 times
Reputation: 12648

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Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
Trade deficits do not matter. Our trade partners do not just keep green pieces of paper. They finance our national debt, invest here in the USA where they provide Americans with jobs and help ensure the dollar remains the world's reserve currency.


When I get work done on my home I bid it out. I usually go with the cheapest bid.


The purpose of work is to produce goods, not jobs. I guess we should outlaw technological improvements that reduce jobs also.


If all we want is jobs we can pay people to dig holes and pay other people to fill them up.


Small government protectionist is an oxymoron.


"I would say to every nation on earth, by treaty, your people shall trade freely with us, and ours with you." Thomas Jefferson


Just a note, by and large nations do not buy goods, people do.


friedman defense of free trade - Bing video




You should learn the difference between income and wealth creation.
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Old 09-18-2016, 07:29 PM
 
Location: Houston
26,979 posts, read 15,886,908 times
Reputation: 11259
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kode View Post
That is an artificial contrived and speculative matter. Reality is much different and your scenario has no bearing on reality.
Actually it reflects reality. The consumer always suffers more than labor gains. Always.


My link afterwards showed the great benefit of NAFTA to America.
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Old 09-18-2016, 07:42 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
1,050 posts, read 505,593 times
Reputation: 296
Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
https://www.thebalance.com/advantages-of-nafta-3306271

My link afterwards showed the great benefit of NAFTA to America.
Ok. What were those "great benefits"?

1. "Quadrupled Trade"
(Didn’t help me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

2. "Lowered Prices". Lower tariffs also reduced import prices.
(profitted businesses but it wasn’t passed on to me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

3. "Increased Economic Growth"
NAFTA boosted U.S. economic growth by as much as .5% a year. The sectors that benefited the most were agriculture, automobiles, and services.
(profitted businesses but it wasn’t passed on to me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

4. Created Jobs
(How many were lost due to off-shoring?)

5. "Increased Foreign Direct Investment"
This helps boost profits of U.S. businesses by giving them more opportunities to develop, and markets to explore.
(Didn’t help me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

6. "Reduced Government Spending"
(How much was saved?)


Not much "great benefit" there.
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Old 09-18-2016, 07:44 PM
 
Location: Houston
26,979 posts, read 15,886,908 times
Reputation: 11259
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
You should learn the difference between income and wealth creation.
Please, if you had even a sophomoric grasp of economics you would not be a protectionist.
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Old 09-18-2016, 07:50 PM
 
Location: Houston
26,979 posts, read 15,886,908 times
Reputation: 11259
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kode View Post
Ok. What were those "great benefits"?

1. "Quadrupled Trade"
(Didn’t help me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

2. "Lowered Prices". Lower tariffs also reduced import prices.
(profitted businesses but it wasn’t passed on to me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

3. "Increased Economic Growth"
NAFTA boosted U.S. economic growth by as much as .5% a year. The sectors that benefited the most were agriculture, automobiles, and services.
(profitted businesses but it wasn’t passed on to me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

4. Created Jobs
(How many were lost due to off-shoring?)

5. "Increased Foreign Direct Investment"
This helps boost profits of U.S. businesses by giving them more opportunities to develop, and markets to explore.
(Didn’t help me. Helped multinational mega-corporations.)

6. "Reduced Government Spending"
(How much was saved?)


Not much "great benefit" there.

#1 helped millions. Sorry if you got left out.
#2 Lower costs are always mostly passed on to the consumer.
#3 People work for businesses. If you have lived in a cave eating raw bats the last 20 years it probably has not helped you.
#4 I will have to look that up. Tens of thousands more jobs were saved or created than outsourced.
#5 We all benefit from capital investments.
#6 Given we have to pay interest on our debt one hell of a lot.


Let me add #7 Supports the dollar remaining the world's reserve currency.
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Old 09-18-2016, 08:41 PM
 
34,053 posts, read 17,064,521 times
Reputation: 17212
Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
Please, they sold overpriced crap.


The fact is consumers benefit for more than labor suffers (if labor suffers any at all) from the liberalized trade agreements. Not to even take into account the advantages we receive from running trade deficits.


Even the worst trade agreements tend to be a win/win as long as they promote trade.


Okay, I need to get in my Acura and head to Walmart.


The purpose of work is to produce goods, not jobs.

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Old 09-18-2016, 08:42 PM
 
Location: The Republic of Texas
78,863 posts, read 46,617,602 times
Reputation: 18521
Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
Majored in economics. Tariffs never help. There are times where other factors overcome the recessionary effect of tariffs.

We never had the taxes and regulatory overhead we have today... Not to the extent as today.
They worked well from 1919- smoot hawley(which went way too far)
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Old 09-18-2016, 09:07 PM
 
Location: Houston
26,979 posts, read 15,886,908 times
Reputation: 11259
Quote:
Originally Posted by BentBow View Post
We never had the taxes and regulatory overhead we have today... Not to the extent as today.
They worked well from 1919- smoot hawley(which went way too far)
No, they harmed us even then. Just not enough to offset the industrial revolution.


Everyone sees a factory shut down. They do not see jobs created due to exports or understand that lower prices benefit consumers who then buy other goods and services.
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Old 09-18-2016, 09:16 PM
 
Location: Portland, Oregon
1,050 posts, read 505,593 times
Reputation: 296
Quote:
Originally Posted by whogo View Post
#1 helped millions. Sorry if you got left out.
Not true.

Quote:
#2 Lower costs are always mostly passed on to the consumer.
ABSOLUTELY not true !

Quote:
#3 People work for businesses. If you have lived in a cave eating raw bats the last 20 years it probably has not helped you.
Irrelevant. Haven't you heard? Workers' wages have declined over the last 20 years when adjusted for a very small inflation rate. Incomes of the top 10% have increased producing unprecedented income disparity. Your "trickle-down" theory has proven itself wrong.

Quote:
#4 I will have to look that up. Tens of thousands more jobs were saved or created than outsourced.
So we don't have high unemployment? Is that why so many people hold two jobs?

Quote:
#5 We all benefit from capital investments.
Not true.

Quote:
#6 Given we have to pay interest on our debt one hell of a lot.
Then why hasn't government spending declined?

You're spewing the corporate line.
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