Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Status:
"everybody getting reported now.."
(set 21 days ago)
Location: Pine Grove,AL
29,550 posts, read 16,536,658 times
Reputation: 6032
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88
I leave open the possibility that I very well could be wrong, but I don't believe that he has ever made the argument that rich people should voluntarily by paying more than they are legally required. Instead, he has constantly railed against the laws and the tax codes that allow them to pay so little, and the "stupid" politicians who write them, while being up front about the fact that he has used "the laws of the nation" to his own advantage.
top 1% have 19% in income, paying 38% in overall tax, that means they are paying as a group, 19%(double) what you believe they should
They're paying double their share of the income. Why? Why not just have them pay 19% of the federal income tax revenue to match their share of the income?
This whole argument seems stupid. But for sake of being bored here is his wiki
"The Trump Organization (formerly Elizabeth Trump & Son) is an American privately owned international conglomerate based in Trump Tower in Midtown Manhattan, New York City. It serves as the principal holding company for Donald Trump's business ventures and investments. It is owned and managed by Donald Trump, serving as chairman and CEO, and his three eldest children Donald Trump Jr., Ivanka Trump, and Eric Trump, serving as executive vice presidents.[5]
The Trump Organization has interests in real estate development, investing, brokerage, sales and marketing, and property management. The company owns, operates, invests, and develops residential real estate, hotels, resorts, residential towers, and golf courses in different countries, as well as owning several hundred thousand square feet (several hectares) of prime Manhattan real estate. It lists involvement in 515 subsidiaries and entities with 264 of them bearing Trump's name and another 54 including his initials.[11] With investments within the United States and globally, The Trump Organization spans a wide variety of industries including real estate, construction, hospitality, entertainment, book and magazine publishing, media, model management, retail, financial services, board game development, food and beverages, business education, online travel, airlines, helicopter air services and beauty pageants.[6][12] It owns a New York television production company that produces television programs including the reality television program, The Apprentice.[13] The company also engages in retailing, having at various times sold fashion apparel, jewelry and accessories, books, home furnishings, lighting products, bath textiles and accessories, bedding, home fragrance products, small leather goods, barware, steaks, chocolate bars, and bottled spring water.[14]
The Trump Organization has divested a number of properties that continue to bear the Trump name even though Trump no longer owns them. For example, in February 2016 it sold its stake in Trump Entertainment Resorts, which owns the Trump Taj Mahal, the Trump Plaza, and the Trump Marina casinos in Atlantic City, New Jersey.[15]"
Farther down it does say he licenses his name but these ventures are separate from what is listed above.
Status:
"everybody getting reported now.."
(set 21 days ago)
Location: Pine Grove,AL
29,550 posts, read 16,536,658 times
Reputation: 6032
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent
They're paying double their share of the income. Why? Why not just have them pay 19% of the federal income tax revenue to match their share of the income?
income tax is paying on a teir system that is why. And there are levels to that system so that someone who made 15,000 on a minimum way job doesnt have to pay so much.
with the system you are talking about, a minimum wage worker would be paying higher taxes as well.
if you believe that is fair, then fine, but I dont.
I said no such thing. We can agree to disagree without trying to demonize the other.
Quote:
Originally Posted by dsjj251
Both "way overpaying" and what is considered a fair share are opinions.
.
Philosophically, taxes are theft, plain and simple. It is someone taking something that you earned, under threat of force by the State. But, we can agree that while they may be a theft, taxes are also a necessity for a functioning society. So if we accept taxation as a society, than the object becomes to enforce this necessary theft equally, to all contributors, proportional to their income. That is what is fair. Everyone pays X%, and the rest is yours to keep. That is "doing your part", which is where we disagree.
You seem to believe that rich people should have to give more and more and more, under no justification other than they can afford it. How high a bracket is too high? 50%? 75%? 99%? Where do you draw the line and how do you justify that number? What criteria do you use to determine when the rich have paid their "fair share"? Because without justification, it is THEFT, and the lesson, reduced to it most simplistic form, is that it's ok to steal from anyone that can afford it.
income tax is paying on a teir system that is why.
So, if everyone already knows higher income earners are paying twice the percentage of their share of the income, why all the cries of "the rich aren't paying their fair share?"
That premise was a fallacy(as even you admitted so earlier),
It's not a fallacy, as there are many people out there criticizing the fact that Trump didn't pay more than the tax codes required of him. That's what they are criticizing him for.
Quote:
and I did already explain why and it isnt because he didnt pay taxes. it is because it shows he isnt all that great of a businessman.
Nice attempt at moving the goalposts. Sorry, but Trump is being criticized for the fact that he didn't pay taxes for 18 years, even though he was not required to.
Status:
"everybody getting reported now.."
(set 21 days ago)
Location: Pine Grove,AL
29,550 posts, read 16,536,658 times
Reputation: 6032
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88
Philosophically, taxes are theft, plain and simple. It is someone taking something that you earned, under threat of force by the State. But, we can agree that while they may be a theft, taxes are also a necessity for a functioning society. So if we accept taxation as a society, than the object becomes to enforce this necessary theft equally, to all contributors, proportional to their income. That is what is fair. Everyone pays X%, and the rest is yours to keep. That is "doing your part", which is where we disagree.
Philosophically, we disagre. I see taxes as a contractual obligation.
Quote:
You seem to believe that rich people should have to give more and more and more, under no justification other than they can afford it. How high a bracket is too high? 50%? 75%? 99%? Where do you draw the line and how do you justify that number? What criteria do you use to determine when the rich have paid their "fair share"? Because without justification, it is THEFT, and the lesson, reduced to it most simplistic form, is that it's ok to steal from anyone that can afford it.
just as you dont believe in no taxes as all, i dont believe in just taking to some random percentile. It is really that simple.
Originally Posted by dsjj251
its a moral argument that Trump himself has made though.
Trump never criticized the millionaires and billionaires for not paying more than they are, instead, he criticized the laws that allow them to pay what they do. People are criticizing for not paying taxes for 18 years, instead of criticizing the laws that said he didn't have to.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
