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Old 12-14-2016, 12:27 PM
 
Location: "Arlen" Texas
12,284 posts, read 2,969,609 times
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Ben Carson taught us you don't have to be smart to be a brain surgeon. Bill Gates is reminding us you don't have to be smart to be a computer geek.
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:41 PM
 
1,110 posts, read 672,441 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LS Jaun View Post
They mainly work for cheap, and that is the only advantage I have seen. As a Aerospace Engineer for a F500 company all of our American IT people were let go a decade ago and replaced by inferior Foreign workers who are impossible to understand. Anyone who has experience in dealing with offshore IT support can see the inadequacy of foreign IT support. We never had the problems with our American Computer support that we have today with our mostly Indian support.
Spot on. While the frequency is on a minor uptick, it's still rare that I have the pleasure of collaborating with an 'offshorian' who's on par with or exceeds my abilities in analysis, problem solving or innovation.

But, I will admit they do work tirelessly for (not necessarily smart hours) but for long hours. The smart hours come with assimilation into the IT culture they are joined with (and the higher the foreign worker population is, the more difficult it is for them to assimilate toward a different culture).

I think the hard work has much to do with the opportunities afforded to a foreign worker. In many cases these folks are transcending their castes (yeah, it still exists), and their hourly wage approximates what they'd earn in a month back home.

Consider your monthly wage. Now imagine that another country wants to bring you there, set you up in their corporate housing and pay you the equivalent of your monthly wage for every hour you're on the clock (because all in, it's less than they'd have to pay a qualified resident). Looking at it this way it's easier to understand why (on the surface) it works for both the host company and the foreign worker/ and not that which is not one of the two (clients, products, displaced domestic workers).
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:44 PM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
9,019 posts, read 14,293,297 times
Reputation: 11032
Quote:
Originally Posted by AKA Bubbleup View Post

But, I will admit they do work tirelessly for (not necessarily smart hours) but for long hours.
Oddly enough as someone moving to the US in a non-IT management role, I find most of the Americans that I've worked with over the past decade oddly obsessed with putting in time. Not really productive time, but just being present. That and not using available time off, aka. vacation, so they can put in more non-productive time.
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:47 PM
 
16,376 posts, read 22,490,585 times
Reputation: 14398
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan4 View Post
Jobs given to foreigners bc we can't do them.

People forget that convenient fact.

You are just saying that because you came in on an H1B. I am in tech (a software engineer) and have been in the field many years. I have worked in jobs alongside H1Bs and have been friends with H1Bs for many years. You know, and I know, that H1Bs often get jobs when there are qualified Americans that are able to do the work, have the required education and experience.

Yeah - we hear that same song and dance about not enough qualfied workers in America to do the job. It's not true in many cases. Along with qualified American citizens, there are hundreds of thousands of green card holders already in the US that can do(have education and needed experience that the job is requesting) those jobs too and H1Bs are chosen over them also.
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:51 PM
 
16,376 posts, read 22,490,585 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikeyyc View Post
Did he mean in the statesman way, or the shot in the head in Dallas way?

Good observation.
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:53 PM
 
5,472 posts, read 3,226,183 times
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Since Trump is the President Elect, I would want to think and hope that he does well... (at this point, I don't trust him and am not comfortable with his promoting the bigots and racist during campaigning and not with his silence, which is a form of promotion, as he does now. Then filling his cabinet with predominantly old white men and making sure they are either from the Millionaire group or Billionaire group or some angry General).

I don't think all the white people who voted for Trump are racist or bigots, I do think they basically only wanted to see a white man in office, because that is what they are use to seeing based on how they were groomed and taught. I don't think them to be hard core racist or even conscientiously aware that they are race influenced, but I do think it to be a form of race bias. The sadder part include their unwillingness to acknowledge such a bias within themselves.

There will not be a repeat of the 1940's as it relates to race for those who thirst for such, and the fact that equality must be the premise within society is a fact going forward in America. I do not think there will be a massive resurgence of business growth at the pace Trump tries to promote. As well I don't see Trump with a plan to clean up Industrial blight left behind for the past 3 decades which is massive in quantity and environmental concerns necessary to clean it up.

What I would prefer to see is Trump become to understand that if blacks and other ethnic groups don't advance and become economically uplifted equally in what ever it is he plans or promotes; then not only would he have failed; any of the white sector that he tries to uplift and not make it full circle for everyone, that too will fail.

I just don't see anything that supports the idea to trust that he will be fair, either racially or economically; and I think he will push for the wealthy to make 10's and 100's of Billions, while he will fight against the people making a decent wage that meets with the promoted image of American Standards. I just don't see him having concerns for the people at the bottom to that level of regard.

If people remember, John McCain said he would define the income level that divides the middle class from the rich as $5 million. . I say currently, the dynamics have changed tremendously, because the wealthy class "now" measure their money in the 100's of Millions, Billions and 10's of Billions. which puts the Middle Upper in the 10's of millions to the low 100's of millions; and the middle class, in the upper 100's of thousands, to the Millions, The lower Middle class, is more related to 120K to the Mid 100's of thousands,

The upper lower class is in the range from 40k to 80k, and sometimes that is two person income per house hold. The middle lower class is in the 40-85k likely two income family. Then the lower class fits at the 40K-50k and lower likely a two income family.

These are different dynamics, and it also is relative to the type of community people can qualify to live in. especially when one consider the price

If Trump could envisage American people living comparable to the Japanese, or some of the Nordic Regions, then he has a lot of work to do to change the income ranges of get us there. Truthfully, Americans across the board should have all been living at a higher generalized standard and upkeep quality many decades ago. Except Greed Destroyed Industry, along with the bigotry and racism, that was part of the mix in reasoning as to why Jobs were shipped away.

In America, when the wealthy are making 100's of Millions and Billions, Nominal wage has to fit within the $20 and work upwards, if people are expected to be able to buy a home, maintain it, pay for medical coverage, and patronize the system of merchants and consider to save even the minimal amount. So, when they whine about a $10-$15 min. wage, they are still short on what it will take to get American to the standards. If they can create a system where parental people don't have to do fast food jobs and such, then those jobs can go to youth, but that is not likely to happen, because we have seniors who have to go back to work, we have a mass of people trying to raise families on dollar store jobs. We are so short on Industrial Jobs, as well as every administrative system now, wants to use Web portals until administrative staffing is far less.
Big Firms that hire a lot of paper pushers, are finding that web based front and back end customers, are not provided much service assistance. systems use to have 3 promots, then maybe 5-6- now, between menu items there can be as many at 10 or more prompts within the switching system, which has eliminated equally as many jobs and support jobs within the chain of servicing.

Therefore, the question is, "what kind of Jobs is Trump trying to promote the creation of"?

What more crazy is when President Obama talked about Creating Jobs, the first thing Right Winger people said, was " Presidents don't create Jobs"... Then how is it all of a sudden a white male in position as President, and Republican are not only claiming the President Creates Jobs, they have become dependent on Trump to Create Jobs.

The flip flop of the Republican Mentality is a very big problem in America. We have at this time a mess, it is getting messy by the days, but there is no clear cut program as to what is pursued and how it is suppose to be frame up and what is it supple to look like in general perspective. Trump is unable to deliver a comprehensible plan to the people. All the people get is him" saying he is going to create jobs, and how great its going to be". Well, what the heck does that mean? Anyone can make such bold claims, but only those with a plan are likely to achieve such things. If he thinks the key is to "deregulate everything", that is nothing but a set up for calamity and disaster of epic measure in successive cycles.
It took American many Millions of dollars and a lot of lost lives to develop and implement the standards, that Trump just wants to dispense with. That is INSANE..... Even in finance, we know what laxed regulations brought us in the 2007-2008 Crash and left many millions of people homeless and broke along with jobless.

There simply has to be a plan and that plan needs to be explained and presented to the American People.

Trump has claimed he wants to Remake American... that's what it amounts to, and if that is the case, then present the image of what you are trying to do, and put forth the plan of how you think you can do it, and then show the people the benefit and challenges within the plan and what is the works that is required.

Unfortunately he is not able to do that, but, I give him somewhat of a slide by in that overall, because no president has been able to paint such a picture. The difference is, no other President has made the promises that Trump has more nor has any other one be so critical of American and made such a claim to change the nations. From the Military to the pre-school programs, to the roadways to the railways.

Thus, so, Trump is pushing a lot of smoke in the air, does he have plans of how to build something or just burning rags to make smoke.
This is not like building a sky scraper on a city block. This is a nation with many many many moving parts.

Then he has the audacity to claim he is too smart to read intelligent briefings. That itself is horrendous.

At this point, there is no blind trust in Trump... and certainly there is no blind following that many will submit themselves to. We saw a campaign that basically said nothing, more than a spin upon spin of criticizing the nation and every system within it and the people at any and all positions. And over and over, nothing more than "It's gonna be great", its a sales pitch when one has no product to pitch. He basically promoted himself, and people fell into it with blind devotion.

Therefore, I'm not saying he is a Kennedy, or a Roosevelt, I'm saying simply, I at this time don't trust him, and he has not shown any plan as to how anything he proposed is suppose to work and what it is expected and aimed to achieve.

As to (=/-) thoughts, these are some thoughts.

Last edited by Chance and Change; 12-14-2016 at 02:07 PM..
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:56 PM
 
34,619 posts, read 21,621,539 times
Reputation: 22232
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponderosa View Post
People need to stop the wishful thinking about Trump. All during the campaign and now into the transition people who should know better have been making excuses about him, saying he did not mean what he said, or trying to explain his bigotry, misogyny and other traits as an act. Even the Chinese were doing it this week. Wake up. Mr. Gates! He is every bit as bad as you fear.
I hope he meant what he said. I didn't vote for him because I don't believe he meant it.
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Old 12-14-2016, 01:05 PM
 
Location: Arizona
6,131 posts, read 7,988,699 times
Reputation: 8272
Quote:
Originally Posted by stan4 View Post
Jobs given to foreigners bc we can't do them.

People forget that convenient fact.
Nonsense. The jobs go to foreigners because they're willing to work for low wages and be taken advantage of to get to the US.
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Old 12-14-2016, 01:08 PM
 
Location: Hougary, Texberta
9,019 posts, read 14,293,297 times
Reputation: 11032
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnp292 View Post
Nonsense. The jobs go to foreigners because they're willing to work for low wages and be taken advantage of to get to the US.
You're misinformed. Requirements for H1 include matching pay.
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Old 12-14-2016, 01:09 PM
 
Location: Arizona
6,131 posts, read 7,988,699 times
Reputation: 8272
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nor Cal Wahine View Post
Yup. My husband is a senior engineer in high tech who interviews and hires engineers. He'd be delighted to hire more qualified homegrown engineers if only more had the education and qualifications to do the job. The visa holders hired have all the right stuff and earn their positions because we NEED them in order to survive and grow. Lib arts majors are plentiful but need not apply.
Could that possibly be because your husbands company has developed a reputation for being a shop filled with H1Bs and therefor no one else is willing to work there?
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