2007 our health care premiums were $ 3800, 2016 under Obamacare $ 10,500! Annual premium! (Brown, myths, cost)

[xray731]

Please research more on Universal Healthcare. If you google you'll find many European articles detailing the debt these countries have taken on, the inadequate care received by many folks - especially older and those with pre-existing conditions, the long wait times for services.

We had many wealthier Canadians come to ur office to receive treatment because the wait times in Canada were outrageous. They'd pay out of pocket for MRI's, knee and hip replacements because the waiting list for just exams was 6 months - surgery waits were longer. Unfortunately - only the wealthy could afford to get treatment in the US.

Even with an employer sponsored health care policy - our out of pocket has increased immeasurably. Should we have a medical situation - we would have to remortgage the house or dip into our 401 to pay the deductible. Not everyone has tens or hundreds of thousands to fall back on. From reading the forums - from retirement, politics, arts, ect.... we have many retirees here who have done well for themselves and are able to afford such a burden but my lower middle class family can't. We've done what was right, worked hard, paid our bills, got the kids through college, paid off the home - but there was little left to save and just one catastrophe could wipe us out and we'd lose everything we worked for. That is why reform is needed. But there has to be controls on costs from pharmaceuticals to testing to treatment.

[xray731]

Originally Posted by DUNNDFRNT

I agree, lets repeal and replace. You guys have every opportunity to come with a solution, 6 years of crying, if i saw my house was on fire even if i wasnt allowed to go in I would have the fire extinguisher ready for my opportunity, well this is it, lets go.

i tell you what my expectation is for now on, you guys should just post your idea for a new plan, then I will come on and criticize it. Lets do that for the next 4 years.

This is how I think this is going to play out. Trump just tossed out basically a small bomb to the health exchanges with his EO, now the republican controlled states will do their best to make whatever is left of the ACA unbearable, they are not going to touch it other than eat at what makes it somewhat sustainable once it can no longer support itself then it will be easy to tell the people "look it failed not our fault" they need to lower the bar of what people are going to compare the new plan to and they will.

#1 - Obama and the Democrats would not even consider anything the Republicans came up with so quit the you guys didn't come up with anything - there were many options presented and tabled so the Republicans never stood a chance to have a say.

#2 - The ACA and state exchanges have bombed. The program itself has failed and why so many insurance companies pulled out of it.

When will you see that the concept was a disaster waiting to happen from the start.

[DUNNDFRNT]

Originally Posted by xray731

#1 - Obama and the Democrats would not even consider anything the Republicans came up with so quit the you guys didn't come up with anything - there were many options presented and tabled so the Republicans never stood a chance to have a say.

#2 - The ACA and state exchanges have bombed. The program itself has failed and why so many insurance companies pulled out of it.

When will you see that the concept was a disaster waiting to happen from the start.

Fine. What's the hold up? Can we just dust off one of many Republican alternatives you speak of?

[PCALMike]

Originally Posted by xray731

Please research more on Universal Healthcare. If you google you'll find many European articles detailing the debt these countries have taken on, the inadequate care received by many folks - especially older and those with pre-existing conditions, the long wait times for services.

We had many wealthier Canadians come to ur office to receive treatment because the wait times in Canada were outrageous. They'd pay out of pocket for MRI's, knee and hip replacements because the waiting list for just exams was 6 months - surgery waits were longer. Unfortunately - only the wealthy could afford to get treatment in the US.

Even with an employer sponsored health care policy - our out of pocket has increased immeasurably. Should we have a medical situation - we would have to remortgage the house or dip into our 401 to pay the deductible. Not everyone has tens or hundreds of thousands to fall back on. From reading the forums - from retirement, politics, arts, ect.... we have many retirees here who have done well for themselves and are able to afford such a burden but my lower middle class family can't. We've done what was right, worked hard, paid our bills, got the kids through college, paid off the home - but there was little left to save and just one catastrophe could wipe us out and we'd lose everything we worked for. That is why reform is needed. But there has to be controls on costs from pharmaceuticals to testing to treatment.

The debt these countries have taken on? Single payer systems are much cheaper than the American system.

Articles about a system dont mean anything. You can always find news articles about any system having faults. People in these countries dont want to change their system into a privatized system where life or death depends on the wallet. Very few people go to America for treatment compared to Americans going abroad.

Medicare-for-all single payer is a no brainer for the 99%. Why do you hate Medicare so much? Most Americans really like it.

[gladhands]

It's odd that someone would be unwilling to tell us what countries they've lived in.

[bentlebee]

Originally Posted by PCALMike

The debt these countries have taken on? Single payer systems are much cheaper than the American system.

Articles about a system dont mean anything. You can always find news articles about any system having faults. People in these countries dont want to change their system into a privatized system where life or death depends on the wallet. Very few people go to America for treatment compared to Americans going abroad.

Medicare-for-all single payer is a no brainer for the 99%. Why do you hate Medicare so much? Most Americans really like it.

Taxes in Europe are through the roof to avoid the system to collapse. Meanwhile co-pay went up and coverage is less and less.

Especially with all the refugees flooding Europe who bring a lot of diseases and no money to be paid into the system but only using the system that is paid by the people who work in these countries.

That's aside from not ever hearing a person going to Europe for treatment that was successful and beneficial which added more people to follow to go to Europe for treatment.

Farrah Fawcett went when she was in her end stages of cancer and she passed away shortly thereafter and recently another European celebrity had his hopes set on the same clinic and passed away shortly thereafter. Not a real success story (unfortunately ).

I never heard of any American go for heart surgery or knee surgery to any of the European countries including Albania that you mentioned is the new baby of the bunch since 2014.

It is so great to have an expert on European countries to be the expert of the health care system in Europe.

[ottomobeale]

Originally Posted by bentlebee

We also had an increase in our deductible from $ 3000 to now a whopping $ 6000.-!

Obamacare was about a reduction of $ 2500 we should receive and we got zero as our premium never was higher so we never saw any relief.

Obama lied that we could keep our plan which we had to change approx. 1.5-2 years ago when we were told our plan was not in compliance with Obamacare and they would no longer be able to offer that plan.

In order to keep our premiums lower we chose to get a higher deductible as otherwise our premiums would be even higher.

I understand many Obama fans don't care as they either chose not to get health care or laugh at people being suckers for paying these high premiums.

I feel like a sucker for being played by Obama!

That is an important reason why I support Trump as he is the one who understood people like our family and the struggles to keep paying for health care and other things.

Interesting: Mine was $9600 in 2005-2006.
Mine is now $3200 with different employer. The guys in the shop limit it for me. Cant have them paying 100% of their pay for health insurance. My raise for the year was still paying $3200 a year with the increase in employer paid portion. (About 3% here in NJ. you heard about the high increase states but not the low ones.)

Guess mine disproves the OP. (Yes I know anecdotes are... anecdotes) And No, I NEVER voted for Obama.

[marino760]

So someone tell be why there can't be a national sales tax to pay for national healthcare in the U.S.? I'd much rather pay a 10 percent sales tax on buying goods and be covered for all medical care than what we have now and have had in the past. The wealthy buy more goods and more expensive goods thus would pay more accordingly and they wouldn't even feel the 10 percent tax. The middle class and working people would end up paying far less for medical care rather than having monthly premiums in the hundreds of dollars if not more. Price gouging insurance companies would be out of business.
Everyone would be covered no matter who you are. A 10 percent national sales tax would more than pay for this and not affect money taken out of your paycheck for income tax.
About the waiting time to see a doctor, well we have that now. I had to see a doctor about a foot injury. It wasn't something critical but I needed to see a doctor. I called my health provider and was given a list of doctors I could use covered by insurance. The waiting time to see one of the doctors was 3 weeks minimum. I had to go to urgent care instead because it couldn't wait that long.

[WaldoKitty]

Originally Posted by marino760

So someone tell be why there can't be a national sales tax to pay for national healthcare in the U.S.?....

Very easy answer. The federal government does not have the Constitutional authority.

There isn't a method available in the US Constitution for the US Government to impose a national sales tax.

The Income Tax ONLY became available 100 years ago with the 16th amendment. (which also began the conversion of the US economy from real money to the fiat money that has been used exclusively since 1971)

[PCALMike]

Originally Posted by bentlebee

Taxes in Europe are through the roof to avoid the system to collapse. Meanwhile co-pay went up and coverage is less and less.

Especially with all the refugees flooding Europe who bring a lot of diseases and no money to be paid into the system but only using the system that is paid by the people who work in these countries.

That's aside from not ever hearing a person going to Europe for treatment that was successful and beneficial which added more people to follow to go to Europe for treatment.

Farrah Fawcett went when she was in her end stages of cancer and she passed away shortly thereafter and recently another European celebrity had his hopes set on the same clinic and passed away shortly thereafter. Not a real success story (unfortunately ).

I never heard of any American go for heart surgery or knee surgery to any of the European countries including Albania that you mentioned is the new baby of the bunch since 2014.

It is so great to have an expert on European countries to be the expert of the health care system in Europe.

You dont even know that Europe is a continent. Albania has and will always be a part of Europe. The fact that you dont even know this just shows your ignorance. The idea that you're familiar with Europe is laughable.